Side Arm for Grizzly Country

[rammac]

I'm 64 years old, I spent 20+ years in the Marine Corps (I've done a lot of shooting), I've reloaded my own ammo for almost 50 years, I own a .454, a couple of .44 mags, and two 10mm pistols, and I live in SW Montana around quite a few bears.

I ended up switching between my .44mag and the 10mm depending on the situation. When I hike a lot I carry the 10mm, when I'm out for a short time I carry the .44mag, it's a weight issue, not my confidence in the performance of either pistol. The truth is that in a real bear attack you wont get more than a couple of rounds off and the faster I can put a follow up round where it needs to go is important, I doubt if I could get more than 3 good 10mm shots off in the same amount of time as I can get a 2 good .44 mag shots off - using heavy bear loads. But If I hit the right spot with either of those guns I'll survive, I might not go unscathed, but I'll survive.

 

[memtb]

Most grizzly attacks happen at a moments notice without time to react at all. You won't be in a situation that you're in a shootout with a griz and able to dump a magazine at him. A 10mm may be lighter and hold more rounds but given you may have time for one or two shots before it made contact, the heavier the better.

I have said this numerous times in these type of conversations. Few people can fathom the speed at which an "inspired" bear can move. Couple that with, the terrain in which it happens.....many encounters end with no shots fired! If I am only allowed one or two.....I want them to provide maximum effectiveness! memtb

 

[Mustang72]

Thanks Wlfdog. I need to order some to load for my 44 then try a few out on some big pigs. They may not be a bear but they will definitely give you a good idea of how a bullet will perform.

 

[Pdvdh]

I'll cite another real life brown bear charge-to-the-death attack where a 10mm would most certainly have resulted in failure, and death. Fortunately, the guy stopped the boar with a 454 Casull, loaded with 360gr hard cast lead bullets. Google search "Greg Brush bear attack". Happened in 2008, about 5 miles from my residence. Greg never had time to get the revolver to chest level. As soon as it cleared his waist holster, he started shooting (both hands on the revolver) from the hip, as the starving adult boar beared down on him from close range.
I know more than most on the details, other than Greg's close contacts, as Greg stopped in my brother's gun shop and shared his story.
He admits there was plenty of good fortune in stopping the boar, other than the fact he was equipped with sufficient power and penetration to break the spine, on his frontal shot. Deep penetration required to reach the spine, and then sever the spinal cord.
For the member that disliked lengthy posts, don't bother with the Greg Brush articles. They'll be much longer than my posts.
Here I am, one individual, and able to cite two incidents where 10mm semi-auto use would almost certainly have resulted in dead mauling victims, compared to substantially more potent loads from a revolver. Very little conjecture here. Both within 20 miles of my residence, in an area that was infested with brown bears for 20yrs. But whadda I know...?

This is why I always add, wish you well with the 10mm. Because there's a lotta wishful thinking going on there.

 

[VLD Pilot]

One thing I've noticed reading all the 10mm haters comments is that they are the voice for the big bore wheel guns. I think we've all established that the 10mm AND the Big Bore revolvers are both common bear defense sidearms. Regardless of who uses what, both seem to be the most popular used for bear protection. I've read several stories of defense using both and can't see where one choice is better than the other in all cases. Comes down to personal choice. One thing I have noticed in those users of the Big Bore revolvers is they have it because it's the Baddest of all pistols. Not because it's what they shoot the best or can land shots on target the fastest with most accuracy. It's just the fact that it's a Magnum and a big one. The other fact I see is, the shooters using pistols with less popularity of being the biggest and baddest are shooting much better and hitting targets faster and more accurately.( There is a minimum for bear protection IMO). What all this tells me is, there are way more guys shooting the 10mm and hitting there mark with many more bullets on target than those shooting the Bad *** Big Bore magnums. Find the right bullet for the job your using the gun for and find the gun you shoot the very best with and your the winner. Whatever that pistol is for you makes it the best choice. Most guys are lying to themselves about their choice and THATS a fact. But Hey, yours IS Bigger !!!

 

[bigngreen]

Of the guys I know who have actually been in an altercation, zero carry a 10mm anymore, 100% bought a big wheel gun afterwards, I don't know anyone who converted the other way after an altercation.

 

[Pdvdh]

Of the guys I know who have actually been in an altercation, zero carry a 10mm anymore, 100% bought a big wheel gun afterwards, I don't know anyone who converted the other way after an altercation.

If you encounter a big brown bear up close, the last thing you'll want in your mind is doubt about having enough bullet to gett'r done. Ginormous!

 

[Pdvdh]

One thing I've noticed reading all the 10mm haters comments is that they are the voice for the big bore wheel guns. I think we've all established that the 10mm AND the Big Bore revolvers are both common bear defense sidearms. Regardless of who uses what, both seem to be the most popular used for bear protection. I've read several stories of defense using both and can't see where one choice is better than the other in all cases. Comes down to personal choice. One thing I have noticed in those users of the Big Bore revolvers is they have it because it's the Baddest of all pistols. Not because it's what they shoot the best or can land shots on target the fastest with most accuracy. It's just the fact that it's a Magnum and a big one. The other fact I see is, the shooters using pistols with less popularity of being the biggest and baddest are shooting much better and hitting targets faster and more accurately.( There is a minimum for bear protection IMO). What all this tells me is, there are way more guys shooting the 10mm and hitting there mark with many more bullets on target than those shooting the Bad *** Big Bore magnums. Find the right bullet for the job your using the gun for and find the gun you shoot the very best with and your the winner. Whatever that pistol is for you makes it the best choice. Most guys are lying to themselves about their choice and THATS a fact. But Hey, yours IS Bigger !!!

Wish I could cite some 10mm experiences. Nobody I know carrying them in my area. I suspect that once they see the track of a 10-footer, or see the diameter of their dung, they're all persuaded more power would be a good thing. Just like Martha Stewart's "it's a good thing".

 

[Possum Cop]

I carry a 460 Roland with 240 grain FMJ flat nose at 1400 FPS in a Diamond D chest / stomach rig.

 

[VLD Pilot]

Well I've seen a couple big brown bears on hunts. Seen the steaming piles and tracks of 8-10' bears. It's not the size of the bear that kills you, it's just the bear. Sure big is intimidating but that's about all it is. I fear all bears when I'm in their back yards or kitchens, bedrooms or living rooms. They own that real estate and respect is necessary. With all that knowledge and fact, my choice won't change on what I shoot best and am most confident with. That may be what is on my headstone, I don't know. What I do know is, just because it's the biggest bore pistol with the baddest name, doesn't make it the most effective weapon to defend against an attack. What makes the most effective weapon (within reason obviously) is the one can be shot and hit the target the most in the 10 ring with effective bullets and enough power to get into the mother board. Period. It's really not a debate. Shot placement is King in all shot scenarios. Not sure where anyone doesn't get that fact. You may be an excellent wheel man gunner that can outshoot most with semi autos both in speed and accuracy but most cannot. For those that can, I applaud you and carry on. For those that are kidding yourselves, think about a better defense option for killer bears. Like maybe a long gun of some kind.

 

[epags]

Alaska! Aleutian Chain! Driving a pickup! Saw the butt of a Coastal brown bear digging for food. Drove close. Bear backs out and stands up..and up...and up. Put truck in reverse and drove like hell.

 

[D.Camilleri]

I'll cite another real life brown bear charge-to-the-death attack where a 10mm would most certainly have resulted in failure, and death. Fortunately, the guy stopped the boar with a 454 Casull, loaded with 360gr hard cast lead bullets. Google search "Greg Brush bear attack". Happened in 2008, about 5 miles from my residence. Greg never had time to get the revolver to chest level. As soon as it cleared his waist holster, he started shooting (both hands on the revolver) from the hip, as the starving adult boar beared down on him from close range.
I know more than most on the details, other than Greg's close contacts, as Greg stopped in my brother's gun shop and shared his story.
He admits there was plenty of good fortune in stopping the boar, other than the fact he was equipped with sufficient power and penetration to break the spine, on his frontal shot. Deep penetration required to reach the spine, and then sever the spinal cord.
For the member that disliked lengthy posts, don't bother with the Greg Brush articles. They'll be much longer than my posts.
Here I am, one individual, and able to cite two incidents where 10mm semi-auto use would almost certainly have resulted in dead mauling victims, compared to substantially more potent loads from a revolver. Very little conjecture here. Both within 20 miles of my residence, in an area that was infested with brown bears for 20yrs. But whadda I know...?

This is why I always add, wish you well with the 10mm. Because there's a lotta wishful thinking going on there.

So what you are trying to tell us is that we shouldn't be hunting the bear country of Alaska with a 6.5 anything either...................................................LOL

 

[rooster740]

As Bigngreen said it takes a fight with a fuzzy to figure a few things out!
Unlock the slide on that semi auto during the situation and you will re think your side arm!

 

[Pdvdh]

So what you are trying to tell us is that we shouldn't be hunting the bear country of Alaska with a 6.5 anything either...................................................LOL

Unless you're hunting cubs, leave the 6.5 Needmoors behind.