Bullet Construction vs Lethality

[DoneNOut]

I shoot a lot since it is a side business for me. My guns shoot well into the .3.4 day in day out. But all my personal guns are 9-10lb some 11 if its lapua. I do a 3 shot at 1000+ atleast 5 times before i call it a good load

Pics? I like pictures of such grandiose feats! Visual aid learner here.

 

[Barehandlineman11]

2 at 1050 one day 3 at 2100 second day… this is already a confirmed load was just shooting getting ready for moose hunt friday.
4 at 1315 this is all same gun over 30 degree swing all different days

Edit. I shoot a lot and some days are worse then others which is why i like to see it replicate. Im not a guy that gets one random 3 hole group and calls it wish my ocd would let me though. Probably saved me 50k in reloading equipment

 

[RockyMtnMT]

If today is like tomorrow, I might be able to pull this off in two days across a 1000y canyon, that is 1000 ft to the bottom. We have a spot that we shoot frequently across a canyon. I almost always take the first shot with no wind hold. Then adjust. Because I hardly ever know for sure what the wind is doing.

 

[Petey308]

What the heck. I can tell you, unequivocally, bullet material has everything to do with terminal performance. You can't score or broach an inferior raw material into working better than a superior material. You can only try to make the inferior material work better. It can't be machined to work as well as a superior raw material. I've tried. A mono shedding bullet is not equivalent every mono shedding bullet. How it sheds and what the retained shank is shaped like make a huge difference in terminal performance. Everything works good in gel. It is the most ideal media to test on. There is no substitute for animal testing to find a bullets weakness. Then figure out how to compensate for that. I'll stop there unless asked questions.

I agree. Bullet material does indeed have everything to do with terminal performance.

I suppose "superior" and "inferior" material would be a bit subjective and depend on the desired results and behavior of your bullet though.

If George used your material, for instance, and it made his petals shed, that would be inferior material for what his intent is with his bullet design.

I do understand different materials will alter how the desired behavior occurs. As in you had to find a very specific material to get your desired results. I'm sure George experienced a similar process finding the right material for his desired performance too. I'm sure the guys at Cutting Edge, Mark Dille of Apex Outdoors, Paul Hendrixson of Maker Bullets, the guys at Hornady, Barnes, Nosler, Bryan Litz when he helped design the Berger Solid, etc, etc, etc all had the same experience finding their materials to give them their desired performance too.

So maybe a discussion on which design and terminal behavior/performance produces the most lethality would be as entertaining lol.

It's a very personal preference, it would seem. Of course there's plenty of supporting evidence to substantiate many of the different claims too. I'd say due to that, you'd never come to a complete conclusion and clear winner.

To each their own may forever prevail.

 

[Barehandlineman11]

When im verifying a load past 1k i only do it first thing in morning. No wind i want gun to be perfect all other variables i play with, with a dialed gun.

 

[fordy]

I understand that you don't understand, it's OK. I provided data. You got emotional. That's fine I suppose.

You have failed to address the questions that were asked so does it need repeating & sorry to single you out but take your 15.5 in & put that in a perfect broadside elk @ whatever range you want yep totally get that as I was once a huge frangible fan but overtime yes once you've shot a few you see patterns & this is what becomes a problem not all the time yep totally get that but I guarantee it will if not to someone it will so then the animal moves from perfect broadside to quater to or quater away & im yet to include the different resistances this encounters

So maybe a better position is to look @ a pill that can still give a greate wound channel yet increase penetration length & a couple ways this can be done but if you close your mind off that helps no one & I'll leave you to your bingo raffle

No offence intended please clear your head
Cheers

 

[DoneNOut]

2 at 1050 one day 3 at 2100 second day… this is already a confirmed load was just shooting getting ready for moose hunt friday.
4 at 1315 this is all same gun over 30 degree swing all different days

Edit. I shoot a lot and some days are worse then others which is why i like to see it replicate. Im not a guy that gets one random 3 hole group and calls it wish my ocd would let me though. Probably saved me 50k in reloading equipment

2100yds?

 

[Barehandlineman11]

Correct

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I agree. Bullet material does indeed have everything to do with terminal performance.

I suppose "superior" and "inferior" material would be a bit subjective and depend on the desired results and behavior of your bullet though.

If George used your material, for instance, and it made his petals shed, that would be inferior material for what his intent is with his bullet design.

I do understand different materials will alter how the desired behavior occurs. As in you had to find a very specific material to get your desired results. I'm sure George experienced a similar process finding the right material for his desired performance too. I'm sure the guys at Cutting Edge, Mark Dille of Apex Outdoors, Paul Hendrixson of Maker Bullets, the guys at Hornady, Barnes, Nosler, Bryan Litz when he helped design the Berger Solid, etc, etc, etc all had the same experience finding their materials to give them their desired performance too.

So maybe a discussion on which design and terminal behavior/performance produces the most lethality would be as entertaining lol.

It's a very personal preference, it would seem. Of course there's plenty of supporting evidence to substantiate many of the different claims too. I'd say due to that, you'd never come to a complete conclusion and clear winner.

To each their own may forever prevail.

Who is George? The only real testing to me that matters is animal testing. I have had bullet designs that worked great in media. Thankfully we tested them in animals before we launched them in our website. They had great bc by the way. Our new bullet design was tested for a year on various animals around the world for terminal performance. Varying from 20lb animals to 2000lb animals, in all kinds of velocities and angles. Bone, no bone, and literally at least a thousand kills. After this and the adjustments made, we were comfortable launching the line.

I am glad to see that you are not as narrowly focused on highly frangible lead core bullets as the only quality bullet hunting bullet anymore. I will take your word that you are open minded. How is your collaboration with Nathan Foster and your book going? If I remember correctly @FEENIX is helping you with this? Looking forward to you guys getting this done. Best of luck.

 

[Barehandlineman11]

Man theres a lot of drama on here anymore lol. Im gonna give hammers another go with the new tip i dont care what bullet is called if itll perform. Terminal plus shoot small.

 

[DoneNOut]

Correct

With what rig?

 

[Barehandlineman11]

300 norma improved
250 a tip 92.5 h50 at 2978

 

[RockyMtnMT]

300 norma improved
250 a tip 92.5 h50 at 2978

What is the velocity of this combo at 2100y? That is fantastic shooting!

 

[Barehandlineman11]

2978 28" barrel
Conditions perfect, mirage wind at any speed would of opened it guaranteed.. but like i said i try to verify when conditions are perfect. Many times i shot 800-1000 just because conditions wont let me verify further snd i feel im wasting my time. Like now ill take it shoot any condition only way to get better.