Bullet Construction vs Lethality

[FEENIX]

What we would like to see is that when it comes to harvesting game, the Badlands Bulldozer is the best.

It's an excellent goal/objective for any company, but a tall order/claim, especially to competitors - they all claim they have the best or the magic bullet (no such thing) and should be the only choice (BS). I think your website says what your company is all about.

 

[ButterBean]

It's a delicate balance. I'm willing to pay a premium for high BC solids, but there is a limit. Approaching $1.50 per pill is probably at or beyond the limit for many, including me. High cost is likely one of the reasons so many folks are clinging to cup and core.

I haven't added it up but since I started reloading several years ago I'm shooting more than 1,000 rounds per year as I'm developing loads for different bullets in various rifles chambers and practicing at long range. Get's kind of pricey.

I mean no disrespect at all but you have an $8,000 dollar rifle for sale in the classifieds and $1.50 is too much to pay for the only part of the whole system that actually connects with the animals, once again no disrespect intended but I just dont get it

 

[JTH]

I mean no disrespect at all but yo have an $8,000 dollar rifle for sale in the classifieds and $1.50 is too much to pay for the only part of the whole system that actually connects with the animals, once again no disrespect intended but I just dont get it

None taken. I think the last batch of mono's I ordered was $1.23 per round. My point is, $1.50 is probably at the limit for me. When I can get other bullets at under $0.80 per round, paying $1.50 (an extra $0.70 per round) adds up quickly. Not a big deal if you don't shoot much but it adds up if you do. And when they're out the end of the barrel, they are gone. Rifles depreciate, but not that much.

 

[BEEMAN]

I'm almost at the limit as well for lathe turned copper bullets. Getting them to Canada is expensive. After the exchange rate and shipping I won't even say what my cost per bullet is. I definitely don't shoot targets after load development and drops are confirmed.

But as ButterBean mentioned, the cost of custom rifles, scopes, truck, fuel, lodging etc the bullet isn't going to be the end all cost to the hunt. The initial sting after placing an order for a few hundred bullets only hurts for a little while.

 

[nksmfamjp]

Wow! This thread has gone sideways.

There are like 5 pages dedicated to price of bullets….maybe a page dedicated to Hornady hate.

Where are the pages of details on what makes good bullet performance?

To me, great bullet performance is a bullet that between 3000 and 1600 fps can deliver complete penetration for all angles except maybe a Texas heart shot! To do this makers have to control how much expansion happens and make sure expansion does not slow the bullet excessively. Of course working at 1600 fps requires pretty low threshold expansion. Cup and core makers do this by expansion and dropping frontal bullet weight rather quick. Monos seem to do this a little better peeling back petals and breaking off while leaving petals in the wound cavity and letting the base exit.

I've had good success with narrow velocity ranges with cup n core bullets. Monos give a wider range, but is it enough wider? Is it worth the bc loss and the specialty twist ratets, longer free bore, etc??? Only you can decide.

 

[RichCoyle]

I mean no disrespect at all but yo have an $8,000 dollar rifle for sale in the classifieds and $1.50 is too much to pay for the only part of the whole system that actually connects with the animals, once again no disrespect intended but I just dont get it

I can certainly relate to having an expensive rifle and having to cut corners. I was able to get my custom when we sold three acres we purchased twenty years ago. I told Sue, "When the three acres sells, I'm getting a rifle first, then you get to pay bills with the rest. When I order bullets I hope there's enough money to pay for them.

 

[diggdugg70]

The first guy didn't say why. Maybe you will. Tell us why using copper bullets is not absolutely great.

No bullet is absolutely great, but why are coppers not absolutely great? Well their BC's are in the toilet and they're harder on barrels than lead is, they're more expensive than lead are, to some people copper solids don't work as well as lead and that could be due to them using to heavy of solid.

On the flip side TTSX's have been great for me an my buddy. Between me, him and his son we've got 23 animal 16 deer, 5 bears and two elk all but 2 dropped where they stood. One Mule deer was shooter error and one bear was shot while he was running down hill, the bear was hit in the but had momentum and finally balled up about 50yds from where he was hit, the deer didn't go very far maybe 10 to 15yds. And yardage ranges from 100 as far as 720 being the furthest kill on a mule deer. Here's a pic of the exit hole from the deer at 720yds, 300wsm and 150 ttsx with a muzzle velocity of 3400fps, he said the rock behind it was painted red with blood. So the ttsx's work for us.

 

[RichCoyle]

digg,
That's what I used before I switched to Hammers.

 

[Huntnpack]

Wow! This thread has gone sideways.

There are like 5 pages dedicated to price of bullets….maybe a page dedicated to Hornady hate.

Where are the pages of details on what makes good bullet performance?

^^^. Agree. The thread seems to be about a product comparison & manufacturing marketing
Evaluation or Re-Evaluation, and one's position in the market place.

Competition is stiff !!

A Manufacturer may provide their "Best Product" to market by some or all of the following:

Superior Product Design, Quality, & Material.
Proven field tested function, & reliability.

Along with Value added service's.
Product availability, Prompt Customer service, support, & delivery.

Quality packaging, Marketing,
Customer satisfaction guarantees etc.

Priced accordingly to what is offered,
All sell at a price point according to what is provided by the manufacturer.

The consumer will decide what is the "Best Product" & Value for their Dollar.

Good Luck.

 

[Petey308]

The thread seems to be about a product comparison & manufacturing marketing
Evaluation or Re-Evaluation, and one's position in the market place.

Agreed. It's always interesting to me though what surfaces to the top in threads like this.

 

[ButterBean]

No bullet is absolutely great, but why are coppers not absolutely great? Well their BC's are in the toilet and they're harder on barrels than lead is, they're more expensive than lead are, to some people copper solids don't work as well as lead and that could be due to them using to heavy of solid.

On the flip side TTSX's have been great for me an my buddy. Between me, him and his son we've got 23 animal 16 deer, 5 bears and two elk all but 2 dropped where they stood. One Mule deer was shooter error and one bear was shot while he was running down hill, the bear was hit in the but had momentum and finally balled up about 50yds from where he was hit, the deer didn't go very far maybe 10 to 15yds. And yardage ranges from 100 as far as 720 being the furthest kill on a mule deer. Here's a pic of the exit hole from the deer at 720yds, 300wsm and 150 ttsx with a muzzle velocity of 3400fps, he said the rock behind it was painted red with blood. So the ttsx's work for us.

 

[Pdvdh]

No bullet is absolutely great, but why are coppers not absolutely great?

On the flip side TTSX's have been great for me an my buddy. So the ttsx's work for us.

So much talk about there's no perfect bullet and there never will be... perfect hunting bullets exist now. The best of the currently available bullets based on budget, regulatory framework, type of hunting and shot distances, adequate precision, BC value sufficient to maintain minimum required expansion velocity, tolerable meat destruction upon impact..., i.e. best suit MY personal uses and preferences.

So I have my perfect, suitable, lethal bullets. Often, two different bullets are loaded and carried on my hunts. One perfect for charging bear. One perfect for distant game.

My current hunting bullets for LRH of large game (past 6-7 seasons) are lathe-turned and tipped copper monos. BC values of copper monos needed to improve for my hunting. When they did, I could use them. Perfect for me could be butt-ugly for you...

The marketplace of bullet choices does evolve over time. I participate to keep pace with the current available selection of hunting bullets. Equip and acquaint myself with knowledge and understanding to make my decision: which bullets are perfect - today.

 

[Noobie]

The Bulldozer shown in the pic will fit comfortably in a short action 308 mag at 2.950 COAL and out penetrate 180 gr lead core bullets, shooting flatter and penetrating much deeper than heavier lead core bullets. The whole notion that you need a heavy copper bullet to equal the performance of a heavy lead core is not true. The light for caliber bullets will work as well or better. The BC on the 308 BD2 150 gr is higher than the Sierra 175 gr Match King and can be launched at higher MVs

I didn't realize you could get similar performance from a lighter bullet. Really interested in your .338 super BD2. I see the 250gr Super BD2 with a very impressive G7 BC of .410. My .338 is a wildcat, but it can handle bullet protrusion from the case mouth of .75". Will that fit in my rifle?
Edit: That would be sweet! If not, what would be the heaviest BD2 that would fit? Thanks!

 

[Petey308]

So much talk about there's no perfect bullet and there never will be... perfect hunting bullets exist now. The best of the currently available bullets based on budget, regulatory framework, type of hunting and shot distances, adequate precision, BC value sufficient to maintain minimum required expansion velocity, tolerable meat destruction upon impact..., i.e. best suit MY personal uses and preferences.

So I have my perfect, suitable, lethal bullets. Often, two different bullets are loaded and carried on my hunts. One perfect for charging bear. One perfect for distant game.

My current hunting bullets for LRH of large game (past 6-7 seasons) are lathe-turned and tipped copper monos. BC values of copper monos needed to improve for my hunting. When they did, I could use them. Perfect for me could be butt-ugly for you...

The marketplace of bullet choices does evolve over time. I participate to keep pace with the current available selection of hunting bullets. Equip and acquaint myself with knowledge and understanding to make my decision: which bullets are perfect - today.