Bullet Construction vs Lethality

[xsn10s]

I like this post, but still trying to connect it to the failure he tells about. Wouldn't the said tip problem result in a pencil-through rather than a splat? Various factors could have gone into that scenario. Coulda been a juicy June beetle that got in the way along the journey. Hah

I agree since he found many closed tips in that first box. It's really hard to say or second guess this one. With that much damage my guess would have been that was the exit and the bullet tumbled and then came apart. But who knows.

 

[bultinkle]

I'd love them to add a tip in the future but I don't see it happening.

Anybody got a bd2 gel test link?

 

[Pdvdh]

In907-250-7643

I agree since he found many closed tips in that first box. It's really hard to say or second guess this one. With that much damage my guess would have been that was the exit and the bullet tumbled and then came apart. But who knows.

You think he couldn't remember which side of the antelope was facing him when he aimed for the crease behind the front shoulder?

 

[xsn10s]

In907-250-7643

You think he couldn't remember which side of the antelope was facing him when he aimed for the crease behind the front shoulder?

I know I have remembered which way an animal was facing when I shot. I also know that studies on memory of events shows that memory can fail us. So like I said before "Who knows".

 

[Petey308]

Except all the bloodshot tissue on impact side...

Initial impact can cause that, yet still pencil afterwards. I've seen it before. And in a later post I mentioned it also may have necked over and veered out of the shoulder before penetrating through the ribcage. I also said it's an anomaly and we may never know what truly happened, but it's a good example to consider and think about nonetheless.

 

[Petey308]

In907-250-7643

You think he couldn't remember which side of the antelope was facing him when he aimed for the crease behind the front shoulder?

I certainly did that just this last year lol. I have it in video to prove it lol. The wounding I saw tricked me into misremembering how the deer was standing when I shot her. I later figured out my error though and corrected it.

I'm not saying Ray did this. I'm only saying I have lol.

 

[Barehandlineman11]

Ive had the 300 otm pencil through on bulls if tips are not cleaned. Ive had 180 and 195 bergers exploded on impact. But had them perform like supposed too a lot. Ive never had 215 not respond like it's supposed too but im sure in time it will. I know guys have issues with the atips exploding mid flight. Mostly pushed too fast with too fast twist. Ive had two hammers have nose bend on impact with more twist then the advertised minimum. But ive done multiple guns with hammers that done very well in terminal performance. Not one was identical too the next on shot placements or distances or caliber so hard to say… all in all bullets will fail and they'll exceed. Ill be posting results. Ill order some badlands today throw them into the batch of gel testing.

 

[xsn10s]

Ive had the 300 otm pencil through on bulls if tips are not cleaned. Ive had 180 and 195 bergers exploded on impact. But had them perform like supposed too a lot. Ive never had 215 not respond like it's supposed too but im sure in time it will. I know guys have issues with the atips exploding mid flight. Mostly pushed too fast with too fast twist. Ive had two hammers have nose bend on impact with more twist then the advertised minimum. But ive done multiple guns with hammers that done very well in terminal performance. Not one was identical too the next on shot placements or distances or caliber so hard to say… all in all bullets will fail and they'll exceed. Ill be posting results. Ill order some badlands today throw them into the batch of gel testing.

Yup I can agree with all bullets can fail. Especially when pushed beyond their parameters. The thing FOR ME to note is how consistently they fail or succeed. And what their operating parameter should be held at.

 

[Barehandlineman11]

Ordered some .308 205 bulldozers i think them beside the 203 hammer hht be a good comparison. Same day same gel same gun same distances

 

[Pdvdh]

I certainly did that just this last year lol. I have it in video to prove it lol. The wounding I saw tricked me into misremembering how the deer was standing when I shot her. I later figured out my error though and corrected it.

I'm not saying Ray did this. I'm only saying I have lol.

Haha... Even so...,

these facts remain... the terribly bloodshot shoulder was the side he said he shot at. And if he remembered wrong, and it was the exit shoulder, why was the doe still alive enough to launch itself halfway into his Ranger? After a complete pass through of both shoulders. He did say the bloodshot shoulder was a complete loss. But never said anything about damage to the other shoulder.

Yeah, it boggles the mind. Incredulous. So we grasp at straws for any plausible explanation. Which is why I deem it the Granddaddy of all bullet failures.

 

[bultinkle]

I do find the total bloodshot splatter failure easier to wrap my head around than a blister being the only evidence of a 200 yard impact.

 

[Northkill]

I agree since he found many closed tips in that first box. It's really hard to say or second guess this one. With that much damage my guess would have been that was the exit and the bullet tumbled and then came apart. But who knows.

Yep, not enough data to waste too much time theorizing. But interesting, nonetheless. Maybe marginal stabilization and/or weird impact angle/bone angle, etc. I've had my share of good and disappointing experiences with that bullet type. And enough experience with inexplicable terminal results with almost any bullet that I won't question the story of a reliable guy. I still use them - just have a better understanding of the parameters for success. (I once killed a big doe with a hi-speed light 85 gr varmit frangible from a 25/06 that hit the shoulder and never penetrated the rib cage. Critter still died, but an awful mess.)

 

[xsn10s]

Yep, not enough data to waste too much time theorizing. But interesting, nonetheless. Maybe marginal stabilization and/or weird impact angle/bone angle, etc. I've had my share of good and disappointing experiences with that bullet type. And enough experience with inexplicable terminal results with almost any bullet that I won't question the story of a reliable guy. I still use them - just have a better understanding of the parameters for success. (I once killed a big doe with a hi-speed light 85 gr varmit frangible from a 25/06 that hit the shoulder and never penetrated the rib cage. Critter still died, but an awful mess.)

Yeah those were my thoughts also. And I agree I wouldn't question the story of a reliable guy either. My guess is a 338 would cause a person not to be able to see the impact so that doe could of turn just prior to impact. That could cause an angled impact and veer off. But who knows. I won't let that be the end all be all of his findings. The second box worked well so that would be the more accurate and consistent findings of that bullet's performance.

 

[Petey308]

Yep, not enough data to waste too much time theorizing. But interesting, nonetheless. Maybe marginal stabilization and/or weird impact angle/bone angle, etc. I've had my share of good and disappointing experiences with that bullet type. And enough experience with inexplicable terminal results with almost any bullet that I won't question the story of a reliable guy. I still use them - just have a better understanding of the parameters for success. (I once killed a big doe with a hi-speed light 85 gr varmit frangible from a 25/06 that hit the shoulder and never penetrated the rib cage. Critter still died, but an awful mess.)

Yeah. Not calling anyone a liar or anything similar. Just trying to find sensible explanations to hopefully learn what there is to learn from it. I think we probably have exceeded the potential by now with that particular story/example lol. At least with all the info we have.