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26 Nosler Wildcats

  • Thread starter Deleted member 46119
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Fred

What does QL predict for a 28 Nosler as to velocity of a 180 vs a 195 grain VLD bullet? In other words, how much less for the heavier bullet?
 
I have all the actions and barrels I need to do the project.

Factory barrels will be used for fire forming and basic testing. If they turn out to achieve the performance and accuracy goals, well then no need to change them. If the factory barrel does not achieve the accuracy goals but the performance goal of the caliber is met, well I'll just get a good quality barrel and fit it.

Mark V Alaskan in 338 WM to 338/26 Nosler
Turkish Mauser in 8x57Js to 323/26 Nosler
Mark V Weathermark 30-06 to 308/26 Nosler
Rem 700+7RM "special" barrel to 284/26 Nosler
Rem 700+270 win barrel to 277/26 Nosler

I may or may not make the larger than 338 versions but I have parts available if I do. The issue here is deciding on use, LR, DG or what.

P17 in 375 H&H AI to 375/26 Nosler
Mark V Synthetic in 300 Wby to all others.

Example a 458/26 Nosler would be more than a 458 Lott but less than a 460 Wby. If I, for the intended activity, I needed a round in that caliber for DG, I'd just go 460 Wby.

Long term everything will get a 26" barrel which I believe is part of the 26 in the original cartridge name.
 
I just checked QuickDesign for some numbers to compare to the 7STW.

The 3 things I think are significant to compare are shoulder angle, neck length and of course capacity.

The shoulder angle of the STW is ~25degrees and the Nosler is like the RUM, WSM, RSAUM, Dakota, Ruger and other 404 Jefferies based designs at ~35degrees.

In neck length the STW has IHMO the edge at ~.333 compared to the 284/26 Nosler's ~.273

Case capacity, per QuickDesign, is very close at ~100 for the STW vs. ~104 for the 284/26 Nosler. Of course these are not the real numbers so I consider then so close as to be the same.

My feelings on this.

With case capacity so close any differences come down to shoulder angle and neck length and how the charge reacts to the pressure shaping from the those. On the STW as I understand it, the longer powder column and narrower shoulder angle should shape the pressure wave well and help erosion. With the Nosler like other 35 degree shoulders the shaping of the pressure wave is different but of course actual use shows us that it works very well.

As far as I can determine the only actual differences are going to be belted or not and magazine length for shallow seated bullets like VLDs.

My question is based on all this talk of neck length and shoulder angle. It must be based on something. What do you expect from a few degree change one way or another that would affect performance as significantly as capacity?

If I owned Quick Load I would run the calculation myself. What is the effects of the shallowest shoulder angle it will take verses the steepest angle it will accept?
 
I apologize if it is not your intent but you come across as disirous of an aggressive argument or opportunity to point out some error or falacy in my project.
My question is based on all this talk of neck length and shoulder angle. It must be based on something. What do you expect from a few degree change one way or another that would affect performance as significantly as capacity?
I don't understand the "all this talk" narrative. Please clarify your intent.

Same with the "What do you expect ..." comment.
If I owned Quick Load I would run the calculation myself. What is the effects of the shallowest shoulder angle it will take verses the steepest angle it will accept?
Then buy QuickLoad and learn to use it properly. This project is my learning opportunity, I will share as I desire. While interesting the exploration of permutations of neck length, shoulder angle, burn path, heat transfer path, erosion caused etc. is well beyond the scope of my project.

As for my opinion on what will happen or what difference a "few degrees" will make, well it's my opinion. It's not necessarily based on data, that has been covered by Ackley, Litz, Weatherby and others far better than I can. This is my project and I can do it as I want.

If increasing the shoulder angle was a failed concept wildcaters would have stopped long ago.

If neck length had no influence on internal ballistics it would have evolves to a perfect standard long ago.

If the relationship between neck length and shoulder angle could have been expressed as a perfect formula it would have been deciphered long ago.

A good old ooh and ahh and a little wow I wish I was working on one of my own would go a long way toward a finding out what my thoughts and processes are.lightbulb

This is just good old fashioned show and tell. I don't need to prove anything just sharing. I'll prove plenty to myself if it functions atall, let alone as intended.
 
I accept your apology. I was curious of your work and had that question. It is not my intent to disparage your project in any way. I thought you meant the balistic differences in comparable cartidges were due to shoulder angles. Being able to manipulate pressure waves to extend throat life or possibly boost performance with neck lengths or shoulder angles is a great cause and thought you might have found something. I thought it was a simple question that based on your statements, thought you had the answer to. With QL I thought it was as simple as changing a value in a box and hitting calculate as easy as changing temperature or elevation in a balistic program. I guess I misinterpreted your statements.

To my knowledge no one including the people you listed has had anything more than opinions on that subject. I have studied most of their work. I was just trying to stay current and learn something. I'm sorry I don't have anything more significant to add.

I do believe wildcatting the 26 Nosler case to be a very worthy endeavor if for no other reason than to loose the belt on a true magnum performance platform. I look forward to your work
 
Well this is my first post ever, I'm not sure how it will go but I'm going to give it a try.

My new custom 48 Nosler rifle came in last Wednesday chambered in 26 Nosler with a 26 inch barrel. Nosler shipped 40 new brass casings but no load data. I intended to shoot 129 and 130 grain bullets. I reload a number of rounds just nothing really close to a 26. Any suggestions on where to start? My new scope will be in Friday and I would like to try it out Saturday.

Thanks in advance.
 
Well this is my first post ever, I'm not sure how it will go but I'm going to give it a try.

My new custom 48 Nosler rifle came in last Wednesday chambered in 26 Nosler with a 26 inch barrel. Nosler shipped 40 new brass casings but no load data. I intended to shoot 129 and 130 grain bullets. I reload a number of rounds just nothing really close to a 26. Any suggestions on where to start? My new scope will be in Friday and I would like to try it out Saturday.

Thanks in advance.
I'll send you a PM
 
Fred, thanks for the reply on the PM. I sent one back, I don't think it went though? I'm still trying to figure things out with this site. Can you let me know if you received my response.

Thanks
Mark Latham
 
Fred, thanks for the reply on the PM. I sent one back, I don't think it went though? I'm still trying to figure things out with this site. Can you let me know if you received my response.

Thanks
Mark Latham
It did not come through.

Click on my handle in and post in the thread, it will pop up a menu with "send private message"
 
Fred

What does QL predict for a 28 Nosler as to velocity of a 180 vs a 195 grain VLD bullet? In other words, how much less for the heavier bullet?
284/26 Nosler, Berger 180 VLD, COAL 3.615, bullet shank seating depth if .280, Reloader-33, 90.5 grns: 3037fps @ 56880 PSI

I don't know of a 195 VLD in .284. For the Matrix 190 VLD, he does not give the dimensions so I can only raise the weight of a 180 to 195 but leave all other dimensions the same.

284/26 Nosler, Fake 195 VLD, COAL fake 3.615, H870, 87.8 grns, 2917fps @ 56880 PSI

Jamming would change things a great deal.

I let QL pick the powders it thought were optimal. Of course faking a load calculations will get huge errors but...

So ~120fps at the same pressure but different powders.
 
I accept your apology. I was curious of your work and had that question
....
I do believe wildcatting the 26 Nosler case to be a very worthy endeavor if for no other reason than to loose the belt on a true magnum performance platform. I look forward to your work
Sorry to be defensive but things happen on the internet:D.

Been working on this shoulder angle vs. neck length thing for a while. I don't have a formula and it's all based on what has been said by others.

I like a 70degree / 35 degree shoulder instead of a 40 per Ackley. Don't know why, it just "feels" right and "looks" right.

When I get my lathe running there is a possibility of doing something. The most un-fun part is developing the protocols and dimensions. Of course I have to figure out the cost points as well.
 
284/26 Nosler, Berger 180 VLD, COAL 3.615, bullet shank seating depth if .280, Reloader-33, 90.5 grns: 3037fps @ 56880 PSI

I don't know of a 195 VLD in .284. For the Matrix 190 VLD, he does not give the dimensions so I can only raise the weight of a 180 to 195 but leave all other dimensions the same.

284/26 Nosler, Fake 195 VLD, COAL fake 3.615, H870, 87.8 grns, 2917fps @ 56880 PSI

Jamming would change things a great deal.

I let QL pick the powders it thought were optimal. Of course faking a load calculations will get huge errors but...

So ~120fps at the same pressure but different powders.

So, my 7mm STW is pushing a 180 Hybrid to 3,000 with only 71gr of IMR 7828 SSC with no pressure signs, and I could go higher...

So the 7mm Nosler is ballistically identical to the 7mm STW...But it's beltless and requires almost 20 more grains of powder for equal number efficiency.

Also, the initial tested BC (according to Berger) for the 7mm 195 VLD is G1 .794, and G7 is .406. Don't know if that helps your QL calc's, just figured I'd try to help.
 
This is an interesting topic as I have big plans of building a 27 Nosler on an M70 CRF Classic.

Hope to run some 175gr Matrix
 
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