Bullet Construction vs Lethality

[memtb]

Because they've fallen for the "lead is bad for the environment" scam and that's why. I never said going with copper was to save money I actually said the opposite.

I almost respectfully respond with …..that's total !

I for one starting using them in the early '90's, live in a state that doesn't require them, never intend to hunt in a state that does require them, and use cast bullet (a lead alloy for the less informed) in several handguns and rifles, shoot lead shot in my shotguns for game, have eaten and will continue to eat game harvested by lead or an alloy of lead!

I'm not buying the lead is bad for the environment ! For my hunting purposes from my hunting rifle…..they simply perform much better than a cup and core bullet! memtb

 

[RichCoyle]

Because they've fallen for the "lead is bad for the environment" scam and that's why. I never said going with copper was to save money I actually said the opposite.

I don't respectfully disagree. I switched because I don't want lead in my food.

 

[diggdugg70]

I don't respectfully disagree. I switched because I don't want lead in my food.

Honestly, how many times have you actually pulled a piece of lead out of a the meat you're eating? I remember watching my dad and his friend process a deer he shot with a cor-lokt and I don't recall them ever removing any pieces of lead from meat or removing any of while eating it. We've probably got more lead in stuff we eat and drink than you would have in a animal shot with a lead bullet....JS

 

[diggdugg70]

I almost respectfully respond with …..that's total !

I for one starting using them in the early '90's, live in a state that doesn't require them, never intend to hunt in a state that does require them, and use cast bullet (a lead alloy for the less informed) in several handguns and rifles, shoot lead shot in my shotguns for game, have eaten and will continue to eat game harvested by lead or an alloy of lead!

I'm not buying the lead is bad for the environment ! For my hunting purposes from my hunting rifle…..they simply perform much better than a cup and core bullet! memtb

Ive never hunted with a cup and core bullet like Berger, but have used the original Core Lokt not sure if it was a and core design bullet, but never had a issue them and we switched to Partitions when my dad started reloading. If I could I'd still take a Nosler Partition over any solid to hunt with, probably the best hunting bullet out there to about 500yds then the lack of higher BC's and a boat tail effect its ability past that.

 

[memtb]

Ive never hunted with a cup and core bullet like Berger, but have used the original Core Lokt not sure if it was a and core design bullet, but never had a issue them and we switched to Partitions when my dad started reloading. If I could I'd still take a Nosler Partition over any solid to hunt with, probably the best hunting bullet out there to about 500yds then the lack of higher BC's and a boat tail effect its ability past that.

I've had good success from a couple of different cup and core bullets. But none meet my expectations of maintaining a very high % of original weight at a near point blank (inside of 20 yards) with a mv of 3000 + fps. I do not intend to shoot them beyond the range at which they will reliably open! Simply put…..they serve me well!

For lower mv cartridges, I might consider the use of cup and cores….but not likely! memtb

 

[diggdugg70]

Exactly! Stick with what historically works for you and meets your satisfaction. Sometimes, despite the best effort in shot placement and right bullet choice, the game expires differently. Sadly, when this happens, people blame it on the bullet.

You're correct. I saw a lot of complaints on hunting groups in in california about solids. They blamed the bullet when in fact they chose the wrong weight in bullet with researching. I called Barnes because back then they were the only ones and they're like drop to a lighter weight for them to work like your lead bullet.

 

[Pdvdh]

Honestly, how many times have you actually pulled a piece of lead out of a the meat you're eating? I remember watching my dad and his friend process a deer he shot with a cor-lokt and I don't recall them ever removing any pieces of lead from meat or removing any of while eating it. We've probably got more lead in stuff we eat and drink than you would have in a animal shot with a lead bullet....JS

There's plenty of lead shards and flakes in game muscle shot with lead core fragmenting bullets.

Some brag about eating it. Evidently consider it seasoning.

I've already chewed into two (2) aluminum tips from Badlands Precision Bulldozer bullets. Somehow they made it thru my meat grinder. No broken teeth yet. But look and chew carefully!

I've also bit into copper petals over the years.

 

[diggdugg70]

I've had good success from a couple of different cup and core bullets. But none meet my expectations of maintaining a very high % of original weight at a near point blank (inside of 20 yards) with a mv of 3000 + fps. I do not intend to shoot them beyond the range at which they will reliably open! Simply put…..they serve me well!

For lower mv cartridges, I might consider the use of cup and cores….but not likely! memtb

Thats why IMO the partition is probably the best bullet for under a 500yds and especially up to the 300yd range, it's not gonna blow apart at ranges less than 100yds like what you're saying about a cup and core does. I hit a deer at 40yds with my 270win and a 110 ttsx and it made a mess out of him, he never moved. It separated the hide from the meat on the exit side from shock maybe IDK but there was a lot of blood between the meat and hide.

 

[diggdugg70]

There's plenty of lead shards and flakes in game muscle shot with lead core fragmenting bullets.

Some brag about eating it. Evidently consider it seasoning.

I've already chewed into two aluminum tips from Bulldozer bullets. Somehow they made it thru my meat grinder. No broken teeth yet. But look and chew carefully!

I've also bit into copper petals over the years.

I've never experienced that before, but also I've never known anyone personally experience it.

Thats a good thing you didn't break any teeth from that aluminum tip

 

[bultinkle]

for under a 500yds and especially up to the 300yd range, it's not gonna blow apart at ranges less than 100yds like what you're saying about a cup and core does

I think part of the big divide exists because we talk about bullet performance and failures based on distance instead of based on terminal velocity.

The difference in what you're asking a 168 grain berger let's say at 100 yards from a 308 vs 300 rum is radically different.

To me it makes sense why some have so much success with more frangible bullets compared to horror stories. If you're starting a "soft"/not bonded bullet at 2800 fps and using bc to retain that velocity to your impact you don't have the 3000-3300 fps issues that others may be having.

Most of the people I read enjoying/touting soft bullets are starting them @ or under 3k and using the heaviest versions of that bullet that will shoot well for them. Ie the SD difference of a 215 hybrid vs a 168 classic hunter. My own happiness with the 215 may be due to my mv being 2850

 

[nralifer]

The COAL of my .338 WC is 3.60 max for magazine feed. The case length is 2.825 max. Twist is 1:10. If your 250 gr super BD2 will fit, that would be great. If the ogive on the 250gr is .850, might have to go a bit smaller as I only have .750 to play with? That would be OK. Please let me know the heaviest BD2 that will fit. It looks like the 225 gr will do nicely.

I think you are right about the 225 gr. It will work. The others are too long if you want to use your magazine. With the 225 gr BD2 you can expect best in class penetration, and can kill anything in North America.

 

[Petey308]

I think part of the big divide exists because we talk about bullet performance and failures based on distance instead of based on terminal velocity.

The difference in what you're asking a 168 grain berger let's say at 100 yards from a 308 vs 300 rum is radically different.

To me it makes sense why some have so much success with more frangible bullets compared to horror stories. If you're starting a "soft"/not bonded bullet at 2800 fps and using bc to retain that velocity to your impact you don't have the 3000-3300 fps issues that others may be having.

Most of the people I read enjoying/touting soft bullets are starting them @ or under 3k and using the heaviest versions of that bullet that will shoot well for them. Ie the SD difference of a 215 hybrid vs a 168 classic hunter. My own happiness with the 215 may be due to my mv being 2850

All very valid and good points.

 

[nksmfamjp]

Are those of you getting metal in your food throwing blood shot meat out? I'm confused. I'll bet I've never cut close enough to the wound channel to eat metal.

I get using the whole animal, but…

Am I not understanding??

 

[Pdvdh]

Are those of you getting metal in your food throwing blood shot meat out? I'm confused. I'll bet I've never cut close enough to the wound channel to eat metal.

I get using the whole animal, but…

Am I not understanding??

Copper mono bullets don't bloodshed muscle nearly as much as fragmenting lead-core jacketed bullets.

But no, I don't eat lead or copper/aluminum on purpose. I trim away bullet damaged meat.