Long range HUNTING cartridges limitations

[Creedmoor shooter]

My dad just shot some 130 berger by ting vld out of his 22 in creed @ 2915 yesterday at . 4 moa. He bumped it up another .5 grain s to see if we can get 2950. That's the bullets he's using for deer this year so I'll get to finally see a berger in action

 

[ATH]

There are only two ways to more or less guarantee a bang-flop: 1) CNS, 2) destroy the shoulder to the front end is structurally unable to run.

Everything else, bullet or cartridge aside, a fast animal like a deer can cover an awful lot of ground on adrenaline and anaerobic metabolism in just a few seconds.

A number of years ago I shot a buck through the front at no more than 10 FEET with a muzzleloader and a 325gr FTX. The bullet liquified both lungs and the heart, and blew the liver apart too. It was recovered in a back ham. That deer still bolted 200 yards from the blast of noise and smoke in its face.

One of the nice things about long range hunting is the animals rarely know what happened. I've shot countless past 250 yards that through-and-through the lungs, and instead of bolting 100-200 yards until they run out of gas they pretty much stand there clueless until they tip over.

 

[codyadams]

What would you all say the limitations with this round is? Giving the shot was placed right.

Thanks in advance.

Sorry for how small and fuzzy the picture is. IF you need I can write it out.

file:///C:/Users/David/Pictures/30-06%20range%20card.html

I would limit my absolute max to where the bullets velocity dropped below 1600 fps, at least for a Berger style bullet. That appears to be about 1150 yards for that load. That is of course assuming the shooter and conditions make that shot capable.

 

[LongBomber]

One of the nice things about long range hunting is the animals rarely know what happened. I've shot countless past 250 yards that through-and-through the lungs, and instead of bolting 100-200 yards until they run out of gas they pretty much stand there clueless until they tip over.

This^
No animal is bullet proof, but bugle in an elk, so he comes in ready to fight and you will see why elk have legendary toughness. Poke one through both lungs without him even knowing you were there- totally different animal.

 

[NEMTHunter]

I would limit my absolute max to where the bullets velocity dropped below 1600 fps, at least for a Berger style bullet. That appears to be about 1150 yards for that load. That is of course assuming the shooter and conditions make that shot capable.

Thanks Cody. Not bad for a 30-06.

 

[Sammydog]

I'm new to the forum and have really loved reading your posts. I have hunted mule deer in Utah and Coloradofor the past 40 years. I started with a 30-06 with 150 gr factory loads,for a couple of years. I would whack em in the lungs and they'd run off 10 to a hundred yards and flop. Then I went to a 25-06, first with Win 90gr *** exp factory bullets. Inside of 200 yards that bullet would completely fragment. The other side of the ribs inside, looked like it'd been hit with a 12 ga. If the hit was past 200 yards, I'd get an exit the size of an oversized golf ball with a lot of purple jelly inside. The deer acted like they'd been hit in the head. I started hadloading and went to the old 100 gr Nosler Solid Base Boartail. Similar results. In 2000 I got my dream gun, a Browning 1885 single shot in a 7mm RM. my son in law has some farm land in central Utah. He put me in charge of doe depredation. We were culling out 8-12 deer a season. I was shooting a 140 gr Nosler Balistic Tip. I noticed that if I hit the deer a little high in the lungs and took out the scapula, the dee went down like they'd been pole axed. If I didn't hit any one other than rubs, they'd run off 15 to a hundred yards. This has proven to be the case consistently. A little high, through both lungs and it's like the hammer of Thor! Looking back to all of the bang flops I got with the 25-06, I have always tended to hit them a little high. I always seemed to over estimate the distance. Hence the pole axe effect. Just thought I'd chime in with my $.02 worth of experience. ---- Steve

 

[dana bodnar]

I hear you on the 25-06 I bought one about 6 years ago because my long rang gun is a 300-wm Savage and I started using it on these small White Tail hunts we have here in southern Arizona but way to much power for them. So I bought a 25-06 Savage the cheapest one you can buy 325.00 I worked up a nice load for it with re-loader 22 and a 115-g Berger VLD I ended up shooting 5 shot groups with it at 200 yards that would fit in the size of a nickle. I did put a Timney trigger and an older Ziess scope with MOA turrets on it one of the best nail drivers I'v ever seen and now I use it on everything here except elk. And I have good groups out to 700-yards I cant shoot it any futher because I run out of MOA on my scope. Load developement is the why this all happens and it really really makes me feel good at the shooting range when I hear the snickers when I pull out my cheap savage but I only hear silence when they hear the steel target ring at 700 yards.

 

[Sammydog]

Yah, The 25-06 is quite possibly the nearest perfect deer gun ever and with really manageable recoil. The fast velocity contributes to the idea that deer shot with them go down like they've been hit between the eyes by Paul Bunyan with the blunt end of his axe!!

 

[okie man]

Add 300-400fps to the same bullet out of a 257 weatherby and you have one of the best deer cartridges ever!

 

[MudRunner2005]

Add 300-400fps to the same bullet out of a 257 weatherby and you have one of the best deer cartridges ever!

That's a bit excessive... It's only about 250 fps max difference. The .25-06 Rem averages about 3,200 with a 115 grain bullet, and the .257 Wby with the same bullet will average around 3,450.

 

[okie man]

I could never get that kind of speed out of my 22" barreled 25/06! Maybe a custom job with a longer tube and some max loads it's possible . I was only getting 3000 average

 

[MudRunner2005]

I could never get that kind of speed out of my 22" barreled 25/06! Maybe a custom job with a longer tube and some max loads it's possible . I was only getting 3000 average

Yeah, that's about right for a 22" barrel, maybe slightly on the slower side. Some barrels are slower than others, some faster. I was comparing using equal 26" barrel lengths with the same powder (7828 SSC) and Berger 115 VLD's.

 

[dana bodnar]

Speed is good but accuracy is more important for long range hunting. I don't know if I would shoot a big Mule deer with my 2506 past 500 yards lighter bullets also slow down faster past 400 yards than heavier bullets do and they loose alot of energy really Quick and that is why they make the 300 win-mag I'am shooting a 212-g ELD-X at almost 3000 FPS but that is my Elk rifle the newer and heavier 7-mm magnum bullets are also making that cartage alot more versital than it was in the past.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Speed is good but accuracy is more important for long range hunting. I don't know if I would shoot a big Mule deer with my 2506 past 500 yards lighter bullets also slow down faster past 400 yards than heavier bullets do and they loose alot of energy really Quick and that is why they make the 300 win-mag I'am shooting a 212-g ELD-X at almost 3000 FPS but that is my Elk rifle the newer and heavier 7-mm magnum bullets are also making that cartage alot more versital than it was in the past.

No doubt about that. After about 600 yards, the .257 calibers (thanks to a lack of heavy high BC bullets) seem to really drop off the map. That's about as far as I'd see humanely shooting an animal with it. Now, if someone like Berger would make some 140-145 grain Elite Hunters for the .257, you could extend that much further.