Do larger calibers really compensate for bad shots?

[Wolf76]

Couple of points:
A double lung shot with a 22 LR will likely result in a lost animal. Make the same shot with a .308 and it's likely <20 yards to recover animal. Proves energy transfer makes a difference, even on a good shot.
When you watch the reaction of ballistic gel being shot, you quickly notice the effects of larger calibers. The energy (from large calibers/ velocities) throws the gel off the platforms and breaks the boards/ table it sat on, even though it made no contact. Take a typical 243, 6.5, etc and the gel moves, but no where near what the big guns do. Essentially, the larger calibers with solid velocities create a MUCH larger area of damage.
Getting back to the original question. On a gut shot, your odds of recovery increase because of the increased area of damage with larger calibers (all other things being equal).
Which would you rather have happen: 12 ga slug in the guts or a .243 at 50 yards?

 

[theodoreh]

I have seen this mentioned in several threads lately. My experience has been a gutshot animal with a 338 is just as bad as a gutshot animal with a 243. I am not convinced bigger calibers allow for a materially greater margin of error, especially if you are shooting a berger type bullet or one that expands well. What are y'alls thoughts?

Can you be more specific? Which bullet and impact velocity on which animal?

 

[memtb]

Hypothetical: You have saved for 10 years to go on your dream hunt for Elk. You have practiced over and over and can put a bullet within an inch of where you want it @400yds. It is the last day and you have hunted hard. The Elk of your dreams is 100yds away, quartering sharply away walking slowly and will be gone in seconds. To kill him you will have to place the bullet just missing the ham in the paunch headed toward the off shoulder. There are two guns laying in front of you. One is a 30-06 loaded with 180gr accubonds. They have a sectional density of .271 and a BC of .507. Handloaded MV is 2900. The other is a .375 Ruger loaded with 300gr accubonds with a SD of .305 and a BC of .485, MV 2700. Both are perfectly legit choices for elk. Which one would you choose for the shot? OR would you let him walk. Under these circumstances everyone I know would take the Ruger and kill him. Completely different if the hunter lived there and could hunt tomorrow. Most likely he would carry the '06 and wait for another day. I wouldn't want to clean the purposefully gut shot elk myself. But I am old...

I've attempted to use this logic (almost identical scenario) many times with those that profess to "only" taking the "perfect", broadside shot. To which, my gut response is

I live in elk country, and have passed on more elk, while hoping for the "big" one", than many hunters will ever see. IMO.....elk cartridges start at .300 caliber and up, using "premium " bullets recognized for their high weight retention. I have used the same cartridge and premium bullets since '90. I know that with my chosen combination that.....I can get to the vitals with a shot taken from "any" angle. I know that I, cannot/will not wait on the perfect shot on the "bull of a lifetime"! I "will not" put myself in that situation!

I know there are some that truly will "pass" on less than ideal shots, and I have high respect for them....but I suspect that number is pretty low! memtb

 

[laker]

Would you trust a Berger on a quartering away shot? I wouldn't.

You scenario makes sense on a broadside shot only

No problem with a quartering shot with a Berger for me

 

[laker]

Hypothetical: You have saved for 10 years to go on your dream hunt for Elk. You have practiced over and over and can put a bullet within an inch of where you want it @400yds. It is the last day and you have hunted hard. The Elk of your dreams is 100yds away, quartering sharply away walking slowly and will be gone in seconds. To kill him you will have to place the bullet just missing the ham in the paunch headed toward the off shoulder. There are two guns laying in front of you. One is a 30-06 loaded with 180gr accubonds. They have a sectional density of .271 and a BC of .507. Handloaded MV is 2900. The other is a .375 Ruger loaded with 300gr accubonds with a SD of .305 and a BC of .485, MV 2700. Both are perfectly legit choices for elk. Which one would you choose for the shot? OR would you let him walk. Under these circumstances everyone I know would take the Ruger and kill him. Completely different if the hunter lived there and could hunt tomorrow. Most likely he would carry the '06 and wait for another day. I wouldn't want to clean the purposefully gut shot elk myself. But I am old...

I'd hit him with either one

 

[Varmint Hunter]

Based on what I've read; I'd only take this shot with a Creedmoor.

 

[Don A Parsons]

I should of stayed with my 30/30... Ha

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Which would you rather have happen: 12 ga slug in the guts or a .243 at 50 yards?

Neither! J/k...If I am being honest - I shoot berger or eldms mostly in my rifles - I would rather have a berger or eldm out of a 243, I think the explosive expansion would increase the likelihood of recovery. If we are talking a 243 FMJ vs a 12 gauge slug, then sure, I would take the slug.

 

[Ingwe]

No problem with a quartering shot with a Berger for me

You sure about that?

You wouldn't be concerned about that explosive, non-bonded bullet penetrating the guts and bone that it would need to penetrate to reach the vitals on a quartering shot?

Respectfully, I think that you are fooling yourself and falling for the Berger "hype."

 

[Hand Skills]

I agree with the high BC compensating for wind - but those can be had in almost every caliber - 6.5 147 ELDM for example is right close to that .7 mark.

Sure. If you want to use ELDm as an example, step up to 7mm 180gr or 308 225gr and you have .8 BC

That's a big difference. Even at 500yd, where long range 'begins', this could be a difference of .2mil or 4". 4" can be the difference between a good shot and a bad one.

My point is, there are some pretty experienced shooters here. When someone says there is a larger 'margin of error', sometimes they mean it's easier to put a big, high BC bullet into the vitals, at distance, in field conditions. I've seen this get misinterpreted in the past, and I believe it worthy of pointing out.

Do you understand what I mean?

 

[PredatorSlayer]

I'd hit him with either one

I think I am with you - I don't see a real advantage here, but maybe I should

 

[Quintus]

I would use either rifle too, but...10 years of waiting for this hunt, the money, the preparation, the anticipation, I am not chooseing between the mentioned rifles. I am reaching for the tried and true 300Wby with the 165 grain TSX and taking pictures avoiding the exit wound in the off shoulder/chest area. If I could hunt elk as a resident every day of elk season id do the same. Only because, what the hell else am I going to shoot with my 300 Wby?

 

[PredatorSlayer]

Sure. If you want to use ELDm as an example, step up to 7mm 180gr or 308 225gr and you have .8 BC

That's a big difference. Even at 500yd, where long range 'begins', this could be a difference of .2mil or 4".

My point is, there are some pretty experienced shooters here. When someone says there is a larger 'margin of error', sometimes they mean it's easier to put a big, high BC bullet into the vitals, at distance, in field conditions. I've seen this get misinterpreted in the past, and I believe it worthy of pointing out.

Do you understand what I mean?

I don't think thats what most people mean. I am with you, I shoot heavy for caliber high bc bullets because the error that I am worried about is in my reading of the wind.

I think some people truly believe that they can justify poor shots on game, or believe that there is a margin of error allowed when it comes to poor shot placement by shooting a 300 wm vs a 26 nosler.

 

[memtb]

I would use either rifle too, but...10 years of waiting for this hunt, the money, the preparation, the anticipation, I am not chooseing between the mentioned rifles. I am reaching for the tried and true 300Wby with the 165 grain TSX and taking pictures avoiding the exit wound in the off shoulder/chest area. If I could hunt elk as a resident every day of elk season id do the same. Only because, what the hell else am I going to shoot with my 300 Wby?

Anything you want to! memtb