6.5mm - 25cal = .007"

[Freedom83]

So I was making the case for a blackjack type .257 bullet long before it existed and my rationale was the same as what they are now using.

-a .243 bullet cannot get to .333 bc. You'd need something crazy like a 1:6 twist

-The 6.5s are now getting there and that's great but you need at least a 6.5x284 to run the 150 class bullets at 3000 fps. And that is going to have some recoil.

- testing is showing the 131 BJ @2950 with an x47, 3000 with a creed, and 3200 if you jump up to the x284. So much less recoil to get similar numbers or a little less recoil to be much flatter.

- the 6.5s are going to be better for elk with their additional energy but for deer and targets I'll take the lighter bullets/ less recoil.

Is it worth building a gun around this bullet? Well that's your call. They have promised a hunting bullet for next year. And with the trend towards high bc bullets and the fact that newness drives sales I wouldn't be surprised to see more options show up. Also if you are comparing bcs there are only a few 6.5s in this class. So it's not really 1 option vs 16 options. Its more like 1 vs 3 or 4.

For those of us who have been begging for better .257 options, I feel we have an obligation to support Blackjack and more development. So for me it's worth it.

If you don't like using "target" bullets on game, then you are out of luck until next year, but I've had good luck with bergers and it sounds like these will have comparable terminal performance.

TX Badger, my Oehler chrono tells me my 25.06 runs the 110 at about 3140.
A 284 version should be about the same(?). Are you telling me this Blackjack bullet will run 3200?
Not trying to pee on the fire, I'm cautious. I'm a 25 fan too.

 

[Prwillard2]

TX Badger, my Oehler chrono tells me my 25.06 runs the 110 at about 3140.
A 284 version should be about the same(?). Are you telling me this Blackjack bullet will run 3200?
Not trying to pee on the fire, I'm cautious. I'm a 25 fan too.

RL26 should get you over 3k

 

[TX Badger]

Not sure what barrel length you're running or what the bearing surface is on the 110s, but I get well over 3200 with my 25" 25-06 and 115 bergers. Attached is the BJ testing. They did use a 28"barrel to get there.

 

[Freedom83]

Not sure what barrel length you're running or what the bearing surface is on the 110s, but I get well over 3200 with my 25" 25-06 and 115 bergers. Attached is the BJ testing. They did use a 28"barrel to get there.

I'll try that. But when I try to heat them up past about 3150 the groups start opening up. (Mod 70 with 24" barrel)
No pressure signs until about 3200. Haven't tried RL26 though. Thanks!

 

[TX Badger]

Mine shot better the faster I ran them with H4831. I was up to 3300 and then I got a batch of powder that ran hot. Velocity went up even more, groups were great but primers popped. I threw it out and switched to H1000 and now I've got no pressure signs and am still over 3200.

 

[Benny338]

So, got another question...
One year I had a quartering shot on an elk (coming at me). I had a Hornady 110 Interbond. It was close, and the bullet hit the spine. The bullet turned about 90 degrees & followed the spine. I had to follow a blood trail.
The next year, I had almost the exact the same shot. The Nosler Accubobond punched the spine & the elk dropped.
So, question is... What bullet do you prefer?
(That was my failure with a 25)

110 grain bullet on a elk is a recipe for failure! Sure it will work with a perfect shot but elk are very tough animals and if anything you use a gun that's little on the big side. Hunting is never like punching paper and having a bullet that can still get the job done even if the shot does draw a lot of bone is the way to go. I would rather lose a tiny bit of meat than the whole animal.

 

[Freedom83]

110 grain bullet on a elk is a recipe for failure! Sure it will work with a perfect shot but elk are very tough animals and if anything you use a gun that's little on the big side. Hunting is never like punching paper and having a bullet that can still get the job done even if the shot does draw a lot of bone is the way to go. I would rather lose a tiny bit of meat than the whole animal.

Absolutely agree sir!
I've killed two elk with that bullet. One worked, the other... I was tracking a blood trail.
We hunt where there are wolves & grizzlies. Some of my compadres make fun of me for my 264 "pop gun". I sleep just fine in camp, just a little smile while they hug their bigger guns & put more wood on the fire.

 

[gregsjt]

So I was making the case for a blackjack type .257 bullet long before it existed and my rationale was the same as what they are now using.

-a .243 bullet cannot get to .333 bc. You'd need something crazy like a 1:6 twist

-The 6.5s are now getting there and that's great but you need at least a 6.5x284 to run the 150 class bullets at 3000 fps. And that is going to have some recoil.

- testing is showing the 131 BJ @2950 with an x47, 3000 with a creed, and 3200 if you jump up to the x284. So much less recoil to get similar numbers or a little less recoil to be much flatter.

- the 6.5s are going to be better for elk with their additional energy but for deer and targets I'll take the lighter bullets/ less recoil.

Is it worth building a gun around this bullet? Well that's your call. They have promised a hunting bullet for next year. And with the trend towards high bc bullets and the fact that newness drives sales I wouldn't be surprised to see more options show up. Also if you are comparing bcs there are only a few 6.5s in this class. So it's not really 1 option vs 16 options. Its more like 1 vs 3 or 4.

For those of us who have been begging for better .257 options, I feel we have an obligation to support Blackjack and more development. So for me it's worth it.

If you don't like using "target" bullets on game, then you are out of luck until next year, but I've had good luck with bergers and it sounds like these will have comparable terminal performance.

Seems pretty optimistic, I don't see many people running 130's at 3000 from a 6.5 Creed, yet you think that can be done in a smaller bore?

 

[Benny338]

Seems pretty optimistic, I don't see many people running 130's at 3000 from a 6.5 Creed, yet you think that can be done in a smaller bore?

What does the bore size have to do with anything? 130's in a 264 will go way faster than 3000. The right .25 cal cartridge will shove the 131 well over 3000! S$@#. I forgot if the All Mighty Creed can't do it nothing can

 

[Benny338]

Absolutely agree sir!
I've killed two elk with that bullet. One worked, the other... I was tracking a blood trail.
We hunt where there are wolves & grizzlies. Some of my compadres make fun of me for my 264 "pop gun". I sleep just fine in camp, just a little smile while they hug their bigger guns & put more wood on the fire.

People to stoke the fire and protect camp! No wonder why you sleep so well! I might have to join your group

 

[gregsjt]

He specifically said that the 25 Creed was shooting the blackjack at 3000. I've never seen anyone shoot a 6.5 Creed with 130 grain bullets at 3000 so I'm just wondering how that's done with all things being equal except bore diameter. In my experience usually you get faster speeds with the same weight of bullet in bigger bore diameters. For instance, you can shoot a 168 grain from a .308 faster than a 168 from a 7-08.

 

[Benny338]

He specifically said that the 25 Creed was shooting the blackjack at 3000. I've never seen anyone shoot a 6.5 Creed with 130 grain bullets at 3000 so I'm just wondering how that's done with all things being equal except bore diameter. In my experience usually you get faster speeds with the same weight of bullet in bigger bore diameters. For instance, you can shoot a 168 grain from a .308 faster than a 168 from a 7-08.

I missed where he slipped that part in. I agree might be a little optimistic. Especially the x47 at 2950

 

[Prwillard2]

I missed where he slipped that part in. I agree might be a little optimistic. Especially the x47 at 2950

I'm pushing the 124gr Hammer Hunters in my 6.5 Creed at 2950 with Varget and a 21" barrel. With a Reloder powder and a 26" barrel 3k should be achievable with the 25 Creed and 131s.

 

[gregsjt]

How do you know? Have you done it? The 25-06 burns 10 to 15 grains more powder than the Creed and yet it only gets 115's to 3150-3200. Maybe it would work, I don't know. I just know that it's pretty **** hard to do in a 6.5 Creed with the same weight bullet.