230gr VLD LAZZERONI 7.82(.308)Warbird®

[IdahoRedneck]

John,
I know you were shootin 1/2 moa off the bat, that was my pun intended the last conversation we had you told me the folks shootin the heavies would be hard pressed to shoot 1 moa groups and were more than likley closer to 2 moa at long range, Let me say again im glad you tried em im glad they worked as we all knew they would......your onto somethin here John run those numbers against your best selling warbird ammo at 1000.... If your first load shot that good well then........ I think youve just found your next best seller.........after you fine tune it of course.....JMHO

 

[B23]

John, I don't know what the "right" H2O case capacity of your Warbird is, which is why I was hoping you would know. The only information I have on your Warbird is from my Quickload program and it lists the H2O case capacity as 121.50 Water grains.

For what it's worth, when I input your exact information into my QL program, it gives me nearly the exact same PSI pressure numbers that you posted and only slightly less FPS but I believe those barrels you use produce a bit faster FPS numbers and the program can't compensate for different types of barrels. I played around with my QL program inputting many different powders and mocking up loads to the different pressure levels you got with RL33 and none of the other powders could compare in the velocity department. RL33 and N570 produced the best FPS numbers. At least on paper they did.

Take a minute and fill one of those cases up with water, I'm curious what the case capacity is.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

Rock on. I'm glad to see you trying different things. THAT is how our industry grows. Keep up the good work & don't forget to share your 1k results with us.



PS- I have several hundred 190vlds to launch from the Patriot, stay tuned


t

 

[MudRunner2005]

I'm just glad after all the pushing and pushing to see the "old dog" trying some new tricks...And performing them very well, might I add.

If temp sensativity is lessened based on a powder's higher (faster) burn rate, then by my calculations, Hodgdon Varget or Reloder 19 would be good powders to try for this caliber.

 

[Swamplord]

The Warbird is one of those cartridges that is very easy to make shoot well, After a decade of handloading and shooting it I have shot some incredible groups and had some awesome and very memorable hunts with it, The heavy high BC 230 gr bullets are going to stretch the range of this cool cat... The velocities Mr. Lazzeroni listed are very similar to what I have found when loaded to max magazine length,

My favorite loads for hunting were the 180 gr Swift AFrame and the 200 gr Accubond, both loads grouped into 1/2" at top end velocity, the Warbird loves to run hot and shoots the best when stoked to the max !

Over the years I have heard a lot of guys claim the barrel will be shot out in as little as 600 rounds, Those claims are usually from dudes that assume and have no experience with the cartridge, my personal rifle was broken in with 20 rounds of Lazzeroni's factory ammo and since has digested over 1200 rounds of handloads, yes the barrel was showing signs of wear but still shot 1" groups with the same loads, I bet if I cut 1/2" of the muzzle end, recrown, set the bbl back 1/2" and rechamber I could get another 5-600 rounds of great accuracy .. maybe more !!

Years back, On other forums I tried to share my experiences with the Warbird and was met with guys that crapped all over my results, and again it was from those that have never even held a Warbird cartridge in their hands, let alone fire it !

this is from about nine years ago on 24 Hr Campfire, if anyone cares to read it, my opinion on the Warbird hasn't changed, it is a fantastic 30 cal cartridge !

.....

What Happened To Lazzeroni's Magnums? - 24hourcampfire

 

[MudRunner2005]

The Warbird is one of those cartridges that is very easy to make shoot well, After a decade of handloading and shooting it I have shot some incredible groups and had some awesome and very memorable hunts with it, The heavy high BC 230 gr bullets are going to stretch the range of this cool cat... The velocities Mr. Lazzeroni listed are very similar to what I have found when loaded to max magazine length,

My favorite loads for hunting were the 180 gr Swift AFrame and the 200 gr Accubond, both loads grouped into 1/2" at top end velocity, the Warbird loves to run hot and shoots the best when stoked to the max !

Over the years I have heard a lot of guys claim the barrel will be shot out in as little as 600 rounds, Those claims are usually from dudes that assume and have no experience with the cartridge, my personal rifle was broken in with 20 rounds of Lazzeroni's factory ammo and since has digested over 1200 rounds of handloads, yes the barrel was showing signs of wear but still shot 1" groups with the same loads, I bet if I cut 1/2" of the muzzle end, recrown, set the bbl back 1/2" and rechamber I could get another 5-600 rounds of great accuracy .. maybe more !!

Years back, On other forums I tried to share my experiences with the Warbird and was met with guys that crapped all over my results, and again it was from those that have never even held a Warbird cartridge in their hands, let alone fire it !

this is from about nine years ago on 24 Hr Campfire, if anyone cares to read it, my opinion on the Warbird hasn't changed, it is a fantastic 30 cal cartridge !

.....

What Happened To Lazzeroni's Magnums? - 24hourcampfire

Ever since the day I heard about a Lazzeroni 7.82 Warbird I have wanted one, and I know that was in the late 90's when I was still a youngin'. LOL

I hope to get my hands on one someday... There's just too much I want to experiment with it.... 210 VLD's, 215 Hybrids, 230 Hybrids, even ligher weight bullets, 168 VLD's, etc...

 

[LazzInc]

B23 ,,,,,,

if my old digital powder scale still works, I will measure myself next week, the water capacity of the current Warbird brass case ,,,,,

Mudrunner ,,,,,,

now you know what I go thru ! ,,,,, just too many possible combinations for one man to try,, LOL ,,,,,,

the good thing is that I believe the Lazz 7.82 Warbird caliber is today, exactly what it was when I drew it on a napkin back in 1994, one of the best 30-cal Super-Magnum cases ever ,,,,,

and I do not say that lightly, as I am fully aware of what the competition has done ,,,,

back then I simply wanted a cartridge to meet or exceed the performance of my then wildcat 30-378 Wby Mag, but in a modern, beltless case design with a 30 degree sharp shoulder, and a chamber/throat design that allowed bullet seating against the lands, without making the loaded cartridge so long, that it would not fit in the Lazz rifle mag box ,,,,,,

the Warbird has exceeded ALL of my expectations, and this same exact case design, including headspace measurements, is used for all Lazz long magnum calibers, from .284 thru .475 ,,,,, ((see www.Lazzeroni.com ))

 

[MudRunner2005]

B23 ,,,,,,

if my old digital powder scale still works, I will measure myself next week, the water capacity of the current Warbird brass case ,,,,,

Mudrunner ,,,,,,

now you know what I go thru ! ,,,,, just too many possible combinations for one man to try,, LOL ,,,,,,

the good thing is that I believe the Lazz 7.82 Warbird caliber is today, exactly what it was when I drew it on a napkin back in 1994, one of the best 30-cal Super-Magnum cases ever ,,,,,

and I do not say that lightly, as I am fully aware of what the competition has done ,,,,

back then I simply wanted a cartridge to meet or exceed the performance of my then wildcat 30-378 Wby Mag, but in a modern, beltless case design with a 30 degree sharp shoulder, and a chamber/throat design that allowed bullet seating against the lands, without making the loaded cartridge so long, that it would not fit in the Lazz rifle mag box ,,,,,,

the Warbird has exceeded ALL of my expectations, and this same exact case design, including headspace measurements, is used for all Lazz long magnum calibers, from .284 thru .475 ,,,,, ((see www.Lazzeroni.com ))

Well, if you need some help testing, just holler at me.

 

[varmintH8R]

A 230 hybrid at those speeds is impressive as hell. Can't wait to hear how they shoot at 1000. Would love a side-by-side comparison to more typical Lazz factory fodder in a 5-10 full value wind.

 

[MMERSS]

A 230 hybrid at those speeds is impressive as hell. Can't wait to hear how they shoot at 1000. Would love a side-by-side comparison to more typical Lazz factory fodder in a 5-10 full value wind.

Another pattern of comments is appearing from LR hunters.

Hmmmmm, I wonder if taking your recommendation how the results will fair?

I think we know and have always said this.

 

[Broz]

Finally got some reloader 33 and the Berger 230gr Hybrid Tactical bullets and went to work.

data below is with Fed 215M primer and the bullet seated up against the lands at an OAL of 3.705", with stock factory Lazzeroni chamber & throat dimensions, 28" 10 twist poly barrel.

((Please do not EVER load the Lazz Warbird cartridge over 66,900 PSI))

97gr ----- 3,066 fps --- 62,400 PSI
100gr ---- 3,184 fps --- 66,500 PSI
103gr ---- 3,267 fps --- 76,800 PSI
106gr ---- 3,368 fps --- 89,000 PSI --- Primer Perf, Proof Pressure

Targets and rifle photo below ,,,,,,

John, very interesting. Thanks for posting your results. Now tweek that load in and stretch her out. With a 230 Berger at those velocities she will just be shifting into over drive at 1000. So take her on out, you don't have to stop short like with those little light hard bullets. She will be an elk hammer way past 1000.

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Thanks and keep us posted.
Jeff

 

[LazzInc]

mudrunner ,,,,,

I know this will sound funny to many, but I no longer use a digital scale to load ammo, (balance beam type only) so that is why I need to check to see if I have an old one still working ,,,,

I will get this done next week and post it ,,,,,,

 

[MudRunner2005]

mudrunner ,,,,,

I know this will sound funny to many, but I no longer use a digital scale to load ammo, (balance beam type only) so that is why I need to check to see if I have an old one still working ,,,,

I will get this done next week and post it ,,,,,,

Hey, whatever works best for you, is what you should use. Do you not trust the new digital scales, or automated weighing systems? Just curious, sorry for prying.

I love my Chargemaster 1500. I keep it calibrated and since I did the McDonalds straw trick, and adjusted a few parameters in the programming, it's faster and WAY more accurate. I would venture to say that it hits dead-on 6 out of 10 (now), whereas before was maybe 2-3 times out of 20. I still adjust each and every charge of powder to get dead-on to the 0.0. I believe accuracy and precision in powder charge is just as important as consistancy in seating depth. Also, I'm a bit OCD, so that doesn't help with perfection.

 

[LazzInc]

when we are loading ammo and pour 700-900 powder charges per day, +/- .10gr, it is easy for the persons eyes to fixate on only the decimal point on the digital scale, and then trickle up to the correct decimal measurement ,,,,,

but if the big powder dispenser suddenly drops a charge that is a full grain above or below what you have it set for, and then the person running the trickler only looks at the digits to the right of the decimal point, you end up a full grain of powder under or over what the spec is ,,,,,,,

when using the good o'l balance beam scale, it is either in the middle with the correct charge or it is not ,,,, no room for error to creep in ,,,,,,