Why you need to Understand Vista Outdoors and What They Own

[Hugnot]

Fiocchi Munizioni primers, large & small rifle, have kept me shooting for the last 3 years. Except for some minor amounts of CCI & Fed primers.

I am unable to find any extruded powders that are made in USA. It appears that most powders made in USA are ball powders made by, General Dynamics in Florida. This probably includes Alliant Power Pro 2000MR, 4000MR & Varmint, I have not seen any of these Alliant powders for years.

 

[lyle2231]

Given China's open acquisition of strategic US assets, and their monetary influence (held debt and outright ownership of farms, tech companies, pharmaceutical chains, energy producers, utilities, universities, banks, government, etc) We really need to form private manufacturing and supply coops. That way the debt is private and ownership is distributed. People with common interests, like those in shooting sports, should begin seriously networking to secure the capital, facilities and raw materials to be self supporting manufacturers. The coming election may help, but China already has tentacles throughout our country, and lawmakers in their pockets. They are going to use their control sooner or later. The food supply, water, power, ammunition, transportation and communications are all sensitive resources, and they are becoming unaffordable. I never thought to see this in the USA, but I think it's time to pull our heads out of the sand. We're watching a coup take place, and we're the intended victim.

I would like to think that if US v China came to happen over Taiwan JoBi would tell China they would forfeit all rights and title to their holdings in the US. Then "hopefully" that would be deterrent enough to put a war on the back burner.

 

[tops911]

I remember as a kid in the late 1970s Speer bullets were very popular. However I have not seen very much for Speer over the last 7 years or so. Kind of sad

 

[Chas1]

good info.

 

[Carolinadx]

I'm paying $40/tankful more for gas every time I fill up. In comparison, another $40 per brick of primers doesn't seem so bad.

I have zero complaints about primer price because I bought enough in the last decade to last me a lifetime and a half and keep my posterity going however I'd like to know where you're getting them for under $80 as my best friendly shop can't sell white box CCI for less than 96 per thousand

 

[Carolinadx]

I remember as a kid in the late 1970s Speer bullets were very popular. However I have not seen very much for Speer over the last 7 years or so. Kind of sad

Isn't that true.
I still have all my Speer hand loading books that came with my Lyman original T-Mag press which I still use

 

[2buffalo]

There are some good points on here but also many claims with no back up. Who can tell me the cost to produce a primer compared to prior years? I would guess nobody. To say it is greed without all the facts is a straight out of the Bernie Sanders play book. To say the government should get involved is the same especially when you don't have all the facts.

 

[KSB209]

Not saying a huge conglomerate is a good thing but in todays world I bet it is semi difficult for small firearm businesses to succeed with all the political theater and silly governors in a few states that want to take away the 2A. Add lawsuits and everything else they have to deal with it's got to be a PITA. If I was a small firearms business and a big company came to me and offered me millions of dollars I might be willing to take it and run

 

[CBH Australia]

This is not going to help the consumer but it's also good to see that a company is confident in the firearm market

 

[Jon Bischof]

Took a break from my study of Romans for Bible class to read a few pages of this thread. Back to Romans; and I am certain that I am financially, emotionally, and spiritually better off. There are things you can't change. Vista is one of those things. Concentrate on things that benefit you instead of things that frustrate you.

 

[Veteran]

There are some good points on here but also many claims with no back up. Who can tell me the cost to produce a primer compared to prior years? I would guess nobody. To say it is greed without all the facts is a straight out of the Bernie Sanders play book. To say the government should get involved is the same especially when you don't have all the facts.

Primers have gone up over 200% since 2019 and early 2020.

Im looking at $125/ per 1000 now if you can findem for large rifle and large rifle mag. BRs $170.

Show me any metal commodity or any chemical used in primers that the raw material is up even 50% much less 200%?

Now all of these plants and their machines run on electricity, which could be up 10%.

The cost of transport due to diesel is certainly up in the 150 % range possibly, but that is not the major cost in making them.

And they get moved with lots of other goods sharing transport costs.

There is an element of market power in the price. It is quite high.
The market if it were running efficiently and competitively would limit the costs to a 12 to 20 percent return, not 50% and higher.

No, I don't have all the exact numbers, but I understand costs, commodity prices, manufacturing, and business.

Something is rotten in Denmark at $125, and it smells really bad at $170 plus. Its market power pricing, not a fair return price. The price is so high because they could. High prices and competition will fix that.

Not Government, and Bernie Sanders doesn't know come here from sic'em.

Show me any commodity at all, other than crude oil that is up 150-200%?

The primer cup is a mix of copper and brass, the chemicals in the cup are
a mechanical mixture of lead styphnate, antimony sulfide, barium nitrate, and other chemicals. Tetracene is part of the explosive and is about 8% petroleum based.

This stuff when you look at weighting factors is no where near 200% price increases. Electric power that runs the manufacturing line is not up more than 10%. The only thing that is really up is transport to market, and this is not the major cost component in the delivered product.

 

[cohunt]

There are some good points on here but also many claims with no back up. Who can tell me the cost to produce a primer compared to prior years? I would guess nobody. To say it is greed without all the facts is a straight out of the Bernie Sanders play book. To say the government should get involved is the same especially when you don't have all the facts.

Do we actually know who is tacking on these price increases?

Manufacturer ? Distributor? dealer?
Other middle men? Do we know what the manufactures price to the distributor is? Maybe the price hike comes from the end dealer/seller trying to recoup costs for lack of inventory over the past 2 years? Or are we just speculating and pointing fingers ?

 

[Veteran]

Do we actually know who is tacking on these price increases?

Manufacturer ? Distributor? dealer?
Other middle men? Do we know what the manufactures price to the distributor is? Maybe the price hike comes from the end dealer/seller trying to recoup costs for lack of inventory over the past 2 years? Or are we just speculating and pointing fingers ?

Oh, there is definitely some jumping on or piling on by the end distributor,
especially at Brownells lately. If you will note, Powder Valley and Precision Reloading and a few other retailers usually have more reasonable pricing on primers than Brownells, Midway, and lately even Natchez has gone rogue.

You can find BR2's for $139 a few places but $170 at others.
You will see CCI #34s for $99 in some places and $139 in others.

That's a sure indicator that there is certainly some piling on at the retailer level. But then, we don't know if all retailers get the same deal from CCI either do we? All I know is $170 primers plus hazmat and shipping is not sustainable, good or anything. Its just wrong. Something is rotten.

I usually have to depend on Powder Valley to get a more fair deal.
That means waiting many times.

So, yes, Vista has some company, but even if their whole sale price is still $100 or $125, things are still out of whack.

 

[2buffalo]

You are not looking at all the costs of running a buisness. Price escalations in providing health care, building/equipment maintenance, employee wages, lost time for covid protocol during the scamdemic. Also if you are in buisness and the ingredients for your products are not readily available you need to charge more for the item you manufacture if you have to run at a lower volume or you will go under. I do not know their buisness therefore I do not sling mud at them until someone proves their guilt. Kinda the American way. I stand by my statement. Without knowing all the details this is just slinging mud. As much as any of us want to think we know what is going on none of us will without some serious diving into their Financials which they are a publicly traded company so you can but its alot easier to sling mud and scream that they are thieves then spend the time to do your research. Yelling greed without ALL the information is very unbecoming in my eyes no matter who it is.