Scope field evaluations on rokslide

[Paladin300]

Fair enough, but that's not what you said which is why I replied the way I did. What you said was "A drastic change in humidity can sometimes effect trajectory." I simply highlighted the error of that statement. Not to challenge you, but to be clear to less knowledgeable people that may read your post.

Of course if the other environmentals are also changed a difference can be seen. Just depends how much of what is changed as to how much impact there is.

That was my error to use the word drastic. I was thinking of all the environmentals combined which can in my experience make a 2-3 inch shift in dope at 400-600 yards. I have honestly never seen more than a inch or 2 in POI, usually high right. That is what the post I was responding to had stated he had experienced in Texas. Condition in Texas can change pretty drastically from one side of the state to the other, from the coastal regions to the mountains. You might experience a change in dope on a sheep hunt in the northwest if you sighted in in Beaumont. I don't disagree with you, thanks for clarifying my error vernacular.

My thoughts are just trying to figure out all these scope failures. I seem to remember a few years back reading an article on military scope failures. I seem to remember that the failure rate was around 20%. Those rifles and scopes are drug all over the country. I have a friend who was a sniper instructor he said his first rifle was equipped with a Mark 4 that it and the M40 it was attached to looked as if they had been to hell and back. He said it never failed him while he had it. The technology we have now is so far ahead of those early scopes we were using. There may be the problem but I am not certain. I think we are exaggerating our problems a little to bolster our favorites. The others are just user error?

 

[2buffalo]

I just got back from a NM elk hunt. Stopped at NRA center and confirmed zero. Four days later first two shots went over elks back at 420. Using kentucky windage next 2 put him down. First 2 kept bugging me and went to range Monday and scope was 6 inches high and 2 right. VX5 3-15. Could have been ring slippage.

What are solid rings other than NF?

Badger Max 50.

 

[quigley257]

Without reading all the replies up to this point, I will make an observation. Just as a single three or five shot group doesn't define a rifles accuracy or potential, neither does a single scope review define a scope model/lines durability or any other attribute. A few years back, I received a brand new USO scope to mount on a customers rifle. When we mount scopes in our shop, we also zero them at 100 yards in our tunnel. The rifle had already qualified and passed our accuracy testing using our NF 42X range scope so I knew the rifle was a shooter. It was a heavy tactical rifle in 308 Win and would stack shots using federal GMM ammo. I had trouble zeroing the USO scope and had to adjust the parallax several times to maintain a clear sight picture. As I was handling the rifle during troubleshooting, I gave it a shake and was surprised to hear something rattle inside the scope. It had a loose lens in it straight from the factory. Everyone makes lemons from time to time. Don't get me wrong, I think the scope reviews on RS are great, but you can't pin everything on the review of a single example. Food for thought.

 

[Argon Glen]

Related: https://www.snipershide.com/precision-rifle/scope-tracking-test-results-2020/.

 

[buzby]

Another interesting side not is that in the case of Athlon the ETR is built in the same factory as the SWFA scopes

Athlon ETR is made in China. SWFA are made in Japan. Not the same factory.

 

[buzby]

I have several friends that guide in both places and they all use Leupolds on their personal rifles. In those parts of the world a malfunction could cost you not just game or your lively hood but your life.

Again these guys all depend on them for their lively hood and by extension their lives.

Popularity ≠ Reliability

The most popular vehicle in the country is a Ford F150.
Does that mean it is the most reliable? I own a F150. I like it, but I know it has lifter issues. You can like a particular scope brand (leupold) and still admit they need to be more reliable.

Lots of people's lively hood depends on them getting to work in a dodge

 

[Small Lady]

Related: https://www.snipershide.com/precision-rifle/scope-tracking-test-results-2020/.

Interesting that 2/3 of the scopes were not properly mounted.
Many were likely store mounted to, so even they don't know what they are doing.
Really kind of sad, that so few take pride in what they're doing.

 

[orkan]

Really kind of sad, that so few take pride in what they're doing.

I find the opposite to be true. Most people take a tremendous amount of pride in doing things wrongly. This is evidenced by the hostility apparent in their response when someone suggests they do it rightly.


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[Window]

Not sure how many have seen these over on the slide, i'm sure there is some crossover on forums, but these are interesting to follow, and a little heartbreaking for some of the favorite scopes...

Rifle Scope Field Evaluations

rokslide.com

I'm not going to bash any of them. I've used them all for the past fifty years and they've all served me well. Tasco, Bushnell, Simmons, Leupold, SB and Nightforce. Now that I've aged myself, the only one that I've not had an issue with is Nightforce. I'm not a scope snob and I have absolutely no brand loyalty, other than dependability. Dependability requires perfect tracking and something that can take a beating. There many of you haul your freedom seed senders in trucks, trailers and planes and take them all over the world. Not to mention five, eight to fifteen plus days in a scabbard on a horse. Quality bases, rings (Richard Near) and optics are the last things we want to worry about after spending months creating the best load possible. I'll give up a little clarity for dependability. To each his or her own and wish all of you a safe and bountiful adventure.

 

[Paladin300]

Athlon ETR is made in China. SWFA are made in Japan. Not the same factory.

I stand corrected. I was under the impression that the variable HD models were made in China. I think initially some were. I know they are not manufactured in the same factory as the SS scopes. I was thinking they were manufactured in the Premier factory in China which is were the ELR is made.

 

[Darryle]

I find the opposite to be true. Most people take a tremendous amount of pride in doing things wrongly. This is evidenced by the hostility apparent in their response when someone suggests they do it rightly.


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I do everything wrong, I like setting examples

 

[Paladin300]

Popularity ≠ Reliability

The most popular vehicle in the country is a Ford F150.
Does that mean it is the most reliable? I own a F150. I like it, but I know it has lifter issues. You can like a particular scope brand (leupold) and still admit they need to be more reliable.

Lots of people's lively hood depends on them getting to work in a dodge

I am not arguing their popularity. My point is that those who depend on them find them reliable. I have broken scopes before or had them break but it is rare and it usually shows up in sight in and load development. One of those was an S&B Klassik. It would not zero. It had a broken internal which would not let it dial windage. Sent it off and had it fixed. Haven't had an issue since. It sits a top a Sako 338 win today. The others where cheaper scopes. One just had a defect in the glass. Another was an IOR Valdada. It had a lens issue. Both were replaced under warranty. I have seen the snipers hide comparison above before. As far as tracking goes the big five NF, Leupold, TT, ZCO, and S&B were all on par with each other. They all had at least one scope that was +\- 1. If just looking at numbers of scopes tested Vortex and Athlon are among the best for tracking. As far as toughness goes you could beat a man to death with the a Vortex, all hundred pounds of it, put it back on and go back to shooting. The Razor by all the test data is as tough and reliable as the NF. It is just heavy. Worst case scenario you could use it as a boat anchor. Each scope has its advantages and disadvantages. Application should determine which you chose. Most tier one scopes are good scopes and a sample of one is not sufficient enough data to render the entire brand junk. We need to quit reading the tabloids and go shoot. If you are spending $1000 or more on glass you probably have a decent set up. If your spending $3500 or more it is more than likely a great optic and more than most will ever need or fully use.

 

[Small Lady]

A friend of mine is a guide, he uses a Leupold, was one of the many who recommended Leupold to me.
Texted him this evening, asked if he knew what brand of scopes are used by any other guides he knows. His response, was Leupold, except for one who uses a Zeiss.

It might be fun to email some of the scope makers, asking if they would be willing to donate to me a scope. If any do send me a scope, take them and do some of my own testing. Its probably a long shot that many, or any, would donate scopes to me, but would be fun if they did.

1. Could push each scope of the edge of my table onto the floor, sideways, and end 1st.
2. Throw each of them 5 times as hard as i can into the field.
3. Fill my sink full of water, and put them in there for an hour.
4. Put them all on the rear rack of my ATV, put 2 rubber snap straps over them, to hold them on, then leave them there for a week as I go about my work. That Should subject them to lots of vibration, and bumps.
Then mount, and shoot them, groups of 5 shots at each of 100, 300, and 600 yards, to see if their settings will still work.
Does that sound like a good test?

 

[Darryle]

How are you going to establish protocols, what will be your control?