Reloading- What pressure signs do you stop at?

[Rosebud]

So for all you guys that stop when you get heavy or stuck bolt lift, and you know that you are more than 15,000 PSI over pressure to do that and maybe a whole bunch more than that at the stuck bolt stage, how many extra FPS are you getting by pushing the load that far over max. Just curious because I have never pushed a load to the sticky bolt stage.

Reason I ask is, for example, Hodgdon published data for a 300 Mag 220 grain Sierra Boat Tail bullet shows 2614 FPS at 70.3 of H1000 49,500 PSI, 2876 at 77.7 for 63,200, so they picked up 14,000 psi to gain 250 FPS. So at 80,000 PSI to make the bolt hard to lift, what velocity are you getting and how much more powder did you need to add.

Sometimes ad little as .2 to .3 grains can cause issues. You just have to sneek up on it at times.

 

[jessej]

I imagine some of the talk about hammering bolts open was made in jest. At least I hope it was.

Nope.

However. I'm a lot older and a little wiser now. Haven't went that far in a Long time

 

[Dean2]

I don't have an exact answer to your question but...
I had a buddy who wanted to shoot a reload from another friend. I cautioned against it but he wouldn't listen. I have no idea what the load was but same projectile. 28 Nosler, I stood back. It nearly locked up the action, pierced primer, ejector smear etc. and was only about 80fps faster than the load I had developed for him that was .5gr below first pressure signs which was right around max in the manual I had.

On another hand I have a 284 Win improved that I ran up a ladder test and took it until the bolt got a tiny bit tight just to see, that was about 150 fps faster than a load that is safe and good.

To be honest, I was
asking a question I already know the answer to. The interesting part is very few of the hammer the bolt open testers actually have any idea what thoss answers are.

Guys are running test loads up WAY, WAY, WAY too hot and in the majority of those test loads they are getting 50 fps to at most maybe 150-200 fps while potentially damaging an action. To me that is just ridiculous. Even if you never blow an action or barrel, you could easily get that same 200 fps and more, at very safe pressures by just going from 300 Win to 300 RUM for example. But I guess that is just Safety Dave talk that I should keep to myself.

 

[Calvin45]

To be honest, I was
asking a question I already know the answer to. The interesting part is very few of the hammer the bolt open testers actually have any idea what thoss answers are.

Guys are running test loads up WAY, WAY, WAY too hot and in the majority of those test loads they are getting 50 fps to at most maybe 150-200 fps while potentially damaging an action. To me that is just ridiculous. Even if you never blow an action or barrel, you could easily get that same 200 fps and more, at very safe pressures by just going from 300 Win to 300 RUM for example. But I guess that is just Safety Dave talk that I should keep to myself.

And then, with progressive burn rate powders, hammer bullets, hex boron nitride treatment, Peterson brass, and a long barrel y'all can make that .300 RUM beat the out of the .30-378 factory ammo


Kidding.



Or am I?

 

[Boss Hoss]

This thread is a perfect illustration of why I do not ever shoot at a public range unless I am competing. Yes, I am very fortunate however, too many idiots load ammunition that have no idea what they are doing, and I do not want to get hurt!

 

[akmtnhnt]

So for all you guys that stop when you get heavy or stuck bolt lift, and you know that you are more than 15,000 PSI over pressure to do that and maybe a whole bunch more than that at the stuck bolt stage, how many extra FPS are you getting by pushing the load that far over max. Just curious because I have never pushed a load to the sticky bolt stage.

Reason I ask is, for example, Hodgdon published data for a 300 Mag 220 grain Sierra Boat Tail bullet shows 2614 FPS at 70.3 of H1000 49,500 PSI, 2876 at 77.7 for 63,200, so they picked up 14,000 psi to gain 250 FPS. So at 80,000 PSI to make the bolt hard to lift, what velocity are you getting and how much more powder did you need to add.

Looking at data for various cartridges 15k psi looks to be worth somewhere around 150-250fps. It's more or less what a magnum is worth. Like going from 3006 to 300 win mag, you get roughtly 200fps. If I run 3006 through grt at 75kpsi I end up with roughly 300win mag(factory loads) numbers for the same projectile.

 

[ickes123]

LMAO some of the responses! Run this same post next year and some of the guys won't be able to respond because their hand and face will be blown off. stupid people shouldn't have guns or reloading equipment. great post i needed a laugh.

 

[Highbrass]

So I guess i approach my handloadsand pressure from a slightly different perspective. I actually prefer accuracy over speed. I do keep an eye on primers and bolt lift and ejector swipe. I do have a few loads that are on the edge but not many. If it wont shoot well what does it matter how fast its going.

 

[Window]

Dear safety Steve, we ask politely that you sit this one out. Or, just limit your input to photographic evidence...

What pressure signs do you stop at?

This question is for the guys who want the most out of velocity. I have rifles that I don't push and just shoot for accuracy even if it is well below the max. I have a couple that I like to push to the max. So, where do you maverick's draw the line with pressure signs. Is it when primers begin to flatten, completely flatten, crater primers, hard bolt lift, ejector marks, swipe, etc.. I know there are false pressure signs, please include experience with that.

Rules for answering:
Rule number one: Safety First
Rule number two: Lets hear real world experience, not ethics or safety Steve ranting about not testing boundaries.
Rule number three: Let the dragon breathe!

This is an easy one for me because back in 2013 I had a catastrophic failure with a 30-378. This rifle was only used for hunting and for the previous seven or eight years, I was running the 180 TSX out of it exclusively. The spring of 2013 I had the brilliant idea to change to the TTSX. I worked up a new load that I considered safe. Primers were a little flat, one and ten rounds I would have a little swipe mark but no ejector mark and called it good because the accuracy was as good as if not better than the TSX. That November, I took it to Colorado on my annual deer/elk hunt. As always when we got there, we would shoot three rounds or so to confirm all was good. When I shot the first round, it felt a little different as the blast hit my face a little harder and the smell was different. After looking at the target seeing my shot was approximately 6" high and to the right, I realized my right glasses lens had a small crack right in the center. It was at that point I knew something went wrong. Then I tried to open the bolt and it wouldn't budge. I was able to borrow a fiddle and on day two took a nice 6X6. After returning home I sent the rifle to Weatherby and after a couple of weeks, got the call that gun was toast. This load was two grains under max for both Hodgdon and Barnes published data at the time. I don't recall the exact velocity but I do remember that it was right where it should have been.
So to make a long story short, I stop at the first sign of pressure now and try to find a good accuracy node on the low to middle end.

 

[Turpentine21]

Chrono numbers starting to get inconsistent is something I really watch. Stiff bolt lift is an absolute stop sign. I pay attention to my primer flattening and cratering signs as well. I also pay close attention to primer pockets quickly enlarging.

 

[Rosebud]

This is an easy one for me because back in 2013 I had a catastrophic failure with a 30-378. This rifle was only used for hunting and for the previous seven or eight years, I was running the 180 TSX out of it exclusively. The spring of 2013 I had the brilliant idea to change to the TTSX. I worked up a new load that I considered safe. Primers were a little flat, one and ten rounds I would have a little swipe mark but no ejector mark and called it good because the accuracy was as good as if not better than the TSX. That November, I took it to Colorado on my annual deer/elk hunt. As always when we got there, we would shoot three rounds or so to confirm all was good. When I shot the first round, it felt a little different as the blast hit my face a little harder and the smell was different. After looking at the target seeing my shot was approximately 6" high and to the right, I realized my right glasses lens had a small crack right in the center. It was at that point I knew something went wrong. Then I tried to open the bolt and it wouldn't budge. I was able to borrow a fiddle and on day two took a nice 6X6. After returning home I sent the rifle to Weatherby and after a couple of weeks, got the call that gun was toast. This load was two grains under max for both Hodgdon and Barnes published data at the time. I don't recall the exact velocity but I do remember that it was right where it should have been.
So to make a long story short, I stop at the first sign of pressure now and try to find a good accuracy node on the low to middle end.

This sounds like an obstruction issue. Something plugged in the barrel during the trip! Either that or you did what an old friend did and fill it full of pistol powder. that's a joke about the pistol powder, although it did happen!

 

[memtb]

This is an easy one for me because back in 2013 I had a catastrophic failure with a 30-378. This rifle was only used for hunting and for the previous seven or eight years, I was running the 180 TSX out of it exclusively. The spring of 2013 I had the brilliant idea to change to the TTSX. I worked up a new load that I considered safe. Primers were a little flat, one and ten rounds I would have a little swipe mark but no ejector mark and called it good because the accuracy was as good as if not better than the TSX. That November, I took it to Colorado on my annual deer/elk hunt. As always when we got there, we would shoot three rounds or so to confirm all was good. When I shot the first round, it felt a little different as the blast hit my face a little harder and the smell was different. After looking at the target seeing my shot was approximately 6" high and to the right, I realized my right glasses lens had a small crack right in the center. It was at that point I knew something went wrong. Then I tried to open the bolt and it wouldn't budge. I was able to borrow a fiddle and on day two took a nice 6X6. After returning home I sent the rifle to Weatherby and after a couple of weeks, got the call that gun was toast. This load was two grains under max for both Hodgdon and Barnes published data at the time. I don't recall the exact velocity but I do remember that it was right where it should have been.
So to make a long story short, I stop at the first sign of pressure now and try to find a good accuracy node on the low to middle end.

Are you certain that you didn't have a bore obstruction?

I had similar experience, though only a .223 REM. First round (and only) fired of the day. The little rifle actually kicked a bit, and the benefits of the receiver/action vents (lots of smoke from the action area) were very apparent and appreciate! I took it to a gunsmith to open the bolt, once opened, the case now had a nice belt (looked just like a belted magnum case). The extractor had to be replaced….no other apparent damage to the rifle.

I pulled the bullets from that remaining cartridges and weighed each and every one….all was in order. This was a well proven load, and I've since fired hundreds more using the same load!

This one remains a "head scratcher"! memtb

 

[Buzzsaw]

IF, you want more POWER, why did you buy the caliber youre shooting? !!!!

Pressure freaks

Your 6.5 Creedmoor will never be a 6.5 PRC, jusy buy the PRC. STUPID thought process

but have at it . I'm sure you have insurance

 

[memtb]

IF, you want more POWER, why did you buy the caliber youre shooting? !!!!

Pressure freaks

Your 6.5 Creedmoor will never be a 6.5 PRC, jusy buy the PRC. STUPID thought process

but have at it . I'm sure you have insurance

There is very little room for logic in many of these decisions! Your failure to recognize this threatens the longevity of this thread and it's entertainment value! memtb