Moa vs mill
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MOA vs MIL
- Thread starter Barbourcreek
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lancetkenyon
Well-Known Member
I agree with the math for sure.
1/4 MOA is 2.6175" @ 1k.
1/10 MIL is 3.6" @ 1k.
1/4 MOA is a finer adjustment.
I think there are a lot more factors that come into play at 1k as well. Bit cutting whatever error you can out is a good thing.
Can you hold the 1" difference at 1k between MOA and MIL adjustments? Can your rifle? Can your ammo? Is you zero absolutely perfect? Is your shooting solution on an absolute 1/4 MOA interval (or 1/10MIL)? Does your scope track perfectly?
I have had shooting solutions in MOA say 22.9MOA. And is that really 22.9, or is is 22.85 rounded up? So if you dial 23MOA (1/10 MOA off), you have now introduced 1.047 or up to 1.57" of error to your shooting solution. Good thing with MOA, your solution won't be more than .15MOA off as long as every input into your ballistic solver is perfect.
Don't get me wrong, same goes for MIL as well. Your shooting solution will only read in 1/10th MIL. If you are between MIL, you won't know, and you just introduced up to 1.8" of error. Again, .3" more error than MOA. I can honestly say I couldn't hold (or even see) .3" @ 1k.
Then there is 1/8 MOA and 1/20 MIL adjustment scopes...but those are for the ELR and/or F-Class target guys.
Hitting clay pigeons at 1000 is very impressive. Hitting golf balls at 1000 is amazing.
After all that...I am still a MIL guy! And FFP...but that is another discussion.
1/4 MOA is 2.6175" @ 1k.
1/10 MIL is 3.6" @ 1k.
1/4 MOA is a finer adjustment.
I think there are a lot more factors that come into play at 1k as well. Bit cutting whatever error you can out is a good thing.
Can you hold the 1" difference at 1k between MOA and MIL adjustments? Can your rifle? Can your ammo? Is you zero absolutely perfect? Is your shooting solution on an absolute 1/4 MOA interval (or 1/10MIL)? Does your scope track perfectly?
I have had shooting solutions in MOA say 22.9MOA. And is that really 22.9, or is is 22.85 rounded up? So if you dial 23MOA (1/10 MOA off), you have now introduced 1.047 or up to 1.57" of error to your shooting solution. Good thing with MOA, your solution won't be more than .15MOA off as long as every input into your ballistic solver is perfect.
Don't get me wrong, same goes for MIL as well. Your shooting solution will only read in 1/10th MIL. If you are between MIL, you won't know, and you just introduced up to 1.8" of error. Again, .3" more error than MOA. I can honestly say I couldn't hold (or even see) .3" @ 1k.
Then there is 1/8 MOA and 1/20 MIL adjustment scopes...but those are for the ELR and/or F-Class target guys.
Hitting clay pigeons at 1000 is very impressive. Hitting golf balls at 1000 is amazing.
After all that...I am still a MIL guy! And FFP...but that is another discussion.
ShtrRdy
Well-Known Member
As James mentioned mil and moa are both angle measures. Choose one you want to become comfortable with and spend time with it.
MagnumManiac
Well-Known Member
My own MoA scopes for LR are 1/8MoA adjustments, this is more precise than any other adjustment, but for ease of calculating, I like MIL better. As is 1/20MIL which I haven't played with yet.
Cheers.
Cheers.
Huntnful
Well-Known Member
I just ordered my first MOA scope after shooting Mils the last 3 years. It's a scope I've been wanting, and they don't make it in Mil. All my hunting partners shoot MOA and I don't have any trouble thinking in MOA and inches. So I'm sure it'll be an easy switch back. It has a 25 MOA turret, which gets me out to 1100 yards on the first revolution which will cover all my hunting scenarios.
All my other scopes are staying Mil for the time being. Just wanting to test this scope out. Shouldn't be an issue
All my other scopes are staying Mil for the time being. Just wanting to test this scope out. Shouldn't be an issue
JMB 1911
Well-Known Member
as long as you have MOA dope MOA scopes are perfect. You can't don't do the easier wind calculations
Moa ffp scopes on most of my rifles . There are a few sfp moa scopes in my mix . It depends on the rifle/ muzzleloaders intended purpose. On most upper tier moa scopes you have 20 or 30 moa per rotation on the dial
GSRetrievers
Well-Known Member
It's only math, I shoot both, have zero problem with either. I'm willing to bet most people go through life using quarters, whether it is quarter hour, quarter cup of sugar, business quarter, etc. and at the same time tenths are just as easy.
Creedmoor shooter
Well-Known Member
I own and use both. Even I grew up with moa having swapped over to a mil scope recently I would say I prefer mil. Smaller number compute in my brain easier and math in .10 is easier to me than .25
I have used both MOA and MiL with equal success for my LRH(max range, 1200 yd). The graduation difference between the two due for even the tightest practical control of all variables(wind, velocity, precision, etc.etc) in this application IME, renders the difference(<1"@1000yards) immaterial. My personal preference for LRH has evolved over the years to FFP/MIL for reasons other then any accuracy differences in graduation….
For dedicated LR Bench-rest applications/competition where very fine accuracy is paramount, my scope of choice is a 1/8 MOA graduated scope with high magnification(+30X max). Example: For 300 yard egg shoot competition, the total width of an egg at 300 yards is about .25MOA….A 1MPH wind call error drift takes you completely off the egg.
For dedicated LR Bench-rest applications/competition where very fine accuracy is paramount, my scope of choice is a 1/8 MOA graduated scope with high magnification(+30X max). Example: For 300 yard egg shoot competition, the total width of an egg at 300 yards is about .25MOA….A 1MPH wind call error drift takes you completely off the egg.
I agree, ffp mil.
Wind holds on the fly are way easier in my opinion with mil. Most of my rifles are around a 10mph gun. So 1mil wind hold at 1000 yds in a 10mph full value wind.
800yds would be .8, 700yds .7 600yds .6 etc
If it's 5mph cut that in half. If it's a 15mph wind multiple it 1.5.
Wind holds on the fly are way easier in my opinion with mil. Most of my rifles are around a 10mph gun. So 1mil wind hold at 1000 yds in a 10mph full value wind.
800yds would be .8, 700yds .7 600yds .6 etc
If it's 5mph cut that in half. If it's a 15mph wind multiple it 1.5.
Buzzsaw
Well-Known Member
DEAD HORSE
Not really I get that question almost every class new shooters old shooters that are just getting into long range. They see so much information on the Internet and they don't know what to trust as I explain it to them like a video. They're both good you decide what you wanna use
