Longe Range Thoughts

[del2les]

This topic or similar comes up here every so often, and I think most any hunter with much experience shooting at game has made a miss or bad hit in his lifetime. Kinda' like a "professional" highly skilled and trained quarterback who still throws the "occasional" interception or worse "pick 6". How could that happen to such a trained, experienced and skilled athlete? The same way it may happen to a similar well trained, practiced and skilled marksman and/or hunter. Just like after years of practice and still only hitting 38 of 40 of those NRA rifle silhouettes. Does that mean we should stop trying, because we miss or hit one that didn't fall? Of course not.

What hunter has never crippled a bird, duck, goose, squirrel, rabbit, deer, etc, etc? Only the ones who have little to no experience in actually shooting at game for any length of time. Does that mean those who have should stop hunting? No, we train harder.

In my personal experience and those of my friends, FAR more game is missed or crippled by the "average" hunter who never shoots beyond 200 yards, and there are numerous of those. Truly dedicated LR and ELR shooters and hunters are typically in the same category as the sports QB, and while some are at the varsity, collegiate or pro levels, we all had to start somewhere and throw a pick or two.

 

[COBrad]

It's interesting to me how longrangehunting.com seems to have become mediumrangehunting.com. It appears to me most of our threads are about medium range shooting and more and more comments wanting to cast doubt on the ethics of true long range hunting. What's long range anyway? For some, many it seems, its 400 yards or so. That's probably true for many areas, but in the west, western Colorado and eastern Utah where I live and hunt, 500 yards to however far you are competent and confident at are real possibilities. As has been stated it takes a serious investment in time and practice to become a proficient 600 yard marksman, but it can easily be done with an accurate factory rifle, 3-9 scope, factory ammo if it shoots well in your gun, an inexpensive rangefinder, a cheap anemometer and range card from a free internet site or app. Stretching out to 1K or beyond requires much more of an investment in everything. Knowing when not to shoot is a primary decision and IMO can only come through experience, again coming from lots of practice. I have a 1320 yard range on the ranch and I shoot at that range regularly. I do lots of prairie dog and marmot shooting out as far as 1400 yards, so far, and its amazing what you can do with the right tools and practice. I've passed on many long shots at big game because practice showed that present conditions were not conducive to high probability shots. I've also killed elk at 1098 and 1176 yards because conditions were ideal and practice showed I could make the shots. I'm going to suggest that just because successful true long range shots are outside of ones experience or capabilities doesn't mean it can't be done. Learn from this site and practice and you might be surprised what you can accomplish. This is, after all, LONGrangehunting.com

 

[Rosebud]

It's interesting to me how longrangehunting.com seems to have become mediumrangehunting.com. It appears to me most of our threads are about medium range shooting and more and more comments wanting to cast doubt on the ethics of true long range hunting. What's long range anyway? For some, many it seems, its 400 yards or so. That's probably true for many areas, but in the west, western Colorado and eastern Utah where I live and hunt, 500 yards to however far you are competent and confident at are real possibilities. As has been stated it takes a serious investment in time and practice to become a proficient 600 yard marksman, but it can easily be done with an accurate factory rifle, 3-9 scope, factory ammo if it shoots well in your gun, an inexpensive rangefinder, a cheap anemometer and range card from a free internet site or app. Stretching out to 1K or beyond requires much more of an investment in everything. Knowing when not to shoot is a primary decision and IMO can only come through experience, again coming from lots of practice. I have a 1320 yard range on the ranch and I shoot at that range regularly. I do lots of prairie dog and marmot shooting out as far as 1400 yards, so far, and its amazing what you can do with the right tools and practice. I've passed on many long shots at big game because practice showed that present conditions were not conducive to high probability shots. I've also killed elk at 1098 and 1176 yards because conditions were ideal and practice showed I could make the shots. I'm going to suggest that just because successful true long range shots are outside of ones experience or capabilities doesn't mean it can't be done. Learn from this site and practice and you might be surprised what you can accomplish. This is, after all, LONGrangehunting.com

I'd love to be able to have somewhere like that to practice. Living in Alabama I'm not going to have that opportunity. Farmer where we're hunting isn't going to let me come there and shoot in the spring. and In the summer its full of corn or cotton.

 

[PatriotHenry]

I was sweating, real sweating on my 550 yard, cow elk shot this past season. And I was shooting off my bench, bags front and rear. Had time to range and dope. Minutes felt like hours and the longer I held off the more nervous I got. Double lung heart shot, but at the time it looked like a miss. She didnt' even act hit at first. Hated that. Fell over after a bit but still. This was with a 6.5Creed and 143Eldx. I was sure, and I practice at that range and greater, but still...I traded that Creed for a 6.5PRC, Really really don't plan to shoot over 600 without a lot more practice, and I shoot a lot. I got a gong at 1000,800,600,400 and 300 right off my deck.-WW

Fine shot and kudos to you for realizing the limitations of that cartridge. You were on the ragged edge of enough "ethical" power for the given game. The PRC will extend your range for Elk to about 600-700, depending on bullet and speed, and practice. IMHO. I am shooting a 6.5SS with 156 Bergers going 3040 with sub-half MOA accuracy. My personal limit for Elk with this set up is 650-700, more for deer sized game (under ideal conditions). If Elk are the main thing on your menu, at that kind of range or farther you may want to look into something in .30 or .338 class, with more gas. If not, it sounds like you have learned a valuable lesson on "limitations". I am in the process of building a 300NM for the longer shots on Elk sized game.

My 2 cents.

PH

 

[Wetwrk]

Fine shot and kudos to you for realizing the limitations of that cartridge. You were on the ragged edge of enough "ethical" power for the given game. The PRC will extend your range for Elk to about 600-700, depending on bullet and speed, and practice. IMHO. I am shooting a 6.5SS with 156 Bergers going 3040 with sub-half MOA accuracy. My personal limit for Elk with this set up is 650-700, more for deer sized game (under ideal conditions). If Elk are the main thing on your menu, at that kind of range or farther you may want to look into something in .30 or .338 class, with more gas. If not, it sounds like you have learned a valuable lesson on "limitations". I am in the process of building a 300NM for the longer shots on Elk sized game.

My 2 cents.

PH

I"ve been shooting elk and deer for decades now. But up until a few years ago it was always with my handloaded .270 and never further than 150 yards. I was the classic fear the man with one gun. For decades. Then the neighbor kid shows up with his long range stuff, and with me being recently retired and in-between hobbies away I went. I'm blessed, I reload a few rounds, run outside on my deck, shoot a few over my chrony, jump on my 4wheeler drive down take picture of the target, drive back and so on and so on. I can shoot from 50, to 1000 off my deck. Further if I wanted too, I could easily set up a target a mile or over a mile. This is all on my own place. I'm not interested in BR, or super precision stuff. I just want a ethical cold bore kill shot when I pull the trigger... I pay close attention to bullet speed, what it needs to expand, and the foot pounds on impact. So I take everything in. I've been toying with getting 7RM but that's after I master this 6.5PRC I just got. I don't care for recoil and I want to see the hit. So whatever I need to do to mark all the boxes is my goal. A big help is actually just sneaking closer LOL.-WW

 

[cabelasken]

I have seen (but not attempted) some really remarkable successful long range shots in the field - in my case, 1000 yds is a long range shot. However the equipment used is extremely different than what I carry in the field. These rifles are often 12 to 15 lbs and chambered for big 30's and often the 338 Lapua. They wear scopes that often weigh over 2 lbs themselves. None of my hunting rifles weigh more than 8 lbs with scope, sling and loaded with ammo. That has been my self imposed limit since I turned 50 years old and that was nearly 20 years ago. And some are as light as 6 lbs. My style of hunting has been spot and stalk, and what used to be 3 to 5 miles from the vehicle is now down to 1 to 2 miles and carrying a 15 lb rifle is not going to happen. Although I admire those with the ability to make a shot at over 600 yds. I personnally and ethically won't attempt one. As I've said before, my equipment is is more than capable, but I'm not. About 15 years ago, I mentioned to a world class bench rest shooter that is also a custom rifle maker of my problem with 2 - 6 lb guns that I was trying to tune in at the range. My consistent 5 shot groups stopped at 1 1/4" and got no better. He told me that the percentage of shooters that have the ability to shoot guns this light under an inch is incredibly small. He knew that I was able to shoot my other rifles that were 7 lbs and more under 1/2" consistently.

 

[Jon Bischof]

The factor that limits my killing range where I hunt is terrain and visibility. If I hunted out West I would have to upgrade to play with the grownups on this forum.

 

[Mike Matteson]

Been 10-12 years ago, maybe a bit longer,,,,, a guy calls wants to know if I will mount a scope on his new Sendero. Sure, bring it by. He carries in a new Sendero in .300 Ultra Mag, a Nightforce rail, rings and scope. He allows he's "gonna' kill his buck at 1000yds this year". I didn't say a word, just did the work and took his money. As he left I thought to myself, takes more than money to make a long range shooter.

That one reason I have held my shot to about 500yds or there about. Most of those shot were done, before any real range finders too. I had switch to a bow for a great many years. and now I am having to go back to a rifle.
One of the best ways was shooting ground squirrels, and here shortly Perrie dogs. Sure tunes you up for longer shots. It's not that I don't want to make clean shots with them. I only like to shot paper working out a load. The farmers like you too. A ground squirrel at 400 yds is a petty hard target to shot. Being they are only about 2" wide facing you. With the dogs I am looking at 700yds or so and they are wider too.