Long Action vs Short Action.

[Chrsm]

I'll have spaghetti with meatballs
She will have fish
Bill wants a hamburger
I want a long action 1in9 twist
Sue a short action 1in12 twist

It all works. Bullet weights, twist, barrel, mag size…….. our you have to modify to work. But what is practical?
I love it all,

I still want a slow twist 300 black out for a ar.
Can't see how the 300 hammer has that much more advantage given the limitations of the OAL mag size. Just would like one. Is it practical given the price?……….

The idea of the fattys in a long action makes sense to me if you want to throw a heavy! But we might in counter problems with feeding………

 

[Chrsm]

I'll have spaghetti with meatballs
She will have fish
Bill wants a hamburger
I want a long action 1in9 twist
Sue a short action 1in12 twist

It all works. Bullet weights, twist, barrel, mag size…….. our you have to modify to work. But what is practical?
I love it all,

I still want a slow twist 300 black out for a ar.
Can't see how the 300 hammer has that much more advantage given the limitations of the OAL mag size. Just would like one. Is it practical given the price?……….

The idea of the fattys in a long action makes sense to me if you want to throw a heavy! But we might in counter problems with feeding………

Now I remember the reason I didn't order a barrel. The neck is longer on the hammer too accommodate the lighter bullet.

 

[Gstew1930]

I thought I would chime in and say that I bought a Defiance XM action, which I understand is a medium length action, and found an M5 bottom metal that fits it at Bugholes....and here I am months later and cant find a stock that will accommodate those components. I am new on this forum, so surely didnt want to highjack the thread by any means, but thought it might be an opportunity to get your guys' thoughts or comments on where a stock could be found. Thank you gentlemen, and if I am out of line please say so and I will back out.
Thank you

Manners makes one

 

[AZShooter]

I never worried much about a long high BC bullet fitting in a rifle with a short action or a short magazine. I would try that particular bullet seated to fit and feed from the magazine and work up a load. I agree a short action would cause a long high BC bullet to take up some powder space and perhaps cause the bullet to go a bit slower. Never phased me, I worked with what I had and got good results.

One of the most extreme examples that worked out well for a friend's rifle:

He wanted his 22" Browning A-bolt in 300 WSM to shoot the 230 gr Berger. I seated the bullet to fit his 2.8" mag box. (I joked the base of the bullet was sitting on the flash hole) I worked up a load with RL-17and got an accurate load @ 2735 fps. I watched my elderly 85 year old friend shoot his last elk, a cow, at 300 yards with excellent results. Sure, a LA might have yielded a bit more performance, but the elk never knew the difference.

 

[jbcason]

Wanted to express my views on action length. With the advent of shorter fatter relatively high capacity cartridges, I am observing that they are actually better suited to longer actions, say 30-06 length actions than shorter ones. Such cartridges include the WSMs, Shermans, the PRCs, etc. The reason I think they are better suited to the longer action is that the longer action and magazine will better accommodate the very high BC bullets now available, since the bullet can be seated further out in the case and increase the usable powder capacity, providing greater optimization of the bullet jump as well. Limiting powder space and jump control simply degrades the potential of the short fat cases, which arguably are more efficient than longer cases with narrow powder columns. Case in point is my 300WSM. I have that rifle in a long action Savage, it feeds well and I can shoot our 175 gr BD2 bullet 3200 fps and the 195 gr BD2 at 2995 fps. From a short action that would be difficult to do if not dangerous with those bullets loaded to magazine length. Finding the same thing using a 6.5PRC. Would like to get some rational discussion about this subject from the obviously experienced reloaders on this site.

I agree. I'm shooting 210 grain Berger VLD In a 300 PRC. It likes to be just touch the lands to shoot best. That makes it the longest it can be. It feeds well and chambers well in the long action defiance action.

 

[Culpeper]

Really doesn't need saying but it depends on the cartridge. I went with LA for .244 Rem to begin with. Subsequently came in handy with the 110 SMK. I got a lot of those bullets from .243 Win folks. The logic being the .244 has a little more capacity but more important a longer neck.

 

[tooth doc]

Wanted to express my views on action length. With the advent of shorter fatter relatively high capacity cartridges, I am observing that they are actually better suited to longer actions, say 30-06 length actions than shorter ones. Such cartridges include the WSMs, Shermans, the PRCs, etc. The reason I think they are better suited to the longer action is that the longer action and magazine will better accommodate the very high BC bullets now available, since the bullet can be seated further out in the case and increase the usable powder capacity, providing greater optimization of the bullet jump as well. Limiting powder space and jump control simply degrades the potential of the short fat cases, which arguably are more efficient than longer cases with narrow powder columns. Case in point is my 300WSM. I have that rifle in a long action Savage, it feeds well and I can shoot our 175 gr BD2 bullet 3200 fps and the 195 gr BD2 at 2995 fps. From a short action that would be difficult to do if not dangerous with those bullets loaded to magazine length. Finding the same thing using a 6.5PRC. Would like to get some rational discussion about this subject from the obviously experienced reloaders on this site.

i love my 300 wsm! have killed over 100 head of big game up to 1800 lb eland x 4. it is my go to rifle with 168 gr tsx or ttsx barnes at 3260. having said that, you are absolutly CORRECT!

 

[Mike Matteson]

Never had or used a short action. I wouldn't begin to use a short action. It limits what you can do with the action. I could see a long time ago there was going to be problems. Today with the higher BC bullets it has become even harder to clear with a short action. To each their own.

 

[Chas1]

Never had or used a short action. I wouldn't begin to use a short action. It limits what you can do with the action. I could see a long time ago there was going to be problems. Today with the higher BC bullets it has become even harder to clear with a short action. To each their own.

+1, never owned a short action.

 

[tooth doc]

I'd like to jump in on this thread and ask if anyone knows of a good resource to learn more about the technical aspects of choosing an action? I'm interested in building a precision rifle and as I read the ads for different actions by quality builders, it's clear that there is a lot to understand here. I haven't found any books or online articles which go deep into different actions' features and functions, so I'm left trying to piece together passing references in threads like this, but if anyone can recommend a good source for a deeper understanding of rifle action technology, it'd be much appreciated.

call Ron at benchmark barrels.

 

[Chadden0130]

Long and Short action option

So I had a bit of a "HMMMMM" moment a few years ago when I was looking at my left hand savage 111 in 30/06 (blind mag). My thinking was that I wanted a target 308 but had a long action rifle. I figured If I rebarreled it in 308, I would have a long action that would allow longer seating on a shorter cartridge which IMO would equal more range to find the sweet spot more variability for solid copper bullets which are traditionally longer. So the franken-rifle project commenced. I had Jim at Apache make me a 25" full bull reamed for .308 in 155 palma match and then throated to take 190's. I know, this seems counter productive, but again, I wanted tight tolerances on a range of bullet choices. I also swapped the savage stock for a choate ultimate tactical for increased rigidity and secure bedding. Whether or not it made a difference, I also added a steel 1 piece picatinny top mount to give "hopefully" some added rigidity to the fame. After some light sanding and dremeling to the internals, I had my monster. I will tout it as a success as I am all in $800+- not including optic for a 24lb rifle that refuses to move when shot yet shoots better than me. The 175gn seems to be the preferred weight, but it shoots sub MOA with just about anything.

 

[Franko21]

I thought I would chime in and say that I bought a Defiance XM action, which I understand is a medium length action, and found an M5 bottom metal that fits it at Bugholes....and here I am months later and cant find a stock that will accommodate those components. I am new on this forum, so surely didnt want to highjack the thread by any means, but thought it might be an opportunity to get your guys' thoughts or comments on where a stock could be found. Thank you gentlemen, and if I am out of line please say so and I will back out.
Thank you

XLR Industries also makes a compatible chassis.

 

[KH_Outdoors]

I built my 7 saum on a long action and love it. Imo-the pros outweigh the cons when building a high performance short mag with high bc bullets. You save minimum length and weight with a SA which can easily be made up in other area's. The one that really gets me is the SA on a 26 inch barrel.

I'm running a LA with a 21 inch barrel and a .195 freebore at .15 off the lands. A full case of H1k loaded with a drop tube is driving a 180 hybrid to 2840 for best accuracy of 4 inches at 850.

I had to throw that 300 yard .411 group in there, it was too hot showing mild ejector marks and a mildly stiff bolt lift...

View attachment 414958View attachment 414959

What are the rest of the specs on that load? Powder charge & primer

 

[DUCKMAN11]

I didn't read all 8 pages so far and I'm sure this has been mentioned but there isn't technically a "long action". You have standard length and short. If I was running a creedmoor or 223rem then I'd be happy with a short action. In everything else I'd like to have a long action. Guys who buy short actions to shave weight for back country hunts are funny. You can cut the extra strap material off your pack and save the 5oz difference between long and short. I don't notice the difference in bolt throw between a long and short action when running the actions quickly.