Idaho Investigating Technology Limitations for Rifles

[BrentM]

Deer stats are mind blowing to me. I need controlled hunt data for both Elk and Deer. They have shifted a lot in the last decade. I am not seeing where that data is and I don't think it is part of the general hunt information. I need to get back to work so this is all I can do now.

Year	Take Method	Unit	Harvest	Hunters	Success%	Days	Avg
2023​	All	All	31816​	130342​	24%	730769​	5.6
2013​	All	All	40803​	145355​	28%	742028​	5.1

 

[HutchWV]

Deer stats are mind blowing to me. I need controlled hunt data for both Elk and Deer. They have shifted a lot in the last decade. I am not seeing where that data is and I don't think it is part of the general hunt information. I need to get back to work so this is all I can do now.

Year	Take Method	Unit	Harvest	Hunters	Success%	Days	Avg
2023​	All	All	31816​	130342​	24%	730769​	5.6
2013​	All	All	40803​	145355​	28%	742028​	5.1

if thats idaho, didn't the deer have a massive die off due to winter a few years back? I don't remember the year but I want to say 6 ish years ago. Not to say the wolves and or overhunting didn't hurt a lot, but the combination would be devastating.

 

[bigngreen]

A whole other issue but contributing to the decline in population of game animals. Massive issue for the Idahoans for sure. I am about to the point of not hunting big game anymore, just wolves. In fact, that is my plan this year to a large degree. I love bow hunting in September but I am going to camera hunt this year and pack my rifle. I missed 5 wolves this past winter and I am sick about it. I have new barrel and I am dialing in my rifle now. Should be ready to hit the hills soon.

Does the Dept of Ag have government trappers running in Idaho, in SW MT they keep the wolves shot down, I haven't seen so much as a couple tracks here or there for a couple years, they are there but not in large packs that get into livestock and really hammer the elk.
We've seen an explosion in the bear population now though and I think they are almost as hard on the elk and deer so we're shift to more bear and not really putting much into wolf.

 

[memtb]

Does the Dept of Ag have government trappers running in Idaho, in SW MT they keep the wolves shot down, I haven't seen so much as a couple tracks here or there for a couple years, they are there but not in large packs that get into livestock and really hammer the elk.
We've seen an explosion in the bear population now though and I think they are almost as hard on the elk and deer so we're shift to more bear and not really putting much into wolf.

I want to disagree a bit with the wolf vs bear preditation. I don't see bear predation as a significant problem.

Generally, bears will feed on a carcass until the Magpies would have difficulty getting a meal. Bear populations are much slower to grow than are wolves. Bears, again a general comment, have only a couple of offspring of which they stay with a couple of years before the sow will breed again. Meaning a new cub or two every third year. Bears also, another general comment, kill for feed…..often feeding on another's kill or winter kill.

Wolves, on the other hand have been known to act as "thrill killers"…..getting into a group of elk or deer, maiming or killing as many as they can until their lust is fulfilled. Wolves also breed yearly, often having 4 to 6 pups, their numbers can increase almost exponentially. As I understand it, wolves do not feed on a carcass for lengthy period of time before moving on to another fresh kill. Wolves also can do their finest work when deer/elk are on winter range, often in fairly deep snow, congregated together during their weakest most vulnerable period…..whiles bears are sleeping peacefully " with Sugarplums dancing in their heads"!

Just my perspective about wolves vs bears! memtb

 

[BrentM]

if thats idaho, didn't the deer have a massive die off due to winter a few years back? I don't remember the year but I want to say 6 ish years ago. Not to say the wolves and or overhunting didn't hurt a lot, but the combination would be devastating.

Yes we had that and now CWD. Hunter numbers are down by volume based on the 2 data points which is surprising. I know they created more draw hunts and reduced tags too. I think that draw hunts etc are not in this data. So if the plan is to reduce tags, hunts, hunters, etc for a given unit or zone then overall number shows that. The % of harvest and days hunted is interesting. Slightly more time spent and 4% less success. That number by itself could be a simple change in antlered vs antlerless hunts. I'm just guessing on some of this since I don't have all the numbers to look at. Just what is posted on the site.

 

[David_h]

I have a wolf tag for Idaho and I'll be in the Bitteroot Selway Wilderness this October for elk. Not likely to take a wolf unless I'm tagged out on elk.

 

[BrentM]

Does the Dept of Ag have government trappers running in Idaho, in SW MT they keep the wolves shot down, I haven't seen so much as a couple tracks here or there for a couple years, they are there but not in large packs that get into livestock and really hammer the elk.
We've seen an explosion in the bear population now though and I think they are almost as hard on the elk and deer so we're shift to more bear and not really putting much into wolf.

Unfortunately they don't publish the info like they used to. It's hard to find pack counts etc. They have a lot of paid hunters/trappers who use the collars to track the wolves etc. They are effective. I am just hunter so my intel comes from boots on the ground and just chasing the turds everywhere. I am not very successful either. They have been getting more difficult to hunt or just suck more. Last year was a disaster for me. I only killed the 1, wounded 1, the other 4 were misses. Not my best shooting for **** sure.

 

[HARPERC]

We've seen an explosion in the bear population now though and I think they are almost as hard on the elk and deer so we're shift to more bear and not really putting much into wolf.

Bears are hell on calves 50% at one time SE Washington.

Cats definitely get their share, and their share has increased since wolves run them off kills and they have to kill again.

Idaho made a good move in making 2 bear areas, and extending seasons.

Cows appear to be learning to fight back a bit, and avoidance by moving to less desirable habitat.

Game animals come back well after a bad winter. Unless predator population is high. We've had bears, and cats in the past, adding wolves made a huge difference. We went from in my mind the most coveted tag (in my mind) Shiras Moose within 100 miles of my house, to I think the season should be closed.

 

[southpa]

I want to disagree a bit with the wolf vs bear preditation. I don't see bear predation as a significant problem.

Generally, bears will feed on a carcass until the Magpies would have difficulty getting a meal. Bear populations are much slower to grow than are wolves. Bears, again a general comment, have only a couple of offspring of which they stay with a couple of years before the sow will breed again. Meaning a new cub or two every third year. Bears also, another general comment, kill for feed…..often feeding on another's kill or winter kill.

Wolves, on the other hand have been known to act as "thrill killers"…..getting into a group of elk or deer, maiming or killing as many as they can until their lust is fulfilled. Wolves also breed yearly, often having 4 to 6 pups, their numbers can increase almost exponentially. As I understand it, wolves do not feed on a carcass for lengthy period of time before moving on to another fresh kill. Wolves also can do their finest work when deer/elk are on winter range, often in fairly deep snow, congregated together during their weakest most vulnerable period…..whiles bears are sleeping peacefully " with Sugarplums dancing in their heads"!

Just my perspective about wolves vs bears! memtb

I'm sorry man but this is not correct. There is plenty of evidence out there on studies done in many western states that show bears as not only a significant source of fawn/calf mortality but in many case the #1 cause. I have not met a single biologist that will dispute this. They have become well adapted to killing and eating calf elk, moose and fawn deer during birthing seasons. It's a major part of mortality. They calf and fawn on the same slopes bears are foraging on, all at the same time.

 

[memtb]

Bears are hell on calves 50% at one time SE Washington.

Cats definitely get their share, and their share has increased since wolves run them off kills and they have to kill again.

Idaho made a good move in making 2 bear areas, and extending seasons.

Cows appear to be learning to fight back a bit, and avoidance by moving to less desirable habitat.

Game animals come back well after a bad winter. Unless predator population is high. We've had bears, and cats in the past, adding wolves made a huge difference. We went from in my mind the most coveted tag (in my mind) Shiras Moose within 100 miles of my house, to I think the season should be closed.

From my admittedly limited knowledge, I believe that Washington has a vastly higher number of bears per square mile than does Montana or even Idaho. That could account for the high mortally rate of your live stock and deer/elk. memtb

 

[memtb]

I'm sorry man but this is not correct. There is plenty of evidence out there on studies done in many western states that show bears as not a significant source of fawn/calf mortality but in many case the #1 cause. I have not met a single biologist that will dispute this. They have become well adapted to killing and eating calf elk, moose and fawn deer during birthing seasons. It's a major part of mortality. They calf and fawn on the same slopes bears are foraging on, all at the same time.

I may be incorrect, but I'm struggling with your post conclusions! I'll have to do more research.

I do however question the validity of their findings……as the wolf is the "golden child" of the environmentalist movement, which coincidentally has a very strong foundation in our schools of higher learning/indoctrination! memtb

 

[RichCoyle]

This is a farce. Buying from a farmer is cheaper. We hunt because we are hunters and it's fun.

 

[memtb]

This is a farce. Buying from a farmer is cheaper. We hunt because we are hunters and it's fun.

Very correct…….very few of us could feed our family solely on game when all expense factors involved in hunting are factored in. Obviously there are exceptions to the rule! memtb

 

[nealm66]

I was told by a friend that there's an old trapper up by Bonners Ferry that when he gives it up, there will be a lot more wolves in the area.