Bullet??????

[elkaholic]

I agree with a much heavier bullet than a 185. if you are sticking with Bergers, use the 230 in something the size of the rum and use its potential. A 185 in a rum becomes a varmint bullet. I would also strongly consider the new 212 eldx from Hornady.....Rich

 

[FEENIX]

Another vote for the heavier Berger bullet, esp. the 230 as Rhian noted.

 

[ski-dooz]

I agree with a much heavier bullet than a 185. if you are sticking with Bergers, use the 230 in something the size of the rum and use its potential. A 185 in a rum becomes a varmint bullet. I would also strongly consider the new 212 eldx from Hornady.....Rich

Berger "the 230 is not for hunting"

 

[elkaholic]

Berger "the 230 is not for hunting"

Neither were any of the other Bergers before they found out that they worked!
Case in point: The 140vld hunting bullet was the old target bullet until they put a thicker jacket on the target version. There are examples in about every other size as well......Rich

 

[ski-dooz]

I see a lot of exits, but we also see a lot of blood trails because their lungs are blown to shreds and every time they cough you get a spray of blood out their mouth and the entrance. I honestly haven't had to trail an elk since shooting Bergers cause I watch them flop over after a few steps but when you get up to them it's a mess usually.
I used to run Barnes, ran Cutting edge but the Bergers when used properly will out perform them. I will run some Hammers because I'm liking that their looking a little more frangible but I'll still run as heavy as I can.
Search for threads by Broz, he's extensively documented a lot of kills, 80 head of elk last year alone with Bergers, I've piled up a lot with them as well on cull hunts but haven't done nearly as good of job documenting it. Search out guys who know how to get the most out of them and pick their brains!!

That's funny my dad shot 2 Whitetials and no pass through at 175 yards. I don't know what I'm missing? I used to use a 6mm with 95gr partition pass through every time.

 

[bigngreen]

Berger "the 230 is not for hunting"

It's one of the best bullets for hunting but it's initial application was not for hunting as with a lot of bullets we loaded them and test them and found it will give us epic performance on game, there are a lot of " hunting" bullets you could not give me for hunting!!!

 

[ski-dooz]

I will say that if you want to shoot high velocity and flat you can have a bullet that will hold enough weight to pass through and damage the vitals all the way through them. Not wreck the surrounding meat. Shed the nose of the bullet in large enough pieces that continue to penetrate and do damage. Open up in the same way down to 1800fps. You can.

Steve

I'm shooting 185 at 3250, 91.5 rl25, I jut don't know what to think. I know I hit that elk last year! it stumbled before it ran. I think the difference was I jumped the elk and most of these guys probably are shooting them when they don't know anything is wrong. My buddy shot one 700yards {185 Bergers} that was feeding on a hill and it didn't know what happened.

 

[ski-dooz]

It's one of the best bullets for hunting but it's initial application was not for hunting as with a lot of bullets we loaded them and test them and found it will give us epic performance on game, there are a lot of " hunting" bullets you could not give me for hunting!!!

so what's your hunting setup?

 

[elkaholic]

I'm shooting 185 at 3250, 91.5 rl25, I jut don't know what to think. I know I hit that elk last year! it stumbled before it ran. I think the difference was I jumped the elk and most of these guys probably are shooting them when they don't know anything is wrong. My buddy shot one 700yards {185 Bergers} that was feeding on a hill and it didn't know what happened.

Again, a 185 traveling at 3250 is pretty much an over sized varmint load! You need more mass to keep the momentum after a lot of the bullet has shed. This is why you get an exit with a heavier bullet that is frangible and not with a lighter one. It boils down to sectional density.....Rich

 

[MudRunner2005]

I'm shooting 185 at 3250, 91.5 rl25, I jut don't know what to think. I know I hit that elk last year! it stumbled before it ran. I think the difference was I jumped the elk and most of these guys probably are shooting them when they don't know anything is wrong. My buddy shot one 700yards {185 Bergers} that was feeding on a hill and it didn't know what happened.

And until now you fail to mention this...Because this would play a HUGE factor into how the animal reacts when shot. Adrenaline makes for a whole different scenario. If the animal moves or twitches as the bullet hits it, it can fudge your shot, anything can happen when shooting something alive.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

And until now you fail to mention this...Because this would play a HUGE factor into how the animal reacts when shot. Adrenaline makes for a whole different scenario. If the animal moves or twitches as the bullet hits it, it can fudge your shot, anything can happen when shooting something alive.

I'll drop moving critters all day long with hornady, sierra, and nosler... They hit the ground like a sack of spuds ( the runners dig a furrow) if you do your part; just gotta get the front half of the critter or go Texas on them... I want a hole in, a hole out, a whole lot of messed up clockwork, and preferably a couple of broken bones from a bullet hit. The exit hole is where most of your blood trail comes from, in the unlikely event you need one. No exit hole is a very bad thing imo...

 

[ski-dooz]

I'll drop moving critters all day long with hornady, sierra, and nosler... They hit the ground like a sack of spuds ( the runners dig a furrow) if you do your part; just gotta get the front half of the critter or go Texas on them... I want a hole in, a hole out, a whole lot of messed up clockwork, and preferably a couple of broken bones from a bullet hit. The exit hole is where most of your blood trail comes from, in the unlikely event you need one. No exit hole is a very bad thing imo...

Right and that's why I started this because I never get one deer, elk, fox anything I shoot.

 

[Edd]

............. I used to use a 6mm with 95gr partition pass through every time.

Why do you not use a partition in your 300 RUM?

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Again, a 185 traveling at 3250 is pretty much an over sized varmint load! You need more mass to keep the momentum after a lot of the bullet has shed. This is why you get an exit with a heavier bullet that is frangible and not with a lighter one. It boils down to sectional density.....Rich

I don't want to be argumentative here but at what speed is the 215g or the 230g an over sized varmint load? What impact velocity is the 185 good for? A few years ago a 185 was considered a big 30 cal bullet.

This stuff is the reason I got into making bullets. This notion that a bullet has not done it's job unless it sticks in the hide on the far side is preposterous. That would mean you have to have exactly the right impact velocity and thickness of animal. There is no such thing as knock down power. It is a myth. If you hit an elk with any bullet from a hand held rifle that did not penetrate and bounced off making the animal take all of the energy from the bullet it would not even knock them off balance let alone knock them down. It takes internal destruction to kill them. The faster a bullet is traveling the more destruction it causes unless it stays pointed or does not penetrate far enough. If the bullet deforms into a square front like a dangerous game bullet and displaces soft tissue perpendicular to the direction of travel all the way though the animal then it has done it's job. The faster it is traveling the farther it displaces the soft tissue. So it is better to pass through faster.

The old timers in Alaska used to load bullets backwards for close up grizzly shots. Because they would hold their weight, penetrate deep, and displace soft tissue perpendicular the travel of the bullet.

Animals die from bleeding to death in order to shut down the central nervous system, or hitting the central nervous system directly, or infection when shot.

Now if you want to use a bullet that comes completely undone for hunting big game you had better use the biggest thing you can get a hold of in hopes that the weight of the bullet can overcome the disintegration and travel far enough through the animal to cause the central nervous system to shut down.

I will end this by saying that no bullet is perfect and no two shots are identical. A good hunter is always ready for a follow up shot and able to track an animal that has been hit.

Steve