Berger VLD Hunting for Elk - Success??

[snox801]

I don't think I've seen a bullet with so many varied reports of performance. It seems the truth has to be somewhere in the middle.

I always say I compare them to mechanical broadsheads.
When they work they are very effective, when they don't you lose game.
So my take is if I pay for a hunt. I want to eliminate even the slightest chance to not bag my game be it a not perfect shot or bullet not opening.
I'll take a bit of a track job and recover animal over drt. Hence why I've moved slowly to hammers or cutting edge. I don't expect to hit my elk at less than 100 but the chance came and I took it free hand on a moving elk. Shoulder didn't matter.
That being said it all depends on the size of round to start. If Berger made a 400gr .375 I'd rock that for sure. If it didn't open still big hole. If it is a close shot the mass will help.

 

[Buck100]

Have you used the 7mm 180 gr Berger VLD hunting successfully on elk?

I have a new rifle chambered for a Nosler 28 that is amazing accurate with an MOA of 0.2. HOWEVER, it really likes the Berger VLD hunting. I have heard from some of my buddies that this Berger has shown inconsistent performance in the field - penciling or exploding at closer range. I have tried my favorite bullets - Barnes TTSX or Accubond LR - with no success. I took two whitetail deer with this bullet this season with good results but they were broadside shots in the vitals. Thanks

Over the years I've taken many elk using Berger 185gr VLD's in my 300 Weatherby. My longest kill was 737 yards in OR. I used the 115gr Berger in my 257 Weatherby with two kills, one at 300 yards and the other at 330. The 180gr Accubond is also a great round. I used that this year in a Weatherby 30-378 after taking the Mark Thompson long range course. I took a 350 class bull at 400 yards in UT and then a 330 bull in NM at 125 yards. My experience is they both are consistent performers. I've had similar success with deer also. It depends on what your rifle likes best and shot placement.

 

[snox801]

Thank you for all the responses. Did not mean to open old wounds. Just looking to learn from others....

I really like the accuracy of the Bergers and would like to keep using them for longer ranges (beyond 125 yards with velocities ~3,000fps). Of course, I could just carry my 30-06 with a custom 180gr Barnes load. It is almost as accurate and just get within 400 yards. I have taken more elk with this rifle (a non-custom Savage) than any other weapon.

I am putting in tags for WY and MT next year for Elk. Hoping for unit 59 in WY but that might take a few more years to draw, as well as, a a general tag in MT - I have hunted the Bitteroots for many years.

I appreciate new threads. Unlike others I'd rather this than old ones. Mainly because people get lost in old ones and stuff changes all the time. They change copper or manufacturing techniques. So new threads are fine by me.
I know I'll get flamed for even bringing this up but if you like Barnes try the hammers. They are easy to load for and shoot great. Best killing bullet I've ever used mono or cup core. They seem to act like a partition that has a decent bc. Do think I've even shot a Barnes since and even shoot very few cutting edge now mainly cause I bought them and may well use them.

 

[Pdvdh]

I don't think I've seen a bullet with so many varied reports of performance. It seems the truth has to be somewhere in the middle.

Or their terminal performance is inconsistent within the MV ranges being used in big game animals.

"In the middle" is probably the most common experience, but would lack the Burgers than explode with insufficient penetration, or pencil thru without expanding, both of which I've experienced. I use them to kill paper targets.

Put one in muscle and they're a meat shredder.

 

[Netz]

Have you used the 7mm 180 gr Berger VLD hunting successfully on elk?

I have a new rifle chambered for a Nosler 28 that is amazing accurate with an MOA of 0.2. HOWEVER, it really likes the Berger VLD hunting. I have heard from some of my buddies that this Berger has shown inconsistent performance in the field - penciling or exploding at closer range. I have tried my favorite bullets - Barnes TTSX or Accubond LR - with no success. I took two whitetail deer with this bullet this season with good results but they were broadside shots in the vitals. Thanks

I have been shooting Berger 180gr VLD hybrids for 12 years in my 7mag for deer and elk and never experienced the problems described above.

 

[Longtine88]

I have posted this before. Here you go:
I will start this with a few observations. All bullets are designed with a use in mind. There is no one size fits all in bullets. I have no problems with other bullets. I have taken Barnes TTSX's and Nosler accubonds to Africa. Both have served me well. This last trip I took Bergers. I usually get extremely good accuracy and good results with them. Bergers are often used in longer range hunting and are designed to expand reliably at lower velocities. If you plan to use them I will strongly suggest that you heed the next observations:
1) Use heavy for caliber bullets. I used 180 grainers in my 7mm SAUM. If you use a faster bigger .28 caliber cartridges then use their 195 grainers. In .30 caliber use the 215 grain hybrid. Easy to load and deadly effective on game. In a .26 caliber use the 140's or 156's. Apply the same to other calibers.
2) Always check the points. Bergers are a hollow point design. Occasionally the point will be "clogged or closed". That bullet, if not opened, will act like a solid and pencil through an animal. A small drill bit should be used to make sure they are all open. If closed then use that one for practice or drill it open.
3) Do not expect reliable expansion at over 3000 fps. You are more likely to get over expansion at higher velocities along with poor penetration. My SAUM runs the 180's at 2900 fps. That is about right. My .30 Nosler runs the 215's at 2990. Works well too. I would not run them at 3200 fps and expect reliable close range expansion.
On to the point of this post. 16 animals of assorted sizes were taken with my SAUM and the 180 gr bullet's. They are as follows:
1) Cape eland cow at 469 yards. Hit slightly further back than wanted. Down and dead quickly.
2)Cape eland bull at 511 yds. Heart shot. Dead in less than 20 yds. Pretty impressive.
3)Springbock at 175-200 yds. Broadside shot slightly back and high. Down in its tracks.
4)Duiker spotlighted at maybe 40 yds quartering to me. High shoulder down in his tracks.
5)Vaal Rhebuck at 313 yds. Hit way back top of back. Spine hit. Down in his tracks.
6) Klipspringer at 269 yds. A little far back and high. Down and done in place.
7)Blesbuck cow at 130 yds? Back a little and a little high. Down immediately with no fuss.
8) Bull Livingston eland. Huge animal. 75 yds. First hit was high shoulder. Sraggered him. Went perhaps 75 yds and He appeared to be staggering when I hit him again up high mid body which put him down.
9)Hartebeest cow at 200 yds. Quartering slightly to me. Hit mid way up behind the shoulder. Went 40-50 yds.
10)2nd Hartebeest cow. Broadside at 80-90 yds. Hit behind shoulder. Went 30 yds or so.
11)Hartebeest bull at 150-170 yds quartering to me. Low shoulder into the heart. Went maybe 60 yds.
12) Bushbuck at 200 yds or a little more. Hit a little high behind the shoulder. Went perhaps 30 yds.
Mikes animals as follows:
1)Waterbuck at 150 yds broadside. Hit behind shoulder. Went about 70 yds.
2)Puku at 80-90 yds perhaps. Quartering hard away. Hit in front of hind quarter lining up on far shoulder. Went about 40 yds.
3)Bushbuck at 120 yds. Broadside. Behind shoulder. Went 25 yds.
4)Lechwe at 230 yds. Behind shoulder half way up. Down in its tracks. Kicked twice.
I will add the following NA animals for additional consideration:
A) 6.5-06 w/ 140 grain bullet. Bighorn ram at 100 yds. Broadside. Hit back too far. Got liver. Went perhaps 100 yds.
B) 180 in the SAUM. Antelope at 130 yds. A little high behind shoulder. Down in his tracks.
C)180 in SAUM Whitetail doe. 75 yds facing me. Down in her tracks.
D) 180 in SAUM WT buck. 300 yds. 1 shot in leg and one mid body. Went perhaps 30 yds.
E) 215 gr in .30 Nosler. Bull moose at just over 100 yds. Quartering to me. In front of shoulder. Went less than 20 yds.
F) 6.5 SS w/ 156 gr. Whitetail buck at 20 yds. Quartering away. High behind shoulder. Down in his tracks.
G) 6.5 w/ 156 gr Pronghorn buck. Broadside. Hit slightly low behind shoulder. Went 25 yds.
H) 6.5 w/ 156 gr. Pronghorn doe at 325 yds. Behind shoulder a touch high. Down in her tracks.
Notice that I needed more than 1 shot on a wt buck that I screwed up on and the Livingston eland that likely didn't need it.

Remember that an eland bull is huge. My Livingston bull was bigger than my cape buffalo taken on that hunt. Likely over 1800 lbs. The cape eland bull was over 1200 lbs. Used properly Berger's are deadly. I'm running the hunting VLD's. Its reputed that the target VLD's have a slightly thicker jacked. I haven't needed it.......
Bruce

Bruce we all have seen that post before and like everyone else I'm glad you post it every time this topic comes up. It's a perfect example of a great bullet that is highly effective and you my sir should have a Berger commercial!

 

[L.Sherm]

I new it!! Thought maybe about week ago most would have learned. Everybody just needs to shoot what they want and threads like these every week dont even need to be started. Just turns into a 15-20
back and forth

 

[snox801]

I new it!! Thought maybe about week ago most would have learned. Everybody just needs to shoot what they want and threads like these every week dont even need to be started. Just turns into a 15-20
back and forth

I don't think this has turned into and bad bad and forth. Seems most just have experiences and are sharing them. I don't see anything. wrong with that. In fact I thought this one was good. Op can take good and bad posts and use that to make a a judgement for themselves. That's what I look for when I post something like this.
Part of why I like this site. Everyone even if we disagree tend to respect each other. I have lots of members I respect a ton and are much more experienced than myself that I still can disagree with.

 

[338 dude]

Should of said vld! My bad

I knew what you meant ,you must have an iPhone .mine does not understand the language I speak either

 

[L.Sherm]

I don't think this has turned into and bad bad and forth. Seems most just have experiences and are sharing them. I don't see anything. wrong with that. In fact I thought this one was good. Op can take good and bad posts and use that to make a a judgement for themselves. That's what I look for when I post something like this.
Part of why I like this site. Everyone even if we disagree tend to respect each other. I have lots of members I respect a ton and are much more experienced than myself that I still can disagree with.

How many threads have been started by this exact same thing? and then what do they turn into?

 

[snox801]

I see your point but like stated before. New threads can be good because things change. Seems at one point Barnes had an issue with copper being to hard and not opening. They have since changed.
Again I'm not sure why people can't just say what the prefer and let the poster decide. No hard feelings on my part. I use what I like and if you don't use the same I don't really care.

 

[L.Sherm]

Things don't change every week. Seems these bullet threads are the worst.
Redundancy gets old, were all here to learn but I dont think pounding a bullet thread into the ground every week it seems. Some things just seem to be left alone is a better option.

 

[MallardAddict]

I've used the 180 hybrid from a 28 Nosler, 215 from 300 WM and the 185 from a 300 wsm. I don't use them when I expect shots may be under 300 or so yds to give them a little space to slow down. I ensure the tips are open before loading and purposely keep them out of big bones unless the range is 600+ And have never had an issue with expansion or terminal results.

That said they aren't perfect for every use and if most of my shots where I am going will be more in the range of 50-400 or thick timber I would shoot something like a Barnes for their ability to hold together up close.

Just how I do it but I have several rifles set up for different terrain.

 

[Rum Man]

Well in my opinion that why they make so many bullet choices ...
I'm positive not everyone on the forum drives a Cadillac...
So in my experience with the Bergers they have been amazing ! But I only have 44 critters nailed to the wall ...so far !
I'm about to use some 95 gr in a 243 . But my favorite is the 300 gr. Bergers! They flat put a hurtin on Elk, and Bear .
My last Elk was takin at 1244 yards with the 338 Edge & 300 gr bergers.

If your not sure send those 7mm 180's over and I have a 7mm mag ready to test them !
In all my years of hunting the very first thing that comes to my mind is placement...I relize we all get excited when taking game so you have to try your best to put any bullet in the right spot for it to work .

I do agree as posted above , this bullet bashing /discussion has been beat to death .
Just use them and I'm positive you wont have any trouble !

Rum Man