Ballistic Turret vs Hold Over Lines

[memtb]

I decided last summer that I wanted to be a "dialer". I practiced all summer, figured out my drops, then on opening morning of elk season I dialed for a 680 yard shot that never materialized. Before putting my caps back on I returned dial to zero with my heart still pounding from the excitement of the near-opportunity. Later that day I found another 6 point and ended up sneaking to within 200 yards (perfect, I'm zero'd for 200). Breath, squeeze, boom .... "you missed" my buddy said. Reload, repeat.... "missed high". Reload, repeat "same spot".

I basically shot two complete revolutions over him. When I dialed back "down" that morning, I actually dialed up and completed the second rotation up.

Now I use my hold over marks and have been hammering rock chucks. Apparently my lizard brain resorts back to my childhood tendencies when stakes are high, hold high and let fly (except that now I have the equipment, form and knowhow)

With our first turrets built for our Leupold CDS scopes, not thinking, when asked by the Leupold man if I wanted "zero-stop" (allowing only one revolution) .....I said no! I quickly realized that this could present a problem, figuring this out just playing around with it here at the house. I had Leupold build us new turrets ( on our dime). It's pretty hard to "screw-up" now! Yes....it limits our long range capabilities. But, for hunting rifles, I figured that 800+ yards, is plenty far enough for our needs! memtb

 

[zog]

The colored click indicators are only good for yardages at whatever zoom you set them up for. If you set them up for, say, 400, 500, and 600 yds you will most likely do so at full zoom and that's the only power they will be those yardages.

zog,

On my z5 5-25X52 BT the clicks were either 1/4" at 100 or 1/4MOA. I don't remember. There's so little difference it would take a bench rest rifle to demonstrate the difference. A 1/4" at 100 yards is 1/2" at 200 and 3/4" at 300 etc. A 1/4 MOA is about 1/4" at 100 yards and about 1/2" at 200 yards and about 3/4" at 300 yards etc. The difference would be measured in thousandths of an inch.

Yes, I think I was wrong about this. The click count should be good at any magnification. Swaro's application does not have a magnification adjustment for BT click count.

Makes sense - in the old days before dial-a-range, we adjusted our zero and left it there regardless of zoom power. So the BT click count should be the same way. I emailed Swaro to clarify this.

If so this is a big advantage of using BT clicks rather than reticle tension holds - BT click count should work at any magnification.

The math works on the table below - exactly 1/4" per 100 yd . . . 80.69"/7 = 11.53"/100 yd. 11.53"/46 clicks = 0.250"/click

 

[the blur]

The last 4 animals I shoot. I just aimed and pulled the trigger. The scope was on the lowest magnification. Longest was about 200 yards. I can't imagine making hunting more complicated..

 

[memtb]

The last 4 animals I shoot. I just aimed and pulled the trigger. The scope was on the lowest magnification. Longest was about 200 yards. I can't imagine making hunting more complicated..

Yep.....strong argument for a flat shooting cartridge and a 300 yard zero. Beyond 400 yrds, now it starts getting a little more "complicated"! memtb

 

[zog]

The last 4 animals I shoot. I just aimed and pulled the trigger. The scope was on the lowest magnification. Longest was about 200 yards. I can't imagine making hunting more complicated..

Ha - I actually set out to do the complicated thing and shoot longer distances. MOre of a hobby and a fascination.

Quick story - the first time I learned long range equipment was about 8 years ago on an antelope hunt with a friend who had Huskemaw scope and custom bullets to match. I spent about four weeks perfecting shots out to about 600-700 yds. . . . . Time for the hunt - I found my buck at about 550 yds, slowly going away. They either didn't know I was there or didn't care at that distance . . . Had plenty of time to set up on a small rise with a bit of a drop in front of me. I guess I must have been vewy vewy quiet, plus the wind was coming right at me . . . as I was doing my dialing, aiming, and dry-fire warm ups on the 600 yd shot, suddenly my scope was full of blurry brown and white hair. A nice buck was about 20 yds just off the drop, must have just woken up, looking upwind and didn't know I was there. I had to aim over top of the $3000 scope and turret, using the top as an open sight. Dead buck at 33 yds!!

 

[the blur]

The last 4 animals I shoot. I just aimed and pulled the trigger. The scope was on the lowest magnification. Longest was about 200 yards. I can't imagine making hunting more complicated..

Besides shooting all 4 animals at the lowest magnification, I have all these fancy scopes. Zeiss, SAV Z6, Vortex..... that could easily zoom in an see every brow tine.. and probably watch the animal breath if I wanted too.

I once had an Elk walk within 20 yards, and I missed !!! because I couldn't aim.

 

[zog]

OK, so for anybody who might have been following - I did get my email back from Swaro this morning confirming that the BT settings are the same at any magnification. Big reason to use BT over BRX reticle - you can get a higher power scope for when you want it, or dial it back and still use the same holds.

 

[the blur]

Would you agree the best of both worlds are to have the BRX/BRH reticle, & also a BT?
This way, 300-400 yards, you can hold over, and anything beyond that, you can dial.

The way I see it, 300-400 yards, the animal may wind you. 500 yards, the animal may not be so skittish.

 

[BountyHunter]

I do not understand why someone who claims dial up is better that has to use a ballistic program to get his dial ups does not understand that you can do exactly the same with any ballistic reticle at any power with the same ballistic program. It is not rocket science. If you can do one, you can do the other. A simple 3x5 card with powers and ranges at each bar with that power is all it takes. I have killed coyotes at 780 using a 3x9 TDS reticle doing that.

 

[Varmint Hunter]

Would you agree the best of both worlds are to have the BRX/BRH reticle, & also a BT?
This way, 300-400 yards, you can hold over, and anything beyond that, you can dial.

The way I see it, 300-400 yards, the animal may wind you. 500 yards, the animal may not be so skittish.

I tend to disagree because the BT feature can be used on any magnification and the BRX/BRH reticle can not. Under the pressure of getting a good shot off in time, it sounds like an easy way to make a mistake.

 

[the blur]

For those of us that wear distance glasses, and reading glasses; I can't imagine looking at a turret.

 

[milo-2]

I assume most of you do not care for FFP scopes for hunting, yet rely on a holdover, therefore needing a certain magnification to work, if you have time to ensure that, do you not have time to dial?
Also, I see a few posts referring to clicks, are your turrets not marked? 12 clicks in moa is 3 moa, 26 clicks would be 6.5 moa, way easier system IMO.
I have always said, if you have time to LRF an animal, you have time to dial your up dope.
Also one guy made a comment dials do not always return the reticle to where it needs to be, scope would be defective in that case, so if the dial wont bring the reticle back where it needs to be, who is to say the reticle is in the right place for a holdover to work?
I fought going to FFP scopes myself, today it'd be tough not going FFP, and zero stop is a deal breaker, what a simple feature to restart from if things get blurred.

 

[zog]

Would you agree the best of both worlds are to have the BRX/BRH reticle, & also a BT?

Yes, for sure. I sure wish Swaro would offer that at retail in all their BT scopes. Unfortunately I found out (posts above) that for Z3 and Z5, you have to send your scope in to them with about $200 and wait about eight weeks to get a BRH reticle added to a BT, or vice versa.

 

[bigngreen]

I do not understand why someone who claims dial up is better that has to use a ballistic program to get his dial ups does not understand that you can do exactly the same with any ballistic reticle at any power with the same ballistic program. It is not rocket science. If you can do one, you can do the other. A simple 3x5 card with powers and ranges at each bar with that power is all it takes. I have killed coyotes at 780 using a 3x9 TDS reticle doing that.

I tried this for a year, took more time and less accurate than just throwing on the exact correction and putting a bullet though the POA, it is an advantage of a SFP optic though.