Apex afterburner a few impact resistance results

[jessej]

Mark, you keep workin at it. I want you to build the best bullet that's ever left a barrel.
Soon as you do, someone else will be tryin to build one better than you.
Fordy, you keep testing and filling us in.

I gotta go unwind or I'm gonna flare my gout up.

 

[wilkup]

Sorry bout that rant. I been watching the new "normal " people today.
Skinny jean wearing pansies with hoops in their ears trying to raise a new generation of productive citizens. No chance.

It's got me on edge

You're not wrong

 

[ButterBean]

One of my favorite sayings
" There are folks that live on the borderline and then there's folks that are just boards "

 

[jessej]

I am alive, straddling the edge between sublime, and ridiculousness, and this is exactly where I belong

 

[NorthRiverGuide]

I don't want to be normal. Matter of fact, I strive to be far outside the realm of normal.
I want to shoot better farther faster, climb higher, dive deeper…..you get the picture.
I don't own a 30-06, if I were satisfied with normal and mediocrity I would.
Did our founding fathers want to be normal and live within their given government limits or did they desire to exceed. We as a nation need MEN to push limits, excel, develop better products, better procedures,,,,, we freakin need to get our AMBITION back!
Good enough ain't good enough for me!

I don't own a 3006 either but owning a cartridge doesn't make you boring or mediocre. You seem to be missing the point. If you want to push limits good for you. However that doesn't represent everyone. Nor does this help the majority of people especially in the long range game where this forum is focused. It's amazing how many people here take stuff out of context and see what they want to see. I have no problem pushing limitations but I also understand that the data gained isn't necessary beneficial to the majority of people and situations. I'm always pushing myself and upgrading equipment to be as effective as possible.

 

[ButterBean]

I don't own a 3006 either but owning a cartridge doesn't make you boring or mediocre. You seem to be missing the point. If you want to push limits good for you. However that doesn't represent everyone. Nor does this help the majority of people especially in the long range game where this forum is focused. It's amazing how many people here take stuff out of context and see what they want to see. I have no problem pushing limitations but I also understand that the data gained isn't necessary beneficial to the majority of people and situations. I'm always pushing myself and upgrading equipment to be as effective as possible.

Looks to me as you are the one missing the point

 

[Hard rock]

Long barrel?

26 Proof 1-8

 

[bamban]

I don't want to be normal. Matter of fact, I strive to be far outside the realm of normal.
I want to shoot better farther faster, climb higher, dive deeper…..you get the picture.
I don't own a 30-06, if I were satisfied with normal and mediocrity I would.
Did our founding fathers want to be normal and live within their given government limits or did they desire to exceed. We as a nation need MEN to push limits, excel, develop better products, better procedures,,,,, we freakin need to get our AMBITION back!
Good enough ain't good enough for me!

Dang, that hurts... four 300WMs, 30 Nosler, 280AI in the stable, yet I had more fun with the 30-06 lighting the Magnetospeed hit indicator at 1200... with not so normal 215 Hybrids in an 06.

Cheers, bro. Busting your chops.

Do you want challenge? Grab a 223 gas gun with irons, sling, and jacket, and shoot against magnums, and Palma guns at 1000 yards prone match

 

[fordy]

Gday
Here's a little quiz that may shed some light

Go back to your first ever hunting days & answer the following list please

What were you running in pill weight / type , sights/optics , twist ,rests, Caliber , binos, rangefinder, wind meter, powder type , stock construction & style , chrony , apps , ballistic calculator your range capabilities & bullet speeds

Now do a time line every 5yrs till the current day ( if not old enough do one with m&d or like ) & im pretty sure you'll answer the question of what was once needed & wanted then along in that time line till today the wanted now becomes the needed or @ the minimum it's moved somewhat
Hmmm do we see a pattern ?
If not that's cool & I say well done but just in case I have to sharpen the tool once again

( For those who don't know who the tool is that fine he does as I called him that in another thread & imo rightly so )

Yes sir take this on board before you hit the keyboard

you can't tell me your feet hurt if you haven't walked a mile in my shoes !!!
Yes it's that simple or do I need to spell that out also

Do we keep going or are we going to call a truce ? the ball is in your court sunshine

Cheers to the nice people

 

[jessej]

 

[codyadams]

Well this is another one gone down the drain.

Thanks for the initial testing.

 

[Jonoton]

I think that if we are being honest with ourselves, all North America hunting, outside of exotics, could be addressed with the following cartridges:

• .22lr
• .223Rem
• .308win
• 300wm
• 12g
• 44m

Maybe add another magnum cartridge for bear, 338WM or something along those lines

I do not think that pursuit of the highest level of ballistic performance in order to extend effective hunting ranges is due to necessity, but rather a passion for hunting at extended distances necessitating a continued development of optimized toolsets and also skill to implement it. And that process is cyclical.

And more power to you, if that is your passion! I DO NOT discount the skill involved in being ethically effective at these 1000yd plus ranges, or the thoughtful development of the rifles and cartridges necessary to get there. I am an engineer and love seeing this continued iterative development, even if I don't participate in being on that bleeding edge.

However, and this is where it will get contentious, I do not buy into the line of thinking that pushing the limits is necessary to fully engage in this hobby, or even in the best interest of the average hunter and the game they pursue.

Anyways, those are my thoughts regarding the current tangent of this thread. I myself do not have the time, energy or funds to work towards extending my effective range much further than 400yds. Nowadays, getting an animal on the ground to the best of my ability within that range is really my only concern, and secondarily in the most cost effective way I can manage.

Cheers! Let's remember that all us of here are most centrally interested in taking game at or within the limits of our own personal range, and everybody's passion towards that end need not result in infighting over ones chosen method and tools of doing so.

EDIT: I meant to include that the original subject of this thread, the Apex Afterburner bullets and Apex Outdoor's products as a whole, look to me like a very high quality and effective part of the toolbox I have attempted to describe, and I place a huge value on products of small companies where you can talk directly to the guy designing and making the product.

 

[jessej]

Cheers! Let's remember that all us of here are most centrally interested in taking game at or within the limits of our own personal range, and everybody's passion towards that end need not result in infighting over ones chosen method and tools of doing so.

and I place a huge value on products of small companies where you can talk directly to the guy designing and making the product.

Absolutely. On both statements

 

[NorthRiverGuide]

Gday
Here's a little quiz that may shed some light

Go back to your first ever hunting days & answer the following list please

What were you running in pill weight / type , sights/optics , twist ,rests, Caliber , binos, rangefinder, wind meter, powder type , stock construction & style , chrony , apps , ballistic calculator your range capabilities & bullet speeds

Now do a time line every 5yrs till the current day ( if not old enough do one with m&d or like ) & im pretty sure you'll answer the question of what was once needed & wanted then along in that time line till today the wanted now becomes the needed or @ the minimum it's moved somewhat
Hmmm do we see a pattern ?
If not that's cool & I say well done but just in case I have to sharpen the tool once again

( For those who don't know who the tool is that fine he does as I called him that in another thread & imo rightly so )

Yes sir take this on board before you hit the keyboard

you can't tell me your feet hurt if you haven't walked a mile in my shoes !!!
Yes it's that simple or do I need to spell that out also

Do we keep going or are we going to call a truce ? the ball is in your court sunshine

Cheers to the nice people

Fordy

Some friendly advice if you're going to try and offer a truce. Insulting them by calling them a tool isn't a great way. Since you seem to want to bring this out in the open I will. First you have zero room to lecture anyone. You complain that I questioned your 600 animals in 12 hours. You said that you shouldn't be questioned. Yet you liked your friends accusing me of having a agenda, being a troll, being after hammer, lying, being a former member, insults, etc. You have even joined in on it and I've seen in threads where the same thing has been done to others. You are perfectly okay with that unless it's directed at you or your friends/Hammer bullets. Being a hypocrite saying one thing a doing another. I made a comment here that other people have said too yet you target me to call out. Butterbean has been trolling my comments. Which is ironic because he claims to hate trolls and people who stir the pot yet that's mostly what he does here. Only thing I've read here so far from him besides trolling, agreeing with his friends, making up conspiracy theories, etc is the mil comments. He claimed to shoot 500 yards all the time yet didn't know what a mil is. He got corrected by multiple people. You bring up my getting clarification from Steve about the gel like that's wrong or I'm after him. Except I was right and Steve admitted it. You conveniently forgot to mention that. Also I corrected George of badlands bullets on something and he was professional about it. The funny part is Steve liked my comments correcting him. So again there's a double standard here. It's okay to do to anyone except your circle of friends. I'm also not the one starting stuff here I simply made a comment. You guys are the ones trying to make a simple comment into something it's not. My comment is right and accurate as most people don't push those extremes so where it's interesting to see doesn't give the average person any data. As far as it's not necessary that's also true. There's plenty of bullets that work incredibly in normal velocity ranges even low velocity for long range hunting what this forum is about. Pushing high velocity isn't new and your not doing anything that hasn't been done before. What has been found time and time again is that there's no real benefit to pushing extreme velocities especially at long range. Let's look at a example you are running a 124 gr hammer hunter at 4200 fps in a 300 from what I've read. Now at 1000 yards in a ballistics calculator it shows a impact velocity of 1564 fps and energy of 673 ft lbs. Now if we run a 208 eld match out of a 300 with a mv of 3000 fps which I run as one of my setups. At 1000 yards it has a impact velocity of 1796 fps with energy of 1490 ft lbs. So the regular setup in normal velocity range and 1200 fps slower out performs the light bullet super fast. Regular velocity, more energy, doesn't bleed off velocity as fast, higher bc, less wind drift, less powder, longer barrel life, costs less, etc. I don't need to push the extremes you do because ultimately there's no benefit to doing it. It's been done before and abandoned for good reason. BC will always win out over velocity. Not wanting to do the same thing as you doesn't mean someone is wrong. Nor does it mean we aren't moving forward or advancing. I've got guns and equipment that cost more then some peoples cars. I'm always updating and trying new things. What you're doing isn't new or the future. You might want to think that but it's simply not true. Experts like Brian litz, accuracy first development group, etc have been doing extensive testing for years including what you're doing testing the limitations of bullets. All of them have found the same conclusion. Good on you for wanting to push limits. However understand just because you want to do it doesn't mean people who don't do it are wrong or stuck in the past. If you want a "truce" as you call it. You might want to look in the mirror first. You don't want issues then you, Butterbean, etc stop trolling, insulting, accusing, etc. I've had multiple private messages from people as well as reading. The top guys here for causing drama is what people call the hammer supporters. Butterbean is at the top of most peoples list especially to ignore. Also get some thicker skin because anytime you post stuff like this people will question it and comment on it. Getting defensive over a comment discussing it doesn't help you at all. If you notice I have plenty of good conversations here with no issues discussing stuff. It's not until the few Hammer fan club like Butterbean and yourself start in that there becomes issues. Honestly I can care less about you and your friends. Between you guys and Steve I'll pass on buying hammer bullets. I'll spend my money with companies that have good customer service. Not ones where the owner accuses you of stuff for no reason and trash talks you. Unless one of the hammer fans wants to actually have a conversation I'm just going to ignore you guys. There's plenty of good people in here who don't act like you guys. You want better conversations quit jumping to conclusions and acting like every comment is a personal attack.