AMP Annealer VS No annealing Vs Torch Head Annealer Vs 2nd/3rd Shot

[jdmecomber]

Test 2 is in the books and even once fired brass is giving inconsistent extreme spreads and SDs if not annealed.

 

[Wedgy]

Test 2 is in the books and even once fired brass is giving inconsistent extreme spreads and SDs if not annealed.

Yes but I think more firings will show the difference in the methods of annealing

 

[jdmecomber]

Test 2 second firing of all groups

Group 1 Amp annealed
1 2876 ES 11 SD 4
2 2883
3 2880
4 2887
5 2883

Group 2 anneal after 2 times fired
1 2868 ES 46 SD 18
2 2858
3 2904
4 2888
5 2894

Group 3 Torch Head Annealer no Tempilaq
1 2881 ES 17 SD 6
2 2887
3 2874
4 2889
5 2891

Group 4 anneal after 3 times fired
1 2904 ES 33 SD 11
2 2909
3 2891
4 2901
5 2876

Group 5 no annealing
1 2880 ES 31 SD 11
2 2896
3 2902
4 2911
5 2901

Already you have 3 groups not annealed 15 rounds. Groups 2,4,5 ES of 46,33,31 and SD's of 18,11,11

Annealing ES 17,11 and SDs of 6,4

I think we can start to see where this is headed

Test 3 on the way!

 

[jdmecomber]

Action shots

Dink slayer

 

[jdmecomber]

Action shots

Dink slayer

One more group to shoot and my SD's are 3,4,4,6 and I am a little shocked. I think I know why.

 

[jdmecomber]

Group 1 Amp annealed for three firings and I had a hot round in this group HMNMMMM
1 2897 ES 27 SD 10
2 2884
3 2911
4 2891
5 2892

Group 2 this group was annealed this firing after 2 firings of not being annealed
1 2897 ES 10 SD 3
2 2900
3 2901
4 2897
5 2891

Group 3 torch annealed 3x in a row
1 2897 ES 13 SD 4
2 2889
3 2888
4 2884
5 2889

Group 4 Anneal after 3x fired
1 2907 ES 16 SD 6
2 2897
3 2898
4 2913
5 2903

Group 5 No annealing
1 2898 ES 10 SD 4
2 2908
3 2907
4 2902
5 2906

Pretty interesting results so far, the 3x times fired amp annealer result is not very good and I wonder what happened.

Two groups of not annealed brass 4,5 performed lots better and I believe it was 100% shooter. It was light out when I was shooting earlier and I was shooting at different dead cottonwood trees because I didn't want to shoot more holes in my target butt. There are no homes for miles.
It's dark now so I am shooting into a big dirt pile and not worrying at all about the crosshairs. I am concentrating on the same shoulder hold, cheek weld and grip. I think we are seeing that in the velocities now.

I will shoot test 4 and 5 tomorrow

 

[CaptnC]

Tagging in...great job...

 

[jdmecomber]

Observations so far:

Brass that is not annealed has higher extreme spreads 36,18,16,15,10 and SDs of 15.7,7.5,6,6.2,4

AMP annealed brass has reported extreme spreads of 11,10 and SDs of 3.8,4. Amp annealer took a group of brass that fired a 36 extreme spread with 15.7 SD and once annealed had the best extreme spread and Sd of the day, 10 ES with 3.8 SD.

Torch head annealer has been very repeatable with Extreme spreads of 17 and 13 with SDs of 6 and 4.

Group 5 not annealed brass on its third firing almost had the best ES and SD of the day.
10 ES and 4 SD

 

[jdmecomber]

Observations so far:

Brass that is not annealed has higher extreme spreads 36,18,16,15,10 and SDs of 15.7,7.5,6,6.2,4

AMP annealed brass has reported extreme spreads of 11,10 and SDs of 3.8,4. Amp annealer took a group of brass that fired a 36 extreme spread with 15.7 SD and once annealed had the best extreme spread and Sd of the day, 10 ES with 3.8 SD.

Torch head annealer has been very repeatable with Extreme spreads of 17 and 13 with SDs of 6 and 4.

Group 5 not annealed brass on its third firing almost had the best ES and SD of the day.
10 ES and 4 SD

I was looking at groups 4 an 5 on there third firing 10 shots total not annealed ES 16 Sd 6.

 

[turkeyfever]

Tagging in.

 

[JScobie]

Tag

 

[Paul Dunagan]

This was a big project! Very much appreciated and interesting.

 

[Greyfox]

While the OP's testing protocol looks to be excellent, and much appreciated, IMO, it may be difficult to draw general conclusions. Being an alloy, brass differs with each manufactures specific process, and can very well vary "within" each manufacturers particular process. The copper/zinc ratio in particular, effects the hardness qualities, and this in turn will influence the annealing requirement. I have personally found differences between particular brands of brass that influence the degree of annealing required to maintain a consistent neck tension/low ES. This has ranged from frequent to none at all.

Interesting article:
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2011/09/cartridge-brass-alloys-revealed-by-x-ray-spectrometers/

 

[jdmecomber]

While the OP's testing protocol looks to be excellent, and much appreciated, IMO, it may be difficult to draw general conclusions. Being an alloy, brass differs with each manufactures specific process, and can very well vary "within" each manufacturers particular process. The copper/zinc ratio in particular, effects the hardness qualities, and this in turn will influence the annealing requirement. I have personally found differences between particular brands of brass that influence the degree of annealing required to maintain a consistent neck tension/low ES. This has ranged from frequent to none at all.

Interesting article:
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2011/09/cartridge-brass-alloys-revealed-by-x-ray-spectrometers/

I am not shooting in a lab or using X-ray techniques to check my brass

I bought the brass from the local sporting good shop. I load five head outside and shoot five. I shoot 5 in a row. I can tell you that I am using 210m primers and my powder is being measured off a 1000$ scale to 41.620-41.590 ish grains.

The same 5 pieces of brass are used for each group. Maybe not scientific but after 30ish rounds per group, I think most shooters will be able to take away something from this.