6.5 - 2900 ft/s most efficiently?

[Alibiiv]

Well let me chime in here, hopefully the "6.5ers" are not too harsh here. I have been going through the same dilemma for about two or three months now!!While looking at the various load data from the various reloading manuals, it is IMPORTANT to look at the barrel lengths for the specific load data that you are looking at and making a cartridge determination and selection from. Even the same manuals will give data using a 24 inch barrel on one bullet weight and a 26 inch barrel on other weight bullets. There is a lot of data to look over, however it is not all the same due to the barrel lengths. I hope that I am not being too basic here, however giving my two cents worth; and, hopefully helping make a decision. I have looked up and down at the 6.5 data as well as the 7mm data. With all the excitement about the 6.5s, I have taken a very close look at the .270 Winchester as a common-sense approach to a long range rifle for my hunting purposes. I have two Ruger 77, tang safety, .270 rifles in my gun safe, if I were to start from scratch I would be building a .270WSM as I find that cartridge to be the best choice for the .270s. I thought about a .270 AI, however the load data is a bit sparse and according to Ackley the .270 Winchester is about as efficient in that barrel diameter. I also like the .280AI, however with the exception of the ability to use heavier bullets, I really do not see a great advantage to the caliber. I suggest that you compare all of the 6.5 calibers of the same bullet weight at the .270 Winchester round, and no matter what you will find that you are within 200fps in either direction. And...if you choose to build a .270WSM, you probably will come out on top or equal to the NOSLER super calibers. When looking at ballistic coefficients for the .277 130 grain you're looking at .459 in the Nosler and for the 150 gr Accubond long range a bullet coefficient of .625. Again make your comparisons, however remember it is important to remember barrel length for your comparison data. All of the reload data that I have read for the Nosler 26 and 28 are out of 26 inch barrels, where the only data that I can find in a manual for the .270 are out of 24 inch barrels. Good luck with your build and enjoy the fun when it is done.

 

[Alibiiv]

Also in addition to my last post, I have also taken into consideration powder charges, reloading components and the cost of those components. I again would like to reiterate that if I were to be starting from scratch I would be building a .270 WSM, however I have two Ruger 77s in .270 Winchester that I plan on re-barreling, blueprinting the action and building. I did consider the .270 Weatherby magnum due to the long actions, however there really isn't enough benefit for the few hundred feet per second to rationalize the caliber. Two major reasons is the amount of powder being burned, and the other is the cost of brass for reloading. If one has to eek out every single foot-per-second as one could possibly get out of a caliber, then I say go for it! However a common sense approach to a rifle, for me, is the .270 Winchester to get the job done. I am not a die-hard, true .270 Winchester person, but I do believe in using the proper caliber for the game one is hunting. And....I do not see any game that the 6.5s will have over the .270 if one is using the proper caliber for the game they are hunting! I have a 35 Whelen, a .358 Winchester and a 45-70 that I use for black bear hunting; and, for me they get the job done well. I have read some blogs about a person complaining about a 6.5 bullet not doing what it was supposed to be doing out at 500+ yards because it did not stay together and it did not break bone and pass through an elk (not the exact wording of the blog, but close to it). For me that is not using a large enough caliber for the game one is hunting. From the answers that I read on that particular blog, pretty much everyone else who responded felt the same way. Again enjoy building that special rifle, not matter what caliber you choose. Good luck with it.

 

[marvee]

What 6.5 cartridge will comfortabily shoot, with multiple powders (not just RL 26 because that is hard to find these days), a 140-143 gr bullet, from a 24 inch barrel, at 2900 to 3000 ft/sec the most efficiently...meaning the least amount of powder (least amount of recoil)? And preferrably without having to run super hot loads the whole time. Maybe a quickload question?

I'm going to build a 6.5 rifle and the 2900 ft/sec mark is what I want to achieve in a 24 inch barrel, and want to use the least amount of powder to get there.

Options I'm currently looking at are 6.5-284, 260ai (maybe stretching it with just a 24 inch barrel), 6.5-06, etc. I don't care to go over 3000ft/ sec so options like 264 win mag are probably out.

 

[VLD Pilot]

Well let me chime in here, hopefully the "6.5ers" are not too harsh here. I have been going through the same dilemma for about two or three months now!!While looking at the various load data from the various reloading manuals, it is IMPORTANT to look at the barrel lengths for the specific load data that you are looking at and making a cartridge determination and selection from. Even the same manuals will give data using a 24 inch barrel on one bullet weight and a 26 inch barrel on other weight bullets. There is a lot of data to look over, however it is not all the same due to the barrel lengths. I hope that I am not being too basic here, however giving my two cents worth; and, hopefully helping make a decision. I have looked up and down at the 6.5 data as well as the 7mm data. With all the excitement about the 6.5s, I have taken a very close look at the .270 Winchester as a common-sense approach to a long range rifle for my hunting purposes. I have two Ruger 77, tang safety, .270 rifles in my gun safe, if I were to start from scratch I would be building a .270WSM as I find that cartridge to be the best choice for the .270s. I thought about a .270 AI, however the load data is a bit sparse and according to Ackley the .270 Winchester is about as efficient in that barrel diameter. I also like the .280AI, however with the exception of the ability to use heavier bullets, I really do not see a great advantage to the caliber. I suggest that you compare all of the 6.5 calibers of the same bullet weight at the .270 Winchester round, and no matter what you will find that you are within 200fps in either direction. And...if you choose to build a .270WSM, you probably will come out on top or equal to the NOSLER super calibers. When looking at ballistic coefficients for the .277 130 grain you're looking at .459 in the Nosler and for the 150 gr Accubond long range a bullet coefficient of .625. Again make your comparisons, however remember it is important to remember barrel length for your comparison data. All of the reload data that I have read for the Nosler 26 and 28 are out of 26 inch barrels, where the only data that I can find in a manual for the .270 are out of 24 inch barrels. Good luck with your build and enjoy the fun when it is done.

The .270 is an excellent big game rifle. It's just not a long range rifle based on the lack of bullet selection and frankly good BC offerings. The LRAB bullets are way short of advertised BC values. This has been proven by Brian Litz in his range results. Berger makes a good optional LR bullet for the .277 caliber. The .264/.284 caliber bullets offered are much better suited for LR shooting based on there high BC offerings. Again, it doesn't make the .270 less of a hunting rifle, only limited in range vs the other two caliber choices. The 270WSM definitely is the better option in the .270.

 

[marvee]

built myself a 6.5x55 AI. shoots everything a 6.5x284 can do. cheaper to build also. mine is a browning a-bolt rebarreled with Pac-Nor. used a 30-06 donor. allyou do is by reloading dies. shoot factory ammo thru new barrel and then reload. if you look around on internet (and i think this site) has several loads that jordan worked up. use the BJAI information. you will be glad you did.

 

[Paul Watterson]

What 6.5 cartridge will comfortabily shoot, with multiple powders (not just RL 26 because that is hard to find these days), a 140-143 gr bullet, from a 24 inch barrel, at 2900 to 3000 ft/sec the most efficiently...meaning the least amount of powder (least amount of recoil)? And preferrably without having to run super hot loads the whole time. Maybe a quickload question?

I'm going to build a 6.5 rifle and the 2900 ft/sec mark is what I want to achieve in a 24 inch barrel, and want to use the least amount of powder to get there.

Options I'm currently looking at are 6.5-284, 260ai (maybe stretching it with just a 24 inch barrel), 6.5-06, etc. I don't care to go over 3000ft/ sec so options like 264 win mag are probably out.

I currently shoot a 6.5x284. Barnard P action, McMillan Stock, Valdada
8x36 scope, and a Bartlein 30 inch barrel. You probably wont reach 3000
fps with a 140 grain bullet. Just switched to a 130 grain TSMK bullet and
results look very good - 0.08 inch groups at 100 yds. Have not measured with a chronograph yet but velocity is probably between 2900 and 2950 fps. Shooting
IMR 4831 but not the most efficient powder. H4350 is more efficient but hard
to find. The 260 Remington is also very good.

 

[osok-1k]

I believe that volumetric efficiency is very important in any cartridge, to that end the 6.5-284 or 260 AI would be at the top of my list in terms efficiency for the bullet weight / velocity you desire, which I agree with from a practical side. I didn't notice your intended purpose for the rifle which is also a huge factor. I just built a 6.5 Creedmoor with a Curtis Axiom and Bartlein 9-8 gain twist at 25 inches, Trigger Tech Diamond trigger and cut the chamber with a PTG match reamer for slightly tighter chamber tolerances. I'm loading Petersen small primer brass, settling 42.2gr of H4350, CCI 450 primer and Hornady 143ELDX .020 off the lands. I got an average of 2775 with my Magnetospeed. Sub 1/2 moa groups in strings of 5 (with Magnetospeed attached). I also had a few test rounds at 42.6 which bumped it to 2840 but not as accurate. I'll take the better group over a few fps. I'm tweaking jump and a few other variables to tighten the group.

 

[VLD Pilot]

I believe that volumetric efficiency is very important in any cartridge, to that end the 6.5-284 or 260 AI would be at the top of my list in terms efficiency for the bullet weight / velocity you desire, which I agree with from a practical side. I didn't notice your intended purpose for the rifle which is also a huge factor. I just built a 6.5 Creedmoor with a Curtis Axiom and Bartlein 9-8 gain twist at 25 inches, Trigger Tech Diamond trigger and cut the chamber with a PTG match reamer for slightly tighter chamber tolerances. I'm loading Petersen small primer brass, settling 42.2gr of H4350, CCI 450 primer and Hornady 143ELDX .020 off the lands. I got an average of 2775 with my Magnetospeed. Sub 1/2 moa groups in strings of 5 (with Magnetospeed attached). I also had a few test rounds at 42.6 which bumped it to 2840 but not as accurate. I'll take the better group over a few fps. I'm tweaking jump and a few other variables to tighten the group.

You Sir are spot on with your "real world" velocities from the 6.5 CM. I hear stories of 2950 with the new 150 SMK from 26" barrels. Blows me away. I built a CM for a good friend and he is at around 2700-2750 accuracy wise and barely getting in the mid 2800s with 140s with Max compressed loads. Again without calling guys liars, your pushing that CAM to dangerous pressures if getting 2950 with a 150.

 

[Boe]

If I was going to build a rifle to meet the criteria you mentioned, I would undoubtedly build a 6.5-284 NORMA. Like Greyfox mentioned, Good brass, powder, dies are readily available. And great accuracy. Make it easy on yourself, go hunting and have fun.
Richard Hilts
Hilts Accuracy Custom Rifles

 

[Alibiiv]

The .270 is an excellent big game rifle. It's just not a long range rifle based on the lack of bullet selection and frankly good BC offerings. The LRAB bullets are way short of advertised BC values. This has been proven by Brian Litz in his range results. Berger makes a good optional LR bullet for the .277 caliber. The .264/.284 caliber bullets offered are much better suited for LR shooting based on there high BC offerings. Again, it doesn't make the .270 less of a hunting rifle, only limited in range vs the other two caliber choices. The 270WSM definitely is the better option in the .270.

Hello VLD, glad that you gave me a response to my posts. I agree that there are better long range rifle calibers, however for me this caliber will meet my expectations for what I am hunting and for my own shooting capabilities. I am not going to be trying to win any long range matches with this rifle. I am planning on 400 or "maybe" 500 yards tops. I have shot deer at 450 yards with 140 grain Nosler partitions; DRT! For me the .270 Winchester is the best caliber for my hunting needs. I cannot walk as I once used to, so something with the capabilities to knock a whitetail or down at 400-500 yards will probably be the furthest shot that I will be making. I also like the felt recoil of the .270 over the calibers using a heavier charges of powder. This poster never did state what he wanted to do with the rifle he intends to build other than shoot bullets faster than 3000fps.? That is a variable that also has to enter into the equation. I appreciate the information about bullet coefficients and will do more research on that. Thanks

 

[264WM]

What 6.5 cartridge will comfortabily shoot, with multiple powders (not just RL 26 because that is hard to find these days), a 140-143 gr bullet, from a 24 inch barrel, at 2900 to 3000 ft/sec the most efficiently...meaning the least amount of powder (least amount of recoil)? And preferrably without having to run super hot loads the whole time. Maybe a quickload question?

I'm going to build a 6.5 rifle and the 2900 ft/sec mark is what I want to achieve in a 24 inch barrel, and want to use the least amount of powder to get there.

Options I'm currently looking at are 6.5-284, 260ai (maybe stretching it with just a 24 inch barrel), 6.5-06, etc. I don't care to go over 3000ft/ sec so options like 264 win mag are probably out.

The 264 WM will work just fine and a wide choice of powders.http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle

 

[jonthomps]

Go 6.5 PRC and be done. 2900fps without stressing brass at all.

 

[Navarro1]

I went with a 6.5-06. You can find brass anywhere. Basically a ballistics twin to the 284 but you can find brass in any cabelas you walk in to. I start with 25-06 brass so there is no trimming required. Best accuracy in mine is 2960 in a 26" barrel

 

[del2les]

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek046.html

Personally, I prefer the 260AI as a slightly more efficient cartridge to the 6.5x284. I have loaded 139-140's at 2900+fps in a 24" and with my current 28", I can achieve 3025-3050 with the 143ELD-X without excessive pressure signs.

You may enjoy the above link on the 260AI YMMV