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30-06 Load Development
- Thread starter Jor1034
- Start date
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Glen8338
Member
I agree with the above quote. Get a Hornady or other reloading manual and read and study the first section on how to get started. Then find another avid Reloader that knows what he/she is doing and use them as mentor. There is so much to learn about powder, primers and bullets let alone safety handling procedures which is most important! Be safe!
Rudolph Ferdinand
Well-Known Member
I think I may far ahead of him, maybe? I' started reloading about thirty years ago are after I bought my first rifle in 1989, the 300 Weatherby Remington Classic model 700. But I have found that the government cartridge 30-06 holds a special place in me...all the old WW II movies I once watched in the 1960s. Reloading manuals, about eight or more, I think! Now, I'm into the precision side of reloading, that's all, just something to do in my 60s.
30calyooper
Well-Known Member
Sounds like your choice of dies is pretty respectable. How are you crimping your loads?
pectable.
30calyooper
Well-Known Member
Computer is smarter than I am today...
So to repeat, how are you crimping? That seater die has no crimping function. If you are not crimping AT ALL I would strongly recommend that you try it. The difference it makes by evening out the starting pressure (pressure at which the bullet begins moving in the case mouth as it starts to head up the bore) can be surprising. Remember this - accuracy requires consistency. Learn to be consistent one step at a time, both loading and shooting, and you'll be tearing out bullseyes in no time.
Also since you have a good quality seater, have you checked if the seating stem in it matches the profile of your bullets? They're generally pretty flexible in handling most bullets until you get into the very long-for-caliber, low-drag bullets we see everywhere nowadays. The longer your bullet is, the greater your chance of accidentally creating lateral runout and/or uneven neck tension if the seating stem and the bullet don't work together well. And if you have a polymer-tipped bullet the possibility of deforming the tip while seating goes off the charts if the wrong seating stem is used. That can turn a tack-driver load into a "***" in a heartbeat!
With your seater I suspect that lateral runout is not a huge issue, but it doesn't take much pressure to almost microscopically deform the case mouth if the first contact with the bullet is out of alignment. Crimping also serves two other key functions - 1) to help correct any accidental deformation of the case mouth, and 2) it serves to increase the overall holding tension on the bullet, so that it doesn't move under recoil while in the magazine of your rifle. Even a 30-06 has enough recoil to cause uncrimped bullets to move in or out the case mouth when sitting in the magazine, and the lighter your rifle the more recoil those rounds get hit with. If the bullet moves, seating depth changes from round to round... even by a few thousandths of an inch...you guessed it, inconsistency = inaccuracy.
Pretty easy to check if your bullets are moving under recoil...say your magazine holds 3 rounds. Measure the overall length of two rounds to the thousandth, writing it on the side of each case in marker. Load these two first. Put a third round above them in the mag, and chamber a 4th round before inserting the magazine. Pop the mag in, and send two rounds downrange. I would measure/mark about 4-6 rounds and repeat this procedure 2-3 times, WITHOUT shooting the marked rounds. Now, after each measured/marked round has been hit twice with recoil, re-measure the overall length, and BTW inspect the tips to see if they look any different than they did before you loaded them into the magazine. If the overall cartridge length of any marked round has changed, you have either bullet slip under recoil due to insufficient neck tension or the rounds being battered due to the entire cartridge moving inside the magazine, again from the rifle's recoil. Tikka's are light and well-balanced but that light weight does come with its price - greater felt recoil. Your rounds in the magazine are hit with just as much force as you are on every shot.
Recoil can also affect the powder arrangement inside a cartridge, which theoretically could affect accuracy. But in a 30-06 with 4350 or Varget...that one's really a stretch unless for some reason you were fooling around with reduced loads (wrong powders for that!) or (GOD FORBID!) mixing powders.
So to repeat, how are you crimping? That seater die has no crimping function. If you are not crimping AT ALL I would strongly recommend that you try it. The difference it makes by evening out the starting pressure (pressure at which the bullet begins moving in the case mouth as it starts to head up the bore) can be surprising. Remember this - accuracy requires consistency. Learn to be consistent one step at a time, both loading and shooting, and you'll be tearing out bullseyes in no time.
Also since you have a good quality seater, have you checked if the seating stem in it matches the profile of your bullets? They're generally pretty flexible in handling most bullets until you get into the very long-for-caliber, low-drag bullets we see everywhere nowadays. The longer your bullet is, the greater your chance of accidentally creating lateral runout and/or uneven neck tension if the seating stem and the bullet don't work together well. And if you have a polymer-tipped bullet the possibility of deforming the tip while seating goes off the charts if the wrong seating stem is used. That can turn a tack-driver load into a "***" in a heartbeat!
With your seater I suspect that lateral runout is not a huge issue, but it doesn't take much pressure to almost microscopically deform the case mouth if the first contact with the bullet is out of alignment. Crimping also serves two other key functions - 1) to help correct any accidental deformation of the case mouth, and 2) it serves to increase the overall holding tension on the bullet, so that it doesn't move under recoil while in the magazine of your rifle. Even a 30-06 has enough recoil to cause uncrimped bullets to move in or out the case mouth when sitting in the magazine, and the lighter your rifle the more recoil those rounds get hit with. If the bullet moves, seating depth changes from round to round... even by a few thousandths of an inch...you guessed it, inconsistency = inaccuracy.
Pretty easy to check if your bullets are moving under recoil...say your magazine holds 3 rounds. Measure the overall length of two rounds to the thousandth, writing it on the side of each case in marker. Load these two first. Put a third round above them in the mag, and chamber a 4th round before inserting the magazine. Pop the mag in, and send two rounds downrange. I would measure/mark about 4-6 rounds and repeat this procedure 2-3 times, WITHOUT shooting the marked rounds. Now, after each measured/marked round has been hit twice with recoil, re-measure the overall length, and BTW inspect the tips to see if they look any different than they did before you loaded them into the magazine. If the overall cartridge length of any marked round has changed, you have either bullet slip under recoil due to insufficient neck tension or the rounds being battered due to the entire cartridge moving inside the magazine, again from the rifle's recoil. Tikka's are light and well-balanced but that light weight does come with its price - greater felt recoil. Your rounds in the magazine are hit with just as much force as you are on every shot.
Recoil can also affect the powder arrangement inside a cartridge, which theoretically could affect accuracy. But in a 30-06 with 4350 or Varget...that one's really a stretch unless for some reason you were fooling around with reduced loads (wrong powders for that!) or (GOD FORBID!) mixing powders.
MajorSpittle
Well-Known Member
Hey, It looks like you are experiencing what I did a few years back when I got my Tikka T3 Lite 30-06. Read this thread:
https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/ballistically-challenged-tikka-t3-lite-30-06.98421/
The only thing shooting good in mine was the 150 sst factory ammo, but everything was related to how I was shooting the rifle and not the ammo.
I get bug holes from the rifle with 168 A-Max and 58 grains of 4831 and it seems to like superformance powder also.
RegionRat
Well-Known Member
OP, you won't have much trouble with H4350 using bullets in that 165 - 168 grain weight range.
You may want to try the 4064 if you run nearer to 150.
Modern load manuals have very confusing data. If you plot all that you can find, it will be all over the map. It can only be a guide, not gospel. Run your charge versus velocity spread up to the levels that get warm, then watch each one to see when the hot ones start to flatten the primers or give any other signs of high pressure. You will probably find that the old Pet Loads may seem hot compared to today's manuals, but they are perfectly safe with good margins and not hot at all. That is not to say proceed without any caution, but to be ready for data that conflicts with some manuals.
I have some .30-06 rigs that have plenty of margin left with 59 gr H4350 and some sources would say this is past max. It would be fair to say 59 is hard on brass, but in those rigs there is a grain to go before primers start to show signs. The majority of rigs I have developed are happy at 57.5 grains.
Stick powder is more difficult to manage in terms of minimizing charge weight dispersion, but it is worth it in terms of flat temperature performance in the case of H4350.
You may want to try the 4064 if you run nearer to 150.
Modern load manuals have very confusing data. If you plot all that you can find, it will be all over the map. It can only be a guide, not gospel. Run your charge versus velocity spread up to the levels that get warm, then watch each one to see when the hot ones start to flatten the primers or give any other signs of high pressure. You will probably find that the old Pet Loads may seem hot compared to today's manuals, but they are perfectly safe with good margins and not hot at all. That is not to say proceed without any caution, but to be ready for data that conflicts with some manuals.
I have some .30-06 rigs that have plenty of margin left with 59 gr H4350 and some sources would say this is past max. It would be fair to say 59 is hard on brass, but in those rigs there is a grain to go before primers start to show signs. The majority of rigs I have developed are happy at 57.5 grains.
Stick powder is more difficult to manage in terms of minimizing charge weight dispersion, but it is worth it in terms of flat temperature performance in the case of H4350.
bob4
Well-Known Member
Early on in reloading I had trouble with groups also. Looking back I was the loose screw in the works. Over time and spending a few dollars I learned how to better prep brass and choose a bullet and powder that worked and shot a bit better. The result of that time spent was pleasing. No one thing said here is gonna fix your groups. Time reading and time at the loading bench will.
