280 AI

[Mike Matteson]

3006 headspace is shorter. This was to keep someone from shooting it in a 280. As a result you would have to jam a bullet in the lands with a mild load to firform and keep from having a case head separation.

Yes that is true and should be done to start with in any case fireforming to start with. I use a reduce load in my 6mm/280AI rifle even with having 280AI cases to start with.
What I don't know if 06 or others brass can handle that extended length. I do know that you can fireform 25/06, 270, 7mm, 280, 30/06 and into AI cases angle, without any problem. It generally take 3 to 4 firing to fully fireform a case anyway.
That additional .01 length has to come from somewhere in the case. I suspect that the neck is shorten up somewhat. I am not for sure if that hold true. Maybe somebody else can add some input, that's had experience with that.
The other is, I don't think people have gone the route presently. I only know of 1 or two that has use the the 280AI case for other calibers presently. I sure there are other too.

 

[dougduey]

Yes that is true and should be done to start with in any case fireforming to start with. I use a reduce load in my 6mm/280AI rifle even with having 280AI cases to start with.
What I don't know if 06 or others brass can handle that extended length. I do know that you can fireform 25/06, 270, 7mm, 280, 30/06 and into AI cases angle, without any problem. It generally take 3 to 4 firing to fully fireform a case anyway.
That additional .01 length has to come from somewhere in the case. I suspect that the neck is shorten up somewhat. I am not for sure if that hold true. Maybe somebody else can add some input, that's had experience with that.
The other is, I don't think people have gone the route presently. I only know of 1 or two that has use the the 280AI case for other calibers presently. I sure there are other too.

From my research, 270 cases were better to use than 30-06 since they have a longer neck. Of course, if you can get 280 Rem cases, it's even easier.

 

[Mike Matteson]

There is 208AI case out there. Nosler brass. I hadn't looked at 270 case much, but I sure will.

 

[cajun]

280 AI you can find but not 280.

 

[M1A1ABRAMS]

The 280 or the 280AI is easily capable of 700 yard deer, as long as your gun and you are capable for the task

I am going to go 280 Rem. Since it should feed fine & I already have dies to get started with. I need to acquire some brass. But I think it's doable.

280 AI you can find but not 280.

I got my eye on some 280.

 

[birddog 68]

I am going to go 280 Rem. Since it should feed fine & I already have dies to get started with. I need to acquire some brass. But I think it's doable.

I got my eye on some 280.

Once fired 280 brass in the classifieds now

 

[M1A1ABRAMS]

Once fired 280 brass in the classifieds now

I got a friend willing to help. Thanks for the heads up though.

 

[Rocketeer77]

IDK, if he has the donor action. $800 for a cambered barrel, $200 for the brake, $700 for a stock and $2K for a scope Makes $3700. Toss in $200 for dies and another $200 for brass and still at $4100. Use the existing stock and save $700.

Lot's of ways to look at it.

We did a recent build on a Sako, action used the original stock glass bedded build cost was US$4k admittedly it shoots like a laser so value for money!

 

[slickyboyboo]

From the article and Phil Sharpe's results:
The myth at the time (and one I still hear) is that there is a rule of 25 fps lost for every inch of barrel taken away: Sharpe proved that wrong.
Sharpe proved that the average loss was really about 12 fps for every inch lost, hardly something to fret over.

He may have proved this with a 06 and the powders/bullets/barrel he had then, but shooting many different calibers (from 20 caliber to 338) and many chamberings from 14" to 18", my numbers would be higher. I can see getting less loss, once you get up to that 20" or 22" compared to 24"-28".

I tell people to guesstimate approx 25-35 fps per inch. I have found it to be less with some smaller cartridges, compared to larger Magnums.
Plus, I am not going for speed, I am going for accuracy, to where I can do sustained shooting.

Plus, if you take a new match barrel and start your testing, and you keep shortening your barrel, that barrel is going to be speeding up some (Throat breaking in) as it gets shorter. Also use a couple of different barrels (Button and Cut)

Show me data from a barrel that has 200 rounds down it's tube already, and they are going for 1/2 MOA to 1/3 MOA accuracy at each length and powder charge with a variety of bullets in the same weight, where you can do sustained shooting and not pressure up and you will have my attention.

I wish my shorty barrels (14-18 inches) only had 12 fps per inch loss compared to longer lengths (24-28 inches).
It would be nice to only have a 120 fps loss in a 16" versus a 26" barrel


Having said all of that, maybe my math skills just suck

I lost 21.7 fps per inch on my 280 AI, same load, same env conditions, etc.

 

[Ernie]

I lost 21.7 fps per inch on my 280 AI, same load, same env conditions, etc.

What length did you start at and what length is it now?

 

[RAGGED EDGE]

Jousting at windmills. WAY too many variables.

 

[Mike Matteson]

He would have gain velocity with the silencer on the barrel. A silencer generally increases velocity.

 

[slickyboyboo]

What length did you start at and what length is it now?

I started at 27.25", and had it cut to 25" lost 49 fps total.

 

[AZ82New]

7828ssc is going to be optimal in the 140-160 weight class. It will almost certainly be faster with a 140 grain bullet.

The downside to 7828sc (likely RL23 as well), is that they are not very temperature stable. You could work up a load that shoots really well but us near the upper limits of pressure and be pumped. Then, you take that sane load out on hot summer day and be flattening primers, getting ejector marks and some sticky bolt lift.

So if you're new, I would actually steer you towards three powders for the 280AI:

H4350 for 120-140 grain bullets
H4831sc 145-160 grain bullets
H1000 168-180 grain bullets.

While they may not be the absolute fastest possible powder……they will get you inside of 100fps of the fastest powder in the reloading manual for whatever bullet you are using.

I look for a couple things:

1. I want to use a powder that gets my case either mostly full or slightly compressed without going over pressure.

This seems to keep extreme spreads down and maintain consistent accuracy.

2. A powder that is temperature stable.

If you cannot get ahold of these powders. Ramshot Hunter is an extremely good powder for the 280 AI and most people overlook it. It's going to fill your case and at the upper end, compress a little (which I like). It has always been very accurate for me and consistent. It also meters very well because it's a ball powder.

It tends to be the fastest powder too.

The downside is that it's temperature stability is just average. Not terrible like RL19 but not excellent like H1000 or H4350 either.

I'm replying to my own thread here……

RL23 is extremely temp stable. I probably had RL22 in mind when I wrote this. While I do not have first hand experience with RL22 (though I own some), I have spent some time with RL23 at this point. I find it to be extremely consistent, very stable and superbly accurate.

It's just as good as H4831sc…..which I consider to be very high praise as H4831sc is definitely a desert island powder.