Hello,
Today I finally got around to shooting a new Winchester Model 70 I purchased new on sale for around $1,000. I believe it is the Extreme Weather Tungsten. It came with a B and C stock and was full cerakoted tungsten color and has a muzzle break. The rifle is chambered in 6.8 Western.
I simultaneously found a reject McMillan stock on eBay and purchased a Timney trigger. The fit and finish of the action is quite good. Not Sako level but very good. It feeds flawlessly and extracts extremely well. It's balanced, reasonably light and flat shooting. In short, this is an ideal short to medium range setup, say 500/600 yards and in.
Having already dumped some money in it with the stock and trigger, and given the expected range limitations of the package, I was going to keep the barrel as long as it actually shot 1 MOA or better.
It did not.
Not even close.
Furthermore, there are quite a few threads about the notorious inaccuracy of the new model 70's.
However, I think I may have identified the source of the issue. I believe it's (no surprise) the barrel. Before I get into what issues I think exist with the barrel, I'll tell you what I did.
When I was sighting it in at 40 yards, I could see the rounds were walking, a lot, as the barrel heated up. So I decided to shoot two rounds and let it cool. This would account for a good shot and a quick follow up. That seems like a fairly practical expectation for a hunting rifle. Again, this is not a dedicated long range setup. It's a quick handling and practical hunting rifle. A traditional setup in short.
Well, I got about a 2 and half inch, two shot, group.
The first shot hit just right of the bullseye. The second was the one that is upper left.
I stopped, let the barrel completely cool for about 15 minutes. Then I shot the one that is just a little high and left of the bullseye. The following shot is the one that is low right. Again, about a 2.5 inch, two shot group.
Now I wanted to see if the cold bite shot was on and as soon as a little heat entered the equation, things would fall apart. So I let the barrel cool, not completely but mostly, and shot one of the holes on the orange pasty, repeated the same process and shot the second one that is almost touching.
I can't prove it because I'm too impatient but I bet if I had let that barrel cool all the way down for both of those other shots, it would have been close to a half inch group for all four cold bore shoots.
My belief is that, for whatever reason, when that thin factory barrel heats up even a little, it starts spitting rounds like a shotgun. This rules out beddding, scope, scope rigs and even shooter error here. Again, I'm convinced it's the barrel and that no amount of handholding is going to do much to change that.
I should have said this but the ammo is Browning Long Range Hunter, loaded with the 175 TGK. The velocity was faster than listed at 2,855 fps with an SD of 7.5. It's good stuff and probably negates any need for hand loading. I wouldn't be surprised to get 2,900 fps if I were to actually break the barrel in.
Back to the barrel. I have two theories as to why it's spraying bullets. The first and most likely in my opinion, is that they are using cheap steel that is heavily affected by temperature changes. The second is that the fluting is shorter on the sides to allow for Winchester laser engraving. Perhaps this causes funky harmonics? I really have no idea but it's a theory. Nonetheless, it's very accurate on a cold bore which indicates to me that it was well manufactured. This is in line with my experience of the rest of the rifle which seems to be of very high quality.
I don't have calipers in front of me but I recall the muzzle end measuring around .615 or so. Fairly thin. My plan, is to re-barrel it with a Bartlein 2b contour which is slightly heavier and also shorten it 2 inches in order to maintain the overall weight and balance. My experience with that barrel maker and contour is that I could get similar accuracy in a three shot string as I did in those first to cold bore shots. I would only give up about 50-60 fps giving up two inches which is completely negligible and could be made up with hand loading if I was worried about it.
Long thread but I hope it was helpful to someone!
Today I finally got around to shooting a new Winchester Model 70 I purchased new on sale for around $1,000. I believe it is the Extreme Weather Tungsten. It came with a B and C stock and was full cerakoted tungsten color and has a muzzle break. The rifle is chambered in 6.8 Western.
I simultaneously found a reject McMillan stock on eBay and purchased a Timney trigger. The fit and finish of the action is quite good. Not Sako level but very good. It feeds flawlessly and extracts extremely well. It's balanced, reasonably light and flat shooting. In short, this is an ideal short to medium range setup, say 500/600 yards and in.
Having already dumped some money in it with the stock and trigger, and given the expected range limitations of the package, I was going to keep the barrel as long as it actually shot 1 MOA or better.
It did not.
Not even close.
Furthermore, there are quite a few threads about the notorious inaccuracy of the new model 70's.
However, I think I may have identified the source of the issue. I believe it's (no surprise) the barrel. Before I get into what issues I think exist with the barrel, I'll tell you what I did.
When I was sighting it in at 40 yards, I could see the rounds were walking, a lot, as the barrel heated up. So I decided to shoot two rounds and let it cool. This would account for a good shot and a quick follow up. That seems like a fairly practical expectation for a hunting rifle. Again, this is not a dedicated long range setup. It's a quick handling and practical hunting rifle. A traditional setup in short.
Well, I got about a 2 and half inch, two shot, group.
The first shot hit just right of the bullseye. The second was the one that is upper left.
I stopped, let the barrel completely cool for about 15 minutes. Then I shot the one that is just a little high and left of the bullseye. The following shot is the one that is low right. Again, about a 2.5 inch, two shot group.
Now I wanted to see if the cold bite shot was on and as soon as a little heat entered the equation, things would fall apart. So I let the barrel cool, not completely but mostly, and shot one of the holes on the orange pasty, repeated the same process and shot the second one that is almost touching.
I can't prove it because I'm too impatient but I bet if I had let that barrel cool all the way down for both of those other shots, it would have been close to a half inch group for all four cold bore shoots.
My belief is that, for whatever reason, when that thin factory barrel heats up even a little, it starts spitting rounds like a shotgun. This rules out beddding, scope, scope rigs and even shooter error here. Again, I'm convinced it's the barrel and that no amount of handholding is going to do much to change that.
I should have said this but the ammo is Browning Long Range Hunter, loaded with the 175 TGK. The velocity was faster than listed at 2,855 fps with an SD of 7.5. It's good stuff and probably negates any need for hand loading. I wouldn't be surprised to get 2,900 fps if I were to actually break the barrel in.
Back to the barrel. I have two theories as to why it's spraying bullets. The first and most likely in my opinion, is that they are using cheap steel that is heavily affected by temperature changes. The second is that the fluting is shorter on the sides to allow for Winchester laser engraving. Perhaps this causes funky harmonics? I really have no idea but it's a theory. Nonetheless, it's very accurate on a cold bore which indicates to me that it was well manufactured. This is in line with my experience of the rest of the rifle which seems to be of very high quality.
I don't have calipers in front of me but I recall the muzzle end measuring around .615 or so. Fairly thin. My plan, is to re-barrel it with a Bartlein 2b contour which is slightly heavier and also shorten it 2 inches in order to maintain the overall weight and balance. My experience with that barrel maker and contour is that I could get similar accuracy in a three shot string as I did in those first to cold bore shots. I would only give up about 50-60 fps giving up two inches which is completely negligible and could be made up with hand loading if I was worried about it.
Long thread but I hope it was helpful to someone!
