Winchester Model 70 Accuracy Issues - Help Needed

[HARPERC]

Good Luck! I hope it works out for you, and would like to hear the outcome.

Shimming the rear is easy, and could give an idea of where everything lines up.

 

[jjmp]

ok great !!! on Both of them !!! stop she AINT a lemon yet!!!!!!!..... nf makes two piece bases in 20 noa for Winchester rifles, that don't impead top loading just saying , many options ! thks

 

[Pdvdh]

Rifle issues like this will convert many to customs. You could buy 6 or so factory rifles for what you've invested in that scope, no?

I like that you've glass bedded it. It should shoot if it's got that potential.

If you want a factory rifle, it may be time to sell this one and try another. Would be hard to do any worse...

 

[ndczerwinski]

Rifle issues like this will convert many to customs. You could buy 6 or so factory rifles for what you've invested in that scope, no?

I like that you've glass bedded it. It should shoot if it's got that potential.

If you want a factory rifle, it may be time to sell this one and try another. Would be hard to do any worse...

Yes, I could have bought a lot of cheap rifles with the money I spent on the Z8i, I am a self admitted glass snob, and the Z8i is worth every penny. No matter what anyone says I tested this scope next to many others such as high end Zeiss, Vortex, and Leupold and the Z8i is clearer and gives me a minimum extra 30 minutes of being able to see earlier at dusk and later at dawn.

I have had many Winchesters that shoot great, and I have a soft spot for them. I do however reckon this will be my last, unless I am buying it for collectible reasons. I have always been of the opinion that almost all guns, unless you get into the customs, offer a 1 MOA guarantee, so I buy what feels good because accuracy wise they are all similar.

 

[HARPERC]

No concern about the price of optics, but I always keep the perspective regardless of cost, or reputation any of them can fail.

I love my Model 70's, I know of some that are older than I am still providing good service. I have also seen a couple whose targets eliminated the mystique of them all being "the rifleman's rifle". There is also room in the safe for another if the right one comes along.

Accuracy however, is a bitch, with no concern about soft spots, how much has been spent on ammo, if you shot a nice caribou with it once, or if it once belonged to someone important to you.

 

[Pdvdh]

I have no problem with expensive scopes or how anyone spends their money, unless they're spending it on an attorney filing a civil lawsuit against me.

My point is this: Compared to the money invested in your scope, it shouldn't be too painful to sell this Winchester 70 and start over with another. The money in the rifle is a pittance compared to the scope. In light of that, have you considered dumping this M70 and starting over with another? It's a suggestion. Nothing more.

You like Winchesters. At some point, the time comes to accept the accuracy you have in this rifle, or move on. I'd be amazed if you ended up with another M70 that performed so exceptionally poorly. Put the scope on a worthy rifle. I can shoot 6" groups with iron sights.

Some of those 1 MOA factory accuracy warranties turn out to be based on 1-shot groups, when you try to make use of the warranty. Never had a rifle that wouldn't shoot 1 MOA, based on that warranty clause.

 

[WildRose]

ok great !!! on Both of them !!! stop she AINT a lemon yet!!!!!!!..... nf makes two piece bases in 20 noa for Winchester rifles, that don't impead top loading just saying , many options ! thks

I have rails on almost all of my M70's and 700's and you're right, no issue with loading or ejecting. They really load more from the side than the top anyhow and eject more to the side than out of the top as well.

 

[MagnumManiac]

This rifle sounds as if the barrel is not square to the action.
I had a USRC New Haven Model 70 that was off square so much I had to mill the rear Leupold base to get enough windage adjustment.
In the end, due to losing adjustment in the scope, I took it off, machined the barrel shoulder square to the bore and squared the action and re-chambered it. Accuracy improved slightly, it was sub MOA with handloads anyway and not particularly fussy with bullets.
Accuracy improved substantially when I put this rifle into a HS Precision Sporter stock and skim bedded it.
This was one of my most accurate rifles after all this. I sold it in 2014 and bought a Model 70 EW in the same cal, 338WM. Mine is also a Portuguese Model and I have no issue other than a tighter/shorter throat than I would prefer.

Cheers.

 

[West Calamus]

I bought a 7mm-8 extreme weather that had accuracy issues like yours shooting up to 6 inch spreads at a 100yrds. took it to a gun smith and still didn't help. Long story short went to handloaded 160 gr. sierra gamekings v 2,650. kept the barrel dirty and now shoots 1moa at 200 yrds. Velocity does not mean accuracy. You are limited in your COL because of magazine length so will never get bullet to .020 off lands.
Did you shoot your barrel in?
My extreme weather seems to like a dirty barrel.

 

[Whaler63]

Please be careful if considering a new M70. Especially the Extreme Weather.

I bought a M70EW in 25-06 in May of 2019. Had similar problems with accuracy and then some:

• After 100+ rounds (yes I seasoned the barrel) & (yes I shot a variety of loads, 100gn Barnes to 120gn Partitions, factory + handholds)....I couldn't get a 3 shot group under 3" at 100yards off the bags.
• Trigger - 4.75lbs - 5lbs +...adjustment screws filled with Epoxy at the factory. 3.25lbs is what Winchester advertised for their "MOA" trigger system.
• Bottom Metal - Advertised as "Stainless" -"Stainless Aluminum"...Would have thought Stainless Steel. Better than Stainless plastic I guess.
• Stock - Poor moulding or lay up in the OEM - B.C. stock leaving an air gap at the rear pillar and leaving only the front screw to properly secure the stock to the action.

I thought about tossing a $150 Timney in it and hoping for the best. But after looking at the rest of the issues with the rifle I decided that the best course of action would be to box it up and ship it back to Browning/Winchester and let them deal with it. -- "Lock, Stock and Barrel"...

FWIW: I also have 2 other Winchester Model 70's. A pre-64 30-06 and a "circa 1986" 375 H&H Mag. Both rifles shoot MOA or better at 100 yards. And have a much better fit and finish than the new M70EW.

 

[West Calamus]

Please be careful if considering a new M70. Especially the Extreme Weather.

I bought a M70EW in 25-06 in May of 2019. Had similar problems with accuracy and then some:

• After 100+ rounds (yes I seasoned the barrel) & (yes I shot a variety of loads, 100gn Barnes to 120gn Partitions, factory + handholds)....I couldn't get a 3 shot group under 3" at 100yards off the bags.
• Trigger - 4.75lbs - 5lbs +...adjustment screws filled with Epoxy at the factory. 3.25lbs is what Winchester advertised for their "MOA" trigger system.
• Bottom Metal - Advertised as "Stainless" -"Stainless Aluminum"...Would have thought Stainless Steel. Better than Stainless plastic I guess.
• Stock - Poor moulding or lay up in the OEM - B.C. stock leaving an air gap at the rear pillar and leaving only the front screw to properly secure the stock to the action.

I thought about tossing a $150 Timney in it and hoping for the best. But after looking at the rest of the issues with the rifle I decided that the best course of action would be to box it up and ship it back to Browning/Winchester and let them deal with it. -- "Lock, Stock and Barrel"...

FWIW: I also have 2 other Winchester Model 70's. A pre-64 30-06 and a "circa 1986" 375 H&H Mag. Both rifles shoot MOA or better at 100 yards. And have a much better fit and finish than the new M70EW.

 

[West Calamus]

I put a timney trigger in my ext weather and don't like it as well as The MOA trigger. You have to fine tune the MOA trigger. Put a $6 erine the gunsmith pull weight spring in it. Drop the stock put the barrel sideways in a vice so you can make your over travel and pull weight adjustment while you are looking though the hole in the MOA housing while working the bolt and trigger. Slap some clear finger nail polish on the screws to hold them in place and you have a better trigger then you can buy after market. Not many people can tell the difference between 1 3/4 lb or 2 1/4 pull. BTW I shoot my 7mm-08 extreme weather out to 900 yards with a Burris Eliminator 3. Quit chasing your groupings around the paper. Find what shoots the best group and then adjust your scope to that group then shoot 200 or 300 rounds and you will start to like the extreme weather.

 

[Whaler63]

Richard et al,
Thanks for the note. If it were just as simple as dropping a trigger in, I would have done so. Given the stock issues, upward tilt of the the barrel in the stock and the poor bedding job, and poor grouping at 100yrds.... I decided it was best to let Winchester deal with.
Cheers,
-Fletch

 

[Pulpwood]

Sounds like you just got a bad one. I have 3 and they all shoot great.