What is a typical mountain rifle build?

[Gcan]

Hello, been a longtime lurker on Long Range Hunting and you guys have helped me a lot but I decided to post here as I couldn't find a thread to answer my question.

I have been looking to start building a sort of all purpose hunting/mountain rifle and I wanted to make sure it was light enough for the sheep or elk hunts I have planned in the mountains. Long story short, what I thought would be the bees knees of all around hunting/mountain rifles came in at an estimated 187.5 oz (11.53 lbs) with scope. While this would be fine for regular whitetail hunting it seems that I'm about 2.5lbs heavy for an ideal rifle. How do you all typically spec out a rifle you are planning to carry in the mountains? I thought I was building a 7-8 lbs rifle but I was mistaken. Below is the build I had thought was going to be great with weight of parts. Also, a '*' indicates an weight I estimated. I have no problems throwing the entire build out if I am just completely off track from where I should be in building a mountain rifle with the exception of caliber, I'm pretty sure I want a 280A.I. Where am I going wrong on getting the rifle lighter? Thank you in advance for looking and giving your advise.


My original planned build:

• Remington 700 long action receiver trued by NSS (39oz*)
• Timney 3.5lbs trigger w/ safety (0oz added when replacing original)
• Sin Arms fluted bolt service (-1oz*)
• M5 Stealth LA flush bottom metal (7.5oz* added when replacing original)
• Magpul PMAG 5 AC-L magazine (2.8oz)
• Criterion Remage heavy sporter barrel in 280A.I. (54oz)
• Barrel fluting from NSS (-6oz*)
• Barrel muzzle threading (-1oz*)
• NSS Remage precision recoil lug (1oz*)
• NSS squared and trued barrel nut (3oz*)
• APA Micro Bastard Muzzle break (1.8oz)
• Manners MCS-TA full carbon fiber stock (44.8oz)
• Manners flush cups (x2), sling studs (x3), 9/16" pillars (3oz*)
• Nightforce SHV F1 4-14x44mm scope (30oz)
• Iota Outdoors Triad 30mm medium scope rings (3oz)
• Butler Creek flip-up scope covers (2oz*)

Is money a consideration? Are you recoil adverse? If not and the parameters are 400-500 yards accuracy and stopping Power. Just fantasizing.
Titanium short 700 action
Christiansen carbon barrel with ti break. 24".
Carbon fiber thumbhole stock. (I like thumbholes in rough or uncertain terrain just for control. (Christiansen makes one but there are many)

300 Winchester short mag. 180 grn bullets produce 2000 plus ftlb at 400. Not a wildcat of any kind. Something with quality oem ammo and data for.

Since Id probably have a quality bino/rangefinder and spotting scope Id stay with a lighter scope, but that is a personal choice and situation dependant. A Leupold vari X III 4.5-14 type or some other quality lite one with Ti rings.
MOA turrets but a graduated BDC type reticle.

Hi x scopes and thin air (low oxygen) can be problematic.

All in all I probably have a 6 lb gun. All I need is $4000
Simple and elegant rifle.

 

[SavageHunter11]

Is money a consideration? Are you recoil adverse? If not and the parameters are 400-500 yards accuracy and stopping Power. Just fantasizing.
Titanium short 700 action
Christiansen carbon barrel with ti break. 24".
Carbon fiber thumbhole stock. (I like thumbholes in rough or uncertain terrain just for control. (Christiansen makes one but there are many)

300 Winchester short mag. 180 grn bullets produce 2000 plus ftlb at 400. Not a wildcat of any kind. Something with quality oem ammo and data for.

Since Id probably have a quality bino/rangefinder and spotting scope Id stay with a lighter scope, but that is a personal choice and situation dependant. A Leupold vari X III 4.5-14 type or some other quality lite one with Ti rings.
MOA turrets but a graduated BDC type reticle.

Hi x scopes and thin air (low oxygen) can be problematic.

All in all I probably have a 6 lb gun. All I need is $4000
Simple and elegant rifle.

Thank you for your input. Every opinion helps.

 

[Ben Keller]

I'm partial to model 700s, reliable and easy to make lightweight because the hoards of vendors that make parts for them.

I wouldn't over look mcmillans carbon edge stocks. Their game scout (which can fit up several nice sized steel barrels) weighs around 25-26 ounces.

One thing I would be careful about is using a carbon or proof barrel. They will be lighter if you have heavier contour steel barrel, but if you want ultra lightweight use a #1-#3 steel barrel and it will be even lighter than a sendero lite proof barrel especially if it is fluted. You can also loose some weight by skeletonizing the bolt handle.

Titanium parts are awesome as well when it comes to weight reduction but not all want to pay the price tag.

Lastly I look at barrel length as well. I've recently gone from a 26" barrel down to a 24". Not a ton of weight reduction but not a lot of velocity reduction either. A test I recently saw done has the loss in velocity at 28 FPS on average per inch. So if I only lost 56 FPS by cutting off two inches so be it. The ability to maneuver the gun in the hills is worth it IMO. That test was done with a 7mm Rem Mag. which is what I currently shoot the most.

 

[SavageHunter11]

I'm partial to model 700s, reliable and easy to make lightweight because the hoards of vendors that make parts for them.

I wouldn't over look mcmillans carbon edge stocks. Their game scout (which can fit up several nice sized steel barrels) weighs around 25-26 ounces.

One thing I would be careful about is using a carbon or proof barrel. They will be lighter if you have heavier contour steel barrel, but if you want ultra lightweight use a #1-#3 steel barrel and it will be even lighter than a sendero lite proof barrel especially if it is fluted. You can also loose some weight by skeletonizing the bolt handle.

Titanium parts are awesome as well when it comes to weight reduction but not all want to pay the price tag.

Lastly I look at barrel length as well. I've recently gone from a 26" barrel down to a 24". Not a ton of weight reduction but not a lot of velocity reduction either. A test I recently saw done has the loss in velocity at 28 FPS on average per inch. So if I only lost 56 FPS by cutting off two inches so be it. The ability to maneuver the gun in the hills is worth it IMO. That test was done with a 7mm Rem Mag. which is what I currently shoot the most.

I've decided to go with a fluted 24" McGowen #2 or #3 after I found out that Proof carbon barrels aren't as feather light as I once thought. I agree with you, the slight loss of velocity going from a 26" to a 24" is well worth it for added maneuverability.

I like the grip angle on that McMillan Game Scout but i really prefer a higher comb than that offers without going to an adjustable and adding weight and the carbon fiber A3 is just a bit heavy at 29oz for the short action and I would suspect the long action is an ounce or two heavier and then it's 4 to 5oz heavier than the Manners EH2 that I think I am going to go with.

Thanks for the input though, it really made me take a second look at McMillan as a viable option and helped confirm that I made the right choice in barrel profile.

 

[Ben Keller]

I would check to make sure the #2 can be appropriately fluted. My gunsmith only likes to flut #3s but I generally use brux barrels. He can flute a #2s but says it's more for looks than actual purpose because the fluting is so shallow. He told me a #3 properly fluted would be close in weight to a #2 that was barely fluted. Not to mention the #3 is more rigid which in theory should be more accurate. Just an idea I thought was worth mentioning.

Looks like your on the right track with a good looking build.

 

[SavageHunter11]

I would check to make sure the #2 can be appropriately fluted. My gunsmith only likes to flut #3s but I generally use brux barrels. He can flute a #2s but says it's more for looks than actual purpose because the fluting is so shallow. He told me a #3 properly fluted would be close in weight to a #2 that was barely fluted. Not to mention the #3 is more rigid which in theory should be more accurate. Just an idea I thought was worth mentioning.

Looks like your on the right track with a good looking build.

That's good to know. I will have to ask McGowan about fluting before I order. Thanks

 

[Tidus56]

I would check to make sure the #2 can be appropriately fluted. My gunsmith only likes to flut #3s but I generally use brux barrels. He can flute a #2s but says it's more for looks than actual purpose because the fluting is so shallow. He told me a #3 properly fluted would be close in weight to a #2 that was barely fluted. Not to mention the #3 is more rigid which in theory should be more accurate. Just an idea I thought was worth mentioning.

Looks like your on the right track with a good looking build.

I believe you're correct. I asked my barrel maker and he said he wouldn't flute anything smaller than a #3. Doesn't mean it cant be done but he said he wouldn't.

 

[SavageHunter11]

I believe you're correct. I asked my barrel maker and he said he wouldn't flute anything smaller than a #3. Doesn't mean it cant be done but he said he wouldn't.

So I guess my next question would be, would the #3 fluted or the #2 non-fluted have the better accuracy?

 

[Tidus56]

I honestly don't know, sorry. I assume someone will chime in.

 

[Hirschi1]

If your goal is light weight, you might need to sacrifice in some areas of the rifle. Unless of course cost is no concern. Titanium action, short small contoured barrel, extra light weight stock ( blind mag or again titanium bottom metal) yelds 4.5-5 lb rifle minus optic.

Rifle pictured is. A hair over 7.5 lbs with optic. Savage short action (modified), 6.5-284 Norma, Shilen 26" 5r #3 contour (I think) deep fluted, HSA blind mag aluminum piller bedded stock, EGW 20 moa aluminum base, warne rings, and Leupold vx-3 4.5-14x40 30mm tube side focus CDS.

A shorter barrel, fluted bolt, fluted bolt handle, fluted action, and lighter optic would have made this rifle lighter. It's really nice to carry on the shoulder or on the pack.

I chose to go with the blind mag because the Smith suggested it, he also said that detachable mag or floor plate could be added later if I find a wanted it.

I might still flute the action, bolt, and bolt handle. Two years using this rifle and it's a dream to use.

 

[SavageHunter11]

If your goal is light weight, you might need to sacrifice in some areas of the rifle. Unless of course cost is no concern. Titanium action, short small contoured barrel, extra light weight stock ( blind mag or again titanium bottom metal) yelds 4.5-5 lb rifle minus optic.

Rifle pictured is. A hair over 7.5 lbs with optic. Savage short action (modified), 6.5-284 Norma, Shilen 26" 5r #3 contour (I think) deep fluted, HSA blind mag aluminum piller bedded stock, EGW 20 moa aluminum base, warne rings, and Leupold vx-3 4.5-14x40 30mm tube side focus CDS.

A shorter barrel, fluted bolt, fluted bolt handle, fluted action, and lighter optic would have made this rifle lighter. It's really nice to carry on the shoulder or on the pack.

I chose to go with the blind mag because the Smith suggested it, he also said that detachable mag or floor plate could be added later if I find a wanted it.

I might still flute the action, bolt, and bolt handle. Two years using this rifle and it's a dream to use.


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Are you commenting off my original post? I feel like my refreshed build on page 2 or 3 is how you described I should build the rifle. If you think my second build can use some work though, I'm all ears as I'm trying to get closer to 8lbs than 9lbs. I'm not doing a budget build but at the same time I just can't bring myself to spend $1500 on a titanium receiver. I'm going to deal with the standard receiver and cut weight in other ways (i.e. Carbon fiber stock, #2 or #3 profile barrel, bolt fluting)

 

[Hirschi1]

Are you commenting off my original post? I feel like my refreshed build on page 2 or 3 is how you described I should build the rifle. If you think my second build can use some work though, I'm all ears as I'm trying to get closer to 8lbs than 9lbs. I'm not doing a budget build but at the same time I just can't bring myself to spend $1500 on a titanium receiver. I'm going to deal with the standard receiver and cut weight in other ways (i.e. Carbon fiber stock, #2 or #3 profile barrel, bolt fluting)

Looks like a great build. Your set up is only 1.5 lbs heavier. I really like your choice of optic.
Going with deep cut flutes and dropping the bottom metal might get you closer to the 8 lb Mark. I'm a Savage guy myself. Have you researched the difference between a remington la and a Savage la? I'm going to research that.

 

[SavageHunter11]

Looks like a great build. Your set up is only 1.5 lbs heavier. I really like your choice of optic.
Going with deep cut flutes and dropping the bottom metal might get you closer to the 8 lb Mark. I'm a Savage guy myself. Have you researched the difference between a remington la and a Savage la? I'm going to research that.

I have looked at the differences between the two and I really would prefer a Savage but the fact is there are no options for stocks for a left handed, long action Savage receiver.

 

[Ben Keller]

So I guess my next question would be, would the #3 fluted or the #2 non-fluted have the better accuracy?

That's a hard question to answer. A number #2 not fluted may be just slightly lighter, but I like the looks of fluting and my smith feels fine straight fluting a #3 so that is what I would personally do. Spiral fluting is a whole other ball game and from what I'm told should be stress tested after it's cut.

Ask your smith to see what they prefer but a number 3 doesn't look massive and can still give the barrel great rigidity IMHO.