Results of favorite deer rifle

[BIRCHTREE]

You're right. Where I'm from, for the most part, the average shooter cannot reliably hit a pie plate at half the 308s effective range. Most deer are killed at well under 100 yards. But some of us do have power lines or bean fields where we can stretch out. The 308 has made a bit of a comeback here In the last 10 years though.

It seems the most balanced rd.

 

[ObiJohn]

"I think the .270 with 130gr bullets is a fine deer cartridge, but will any deer within 400 yards know the difference over a .243?"

I've seen way too many deer shot and lost with the 243 to agree with this statement. Bullets are better these days but in the time I'm talking about the corelokt bullet was very common. The 243 with todays better bullets is a site better but I still believe it belongs in the hands of a better than average shooter. Even today, most hunters will buy and hunt with the cheapest ammo they can find and don't take advantage of the better bullet offerings.
Larger bucks 180 pounds or more which our mature deer weigh typically run further when hit with a 243 and left a lot less blood trail to follow than deer hit with 25-06, 7mm-08, 308, 270, 30-06, 7mag etc. Mature boar hogs with thick shields travel farther as well than sows and smaller pigs. I had a blood dog and excellent eyesight got called out regularly. 100s of times over the years. Several friends started out with 243s and gave them up. They swore by them until they lost enough really nice bucks shot with them to realize it was more than a coincidence. Most went up to 7mm-08, 308, 25-06, and 270 and their trouble went away. Those are not what I'd call man card cartridges. And I certainly don't recommend them as a first cartridge with full power loads. My statement above referred to the attitude of the times I grew up in. Yet even today, you will find a 270 in the hands of most hunters in my area and it's because it works so well. Kids can handle a downloaded 7mm-08, 270 or 30-06 just fine and I load for a few kids right now that are using these cartridges. They are easy to shoot and the recoil isn't bad at all. The 243 has seen a resurgence here but as a depredation rifle. It works very well on the 80-115 pound average doe that we shoot with the better bullets that are made today. A lot of folks in the depredation role like them because deer will run far enough after being hit to make it out of the field. I prefer the Grendel, Creedmore, or 6.5-06 for depredation personally and kill a lot of deer (around 100) and hogs every year with these cartridges. I tend to lean more toward the Creedmore as time goes by. 95% of the deer I shoot drop in their tracks. But I shoulder shoot. A practice I started years ago after blood trailing deer through very tough terrain that were lung shot and traveled 30-70 yards.. I can honestly say that I only know 2 people that use 243 now during our actual deer season when targeting mature bucks. Both are excellent shots and shoot their deer in the neck. I have several spots (bean fields) where shots are possible out to 700 yards. That is pretty typical for my area. In other areas of the state where there's very little farming shooting opportunities are a lot shorter. Our terrain in the Lowcountry has changed dramatically in the last 30 years or so since hurricane Hugo. Very thick, overgrown clear cuts, bays, and swamps cover a lot of our terrain that used to be much more open. A deer that covers a lot of ground after a hit can be a nightmare and often is not recovered or is found later by buzzards. If you want to hunt with a 243 that's your call. Have at it. If I can do something to improve my odds of anchoring a deer. I'll doggone sure take advantage of it. And I absolutely hate recoil and muzzle blast. As for youth, we start them off with a 6.5 Grendel or Creedmore. Or downloaded 308, 7mm-08, 270 or the like with a lighter bullet at 2600-2700fps. On paper the Grendel may not look like much but it has proven time and time again to be a very efficient killer. Surprisingly so. And we get good blood trails with it. It is my bottom line cartridge. I don't go smaller.

I can't argue with your experiences. I will say that with any hunting caliber, picking the wrong bullet for the application is going to increase your chances of wounding and not recovering game... and while I haven't personally killed hundreds of whitetails, the ones I have killed and seen killed all responded about the same across modern calibers with similar hits. A hit through the lungs and the big buck or small doe were off and running for 30 to 50 yards until they bled out. A high shoulder hit dumped them... maybe they thrashed around before they died, maybe they didn't. I have to wonder how many of the folks you're referring to who had bad experiences with a .243 were going for rear quartering shots... and how many made a bad shot or simply missed. Or used a varmint bullet combined with a rear quartering shot that blew up in the guts and didn't penetrate into the chest cavity. You are right; the Corelokt is/was best at broadside shots and very effective when used for that... and ineffective when people used it for Texas heart shots. In my experience, getting a bullet into the heart/lung area with a high power rifle leads to a quick death regardless of caliber, and any deer shot badly will die but likely not for hours or days and will get away regardless of caliber.

 

[BIRCHTREE]

I can't argue with your experiences. I will say that with any hunting caliber, picking the wrong bullet for the application is going to increase your chances of wounding and not recovering game... and while I haven't personally killed hundreds of whitetails, the ones I have killed and seen killed all responded about the same across modern calibers with similar hits. A hit through the lungs and the big buck or small doe were off and running for 30 to 50 yards until they bled out. A high shoulder hit dumped them... maybe they thrashed around before they died, maybe they didn't. I have to wonder how many of the folks you're referring to who had bad experiences with a .243 were going for rear quartering shots... and how many made a bad shot or simply missed. Or used a varmint bullet combined with a rear quartering shot that blew up in the guts and didn't penetrate into the chest cavity. You are right; the Corelokt is/was best at broadside shots and very effective when used for that... and ineffective when people used it for Texas heart shots. In my experience, getting a bullet into the heart/lung area with a high power rifle leads to a quick death regardless of caliber, and any deer shot badly will die but likely not for hours or days and will get away regardless of caliber.

I dont do it yet what would m80 ball ammo look like in a hunting senario with your exp/knowledge?

 

[BIRCHTREE]

308

 

[ObiJohn]

I dont do it yet what would m80 ball ammo look like in a hunting senario with your exp/knowledge?

What hunting scenario? A broadside chest shot on a whitetail deer? The deer would be killed quickly, but it's going to run, and likely further than the same hit with a 150 gr Nosler Ballistic tip or other hunting bullet. A shot from the rear? The M80 bullet would likely penetrate completely, the deer will die in any case, but will run a considerable distance absent a hit to an artery or the spine. Even a lung shot with an M80 may be survivable... a lot of soldiers have survived lung shots from AKs at close range... see Franklin Miller. This is a function of energy transfer, not caliber or cartridge. The more damage to vital tissues that directly affect the circulatory system, the quicker the kill.

I would not use an M80 round for hunting, even for hogs, unless it was a matter of survival. Yes, it will kill them. It will likely require multiple shots. I'm not into making animals suffer unnecessarily. Military use is not hunting... neither the goals or the values are the same. I have come across a deer that was wounded several days before... a very unpleasant experience.

 

[Turpentine21]

I can't argue with your experiences. I will say that with any hunting caliber, picking the wrong bullet for the application is going to increase your chances of wounding and not recovering game... and while I haven't personally killed hundreds of whitetails, the ones I have killed and seen killed all responded about the same across modern calibers with similar hits. A hit through the lungs and the big buck or small doe were off and running for 30 to 50 yards until they bled out. A high shoulder hit dumped them... maybe they thrashed around before they died, maybe they didn't. I have to wonder how many of the folks you're referring to who had bad experiences with a .243 were going for rear quartering shots... and how many made a bad shot or simply missed. Or used a varmint bullet combined with a rear quartering shot that blew up in the guts and didn't penetrate into the chest cavity. You are right; the Corelokt is/was best at broadside shots and very effective when used for that... and ineffective when people used it for Texas heart shots. In my experience, getting a bullet into the heart/lung area with a high power rifle leads to a quick death regardless of caliber, and any deer shot badly will die but likely not for hours or days and will get away regardless of caliber.

Lots of my acquaintances started out with the 243. Many were very good shots and could easily put a bullet where they wanted to. Over the years most moved to the 270, 7mm08, 280, 7 mag or 30-06 due to negative experiences with the 243. Most animals were shot broadside or slightly quartering to or away. The Texas heart shot was always seriously frowned upon. If we had to take a straight on or going away shot we shot head or neck shots. Most of these deer were shot with corelokts but some folks used gamekings or hornady interlocks. Both of the latter resulted in quicker kills than the Corlokt did with lung shots. Deer shot with the 270 travelled a significantly shorter distance before expiring compared to those shot with the 243 with similar shot placement. Particularly deer in the 175 pound plus class. They also tended to leave more blood when shot with the 270 or larger caliber. When cleaning it was noticed that wound channels and damage with the 270 was greater than those shot with the 243. The circle I hunted with would kill between 150-200 deer per year so we got to see a lot of wound channels and do our fair share of tracking. One of the most emphatic killers I saw back then was the 7mm mag with 140 grain softpoints. I personally didn't care for the recoil and muzzle blast of the 7 mag but it certainly performed well. Many broadside hits behind the shoulder would just drop on the spot. Similar hits with a 270 would result in a dead on their feet run for 25-40 yards. That's why I switched to all shoulder shots. In the terrain I hunted in it was just better to drop them in their tracks. Even a run of 30 yards might mean a long night. As far as bad hits it didn't seem to make much difference. Deer hit with any caliber took a lot of time to expire and could travel for quite a distance.
Over the years patterns developed. It was very obvious that the guys shooting the 243s either lost more deer or required trackers and dogs more often. Many replaced their 243s with 270 or 30-06 and the number of losses or long tracking jobs decreased. Interestingly enough they have been quite satisfied and have never gone back to the 243.

There was however an interesting case with one of my friends. He shot a 30-06 for a long time and was deadly with it. His number of kills is in the 1000s. Well he went out west and when he came back he was bent on switching to 300 win mag. His number of dead right there kills went down. His marginal hit number went up. Deer hit perfectly didn't expire any quicker than they did with the 270 or 30-06. Also, He simply couldn't handle the recoil and muzzle blast so his accuracy suffered. It took a lot of convincing on my part to get him to go back to the 30-06. Things settled down after that.

I'm no expert. But I am fortunate enough to see quite a few deer and hogs shot every year. Bullets have improved big time. I kill around 100 deer and quite a few hogs a year these days doing depredation. All with 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 CM, and 6.5-06. All three perform admirably with 123 or 147 eldm's. Every now and then I pull out my AR 10 in 308. Some of the guys do pretty well shooting depredation with the 243 and 95 grain SSTs. I just prefer to stay at 6.5 and above.