Reloader 26 in 6.5 creedmoor

[Bowfishn]

The powder charges for ALL of my loadings are first dispensed from a RCBS Chargemaster electronic scale , then transferred to a balance beam scale that I either trickle or remove granules of powder into pan to get each powder charge exactly the same .

I don't doubt the powder weight, it just seems odd with only 50.7 gr h2o volume in the case it will fit 48.1 gr that is 110% fill in the case at a COAL of 2.865" with a 147 ELD-M.
I have found using RL26 107% fill is about all I can get in before it wants to push the bullet back out, so what I am wondering is if the h2o of your case is really 50.7?
If it was 51.7 it would be 107% fill.
Just double checking.

 

[Capt RB]

At 47.0 with the 147 it would push the bullets out with .003 neck tension in peterson brass. I was running 46.3@ 2.840-55 with outstanding results. My lands were 2.857 new out of the box. I sold the rifle 2 weeks ago and the last number in my book was 2.863 @ 859 rounds. In 1/2 dozen 6.5s over the winter147's would shoot really well 2750 2800 @ 2.820 2830-2855 @2.835 and 2.855. At 2930 in my gun they were leaving a shiney spot about the 4th round of the string but shot well. All of these speeds showed sd's under 6 and Most had ES in that range for a magazine.
In my testing with peterson brass in colder temps 215's ruled. They would have wider nodes and very low sd's. My second lot of powder was 40fps slower at the charge weight. It took .3 grains to get back to 2840(46.6) It really wanted to be at 2855 but the amount of powder caused the bullet seating issues.
Alpha brass did alot of testing and made their spr brass 080 because it was more consistent. When I looked at their numbers they were far different than mine with lapua. I saw significant speed differences in 23 and down temps that I was shooting in with Rl26.
Fastest way to figure it out is this. Load in .2 increments from 44.0-45.8 Shoot the 10 over a chronograph. Look where the flat spots are 45.5.6 should be a max with the 147's with once fired and naked bullets. Once you have the areas where the speed was flat. Those 2 nodes are going to produce low sd's One will be around 2700 and the other quite a bite faster 2830-2860 in a 24" tube Might even be higher I never shot once fired with naked bullets only Danzac coated. The 2 nodes will shoot once you figure out where they want to be seated in your rifle. Want to use a different powder? Get the bullets to those 2 speeds and that is where it will again have low sd's. You would already have the seating # from before. I didn't run wolf primers in the cold. I would consider those for summer shooting if your on the high node. I don't have any data for warmer temps and Rl 26 so I would try to stay around 45.5.6 with naked bullets. If you want more speed than that in the creed you would be better off with a bigger cartridge to be honest.

 

[DMP25-06]

I don't doubt the powder weight, it just seems odd with only 50.7 gr h2o volume in the case it will fit 48.1 gr that is 110% fill in the case at a COAL of 2.865" with a 147 ELD-M.
I have found using RL26 107% fill is about all I can get in before it wants to push the bullet back out, so what I am wondering is if the h2o of your case is really 50.7?
If it was 51.7 it would be 107% fill.
Just double checking.

I weighed a once fired FL resized case with spent primer sized with .292" neck bushing . The weight of the empty case w/primer was 175.0 gr . Filled to top of case with water the weight was 225.7 gr. This was the basis for listing the capacity as 50.7 gr.
Last night I weighed a powder load of 48.0 gr. of RL26 , and very slowly , trickled it into a cartridge case , filling it to nearly 75% of the neck height . Using the electric toothbrush , as posted by another member , the 48.0 gr. load settled to just below the bottom of the case neck .
Saturday or Sunday I will weigh 2 or 3 other cartridge cases , empty and with water to see if I made a mistake .
I will post my findings after that .

DMP25-06

 

[DMP25-06]

Bowfishn ,

I am finally getting back with you on my 6.5 CM case volume .
Again , Peterson brass , large rifle primer , once fired , FL re-sized with .292 neck bushing , with fired primer re-seated into case . Weighed on RCBS Chargemaster 1500 electronic scale .
Empty case weighed multiple times , weight is 175.1 gr.
Filled with water (using tiny straw inserted into bottom of case to make certain no air bubbles were formed ) , weight is 226.0 gr , fluctuating up to 226.1 gr , not completely stabilizing at either weight for more than 5 seconds . So I presume that the capacity to be 51.0 gr. water .

I have NOT shot the following test loads :
Using H4350 powder , CCI BR-2 primers , 2.865" C.O.A.L. , .292" neck bushing , I have loaded 20 cartridges at .2 gr. intervals , starting at 38.4 gr. , up to 42.2 gr. ( I looked inside the cartridge cases after filling with each different weight , observing the fill height inside the cases , and even at 42.2 gr. the powder level had NOT reached the bottom of the case neck / shoulder junction .) I did use my electric tooth brush to further settle the powder , even though none had filled into the case neck .
Is it possible that my lot of H4350 powder has a higher specific gravity , and density than is normal ?
This was an un-opened 8# jug that I had received in early 2105 , after having been back-ordered for more than 2 years . The only marking resembling a lot # is t0307, otherwise nothing stating a lot number .
I await your advice before I go to the range with these test loadings .

Again , I thank you ,
DMP25-06

 

[DMP25-06]

Hello Bowfishn ,

I failed to post results of my velocities recorded at testing on Sat. , May 12 , 2018 .
6.5 CM , RL 26 , Peterson brass , Fed.215 Match primers , Hornady 147 gr. ELD-M . 2.865" C.O.A.L.
Loaded 46.4 gr. , avg. velocity = 2828 FPS , 66 ES , 25 SD .
Loaded 47.0 gr. , avg velocity = 2863 FPS. , 46 ES , I did not get SD .
Accuracy of both was sub-MOA , under 2" at 200yards .

Thank You ,
DMP25-06

 

[Capt RB]

48grn load for what bullet?? I'd get ejector marks with coated 147's around 47gn. Naked bullets I would not run over 46.0 with 147's and 45.5 in once fired is pretty much the sweet spot for 147's in peterson brass. In Norma brass 45.5 with coated bullets I would lose the pockets at the 4th or 5th firing. I have not run my peterson beyond the 4th firing and they are still quite tight. Better than the third load on the Norma was at that pressure level

 

[DMP25-06]

Pardon me , 147 gr. ELD-M , non-coated .

 

[Capt RB]

My coal was touching at 2.857. Good luck.

 

[Bowfishn]

It would appear your BA with your lot of RL26 is running 0.3230 5% low, that is really low compared to all the lots I have used but it is still in the norm for the powder lot to lot variation. According to velocity and powder charge your load is running bout 53,105 psi pressure my lot of powder with that load would be running 63,740 psi and the lot before would be 67,998 psi.
Did you ever shoot any factory loads to see if your barrel is slower than most?

 

[Bowfishn]

Based off of info on H2O capacity you have given 51 gr. I have run a new chart for H4350.
Note that you could be running over pressure on the higher loads you have loaded.
Watch velocities with the charge weights if they run low you are most likely okay but if they run high stop. Remember 63K is the limit for the 6.5 CM so if you see 2800 fps you have reached the safe pressure limits. Also watch for any other pressure signs as well and stop if pressure signs are there, even if you don't reach 2800 fps.

Cartridge : 6.5 Creedmoor Hornady
Bullet : .264, 147, Hornady ELD-M 26333
Useable Case Capaci: 44.641 grain H2O = 2.898 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.865 inch = 72.77 mm
Barrel Length : 28.0 inch = 711.2 mm
Powder : Hodgdon H4350

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.485% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-04.0 95 38.40 2600 2206 49296 7257 98.4 1.479
-03.5 96 38.60 2612 2227 50039 7286 98.5 1.469
-03.0 96 38.80 2624 2248 50793 7315 98.6 1.459
-02.5 97 39.00 2636 2269 51558 7343 98.7 1.450
-02.0 97 39.20 2649 2290 52335 7371 98.8 1.440
-04.4 98 39.40 2661 2311 53124 7398 98.9 1.431
-03.9 98 39.60 2673 2332 53925 7424 99.0 1.422 ! Near Maximum !
-03.4 99 39.80 2685 2353 54739 7450 99.1 1.412 ! Near Maximum !
-02.9 99 40.00 2697 2374 55564 7475 99.2 1.403 ! Near Maximum !
-02.4 100 40.20 2709 2395 56403 7500 99.3 1.394 ! Near Maximum !
-01.9 100 40.40 2721 2417 57254 7523 99.4 1.385 ! Near Maximum !
-01.5 101 40.60 2733 2438 58119 7547 99.4 1.376 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 101 40.80 2745 2459 58997 7570 99.5 1.367 ! Near Maximum !
-00.5 102 41.00 2757 2481 59888 7592 99.6 1.359 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 102 41.20 2769 2502 60794 7613 99.6 1.350 ! Near Maximum !
+00.5 103 41.40 2781 2524 61713 7634 99.7 1.341 ! Near Maximum !
+01.0 103 41.60 2793 2546 62648 7654 99.7 1.333 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.5 104 41.80 2805 2567 63596 7673 99.8 1.324 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.9 104 42.00 2817 2589 64560 7692 99.8 1.316 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.4 105 42.20 2828 2611 65539 7710 99.9 1.307 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 102 41.20 2866 2680 71455 7318 100.0 1.267 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 102 41.20 2630 2257 50320 7614 95.9 1.460

 

[DMP25-06]

It would appear your BA with your lot of RL26 is running 0.3230 5% low, that is really low compared to all the lots I have used but it is still in the norm for the powder lot to lot variation. According to velocity and powder charge your load is running bout 53,105 psi pressure my lot of powder with that load would be running 63,740 psi and the lot before would be 67,998 psi.
Did you ever shoot any factory loads to see if your barrel is slower than most?

I ran a box of Hornady 147 ELD-m during barrel break-in , but I did not chronograph them .
I have 1 remaining box of factory Hornady 147 gr. ELD-M that I can shoot through my rifle with Magnetospeed V1 , and I will post those results back to you at a later date

Thank you again ,
DMP25-06

 

[Bowfishn]

That will work

 

[coop2564]

What are y'all running as your temp sensitivity factor % for RL26?

 

[mrjashu]

What are y'all running as your temp sensitivity factor % for RL26?

I only have two temperature data points but for those two points I'm seeing about 0.9fps/deg