Need advice for scope ffp vs sfp. Read everything i could. Simple question

[Rich Coyle]

It's simple. I have SFP 2 1/2-25X and a 4 1/2-30X. It makes no difference what magnification setting I am on when I hold for wind.

I dislike disappearing reticles on FFP scores.

 

[John Klingenberg]

I like ffp for everything. It's more simple to me. They make them without the busy Christmas tree style with simple hash marked windage and elevation. I always dial drop but hold for wind since it's always changing. FFP gives you accurate holds at any magnification so I feel they are more useful. FFP gets my vote. It's better to have and not need than need and not have.

 

[257 STW]

I believe the OP has made up his mind it sounds like. That being said I am slowly but surely changing out my SFP scopes for FFP. To each their own, and I always love to read of others experiences.

 

[rammac]

Personally I've never had a problem with seeing the crosshairs on my FFP scopes. Yes, if you have a dark background, on low power, and you use a less expensive FFP optic, then I would expect that it's not a easy to see the crosshairs as the thicker crosshairs that you normally find on a SFP scope. But if you take time to select a good reticle and if you choose one that has the capability of being lit, I doubt that you'd have any problems using the FFP reticle.

The bottom line;

FFP Designed to make seeing the reticle better at longer ranges Reticle sub-tensions stay the same regardless of magnification Professionally trained shooter uses the size of the reticle features to help aim at different ranges, typically over 300 yards Preferred by the military because it helps to make fast shots in life threatening situations

SFP Designed to make seeing the target better under any condition Reticle sub-tensions change with magnification and can only be used for ranging at one magnification Typical shooter just aims and shoots, uses Kentucky windage as necessary, most often used at ranges of 300 yards or less Most often used by untrained, casual, shooters

 

[Justice1327]

First i have read sooooo many old posts on ffp vs sfp and i am getting dizzy.

I am looking to purchase a top end scope for a possible new rifle. I have only used in the field sfp scopes. I did purchase a swfa 5x20 ffp on a great deal i couldnt pass up.
I have ZERO desire to range anything at distance. Zero. Actually less than zero!! I want to dial after i range anything. I am pretty much disabled do to arthritis so my hunting will be in ground blinds or towers. I will not be walking anywhere in the mountains, only walking will be to my blinds. Deer are mostly my primary target maybe some black bear.

So if i am in my blind and a nice buck shows up and i range him a 560 yards and i dial for distance do i really need FFP scope? Now i am not sure but when people say (HOLD FOR WIND) WHAT does that mean in basic terms? I apologize for my ignorance in this but this is going to get expensive but i want the best. Explain that process. I have in my mind that hold for wind means old Kentucky windage if its a left to right wind at 10 mph i will hold off the deer so the bullet drifts into the deers vitals. Not using any reticles to assist. Zero use of hash marks just a guess.

I do kind of like the use of using the hash marks for wind if its known MPH and i can adjust accordingly. But as i said before i have zero desire to use reticle for range.

I am kinda thinking that sfp is petty much perfect for what i want but dont want to not be missing anything where a ffp will be just as good.

I know this has been talked to death but even reading everything i still come out confused on this topic.

Thx for any assistance on this topic

Brian

Simple: For hunting, use a SFP scope, with simple hash marks and a elevation dial for longer range shots if you are capable. Figure out what your MPBR is, adjust your zero for that and go practice.

 

[Shooter J]

Simple: For hunting, use a SFP scope, with simple hash marks and a elevation dial for longer range shots if you are capable. Figure out what your MPBR is, adjust your zero for that and go practice.

That can work for a lot of situations for sure, but depending where you find yourself hunting, this might not fit the best. If we have longer shots at antelope in WY where the wind is never below 53mph, ok that is a little but high for sure, and the ranges are extended it is really not the best to have to rememeber what power your scope is on and what those subtensions mean at that distance. Again I say there is not a one size fits all, just spend all the time you can with what you have. It is not a knock against anyone who uses SFP scope by any means, I just never have a need for one with where I hunt and the distances we sometimes have to shoot at.

 

[Pro2A]

First i have read sooooo many old posts on ffp vs sfp and i am getting dizzy.

I am looking to purchase a top end scope for a possible new rifle. I have only used in the field sfp scopes. I did purchase a swfa 5x20 ffp on a great deal i couldnt pass up.
I have ZERO desire to range anything at distance. Zero. Actually less than zero!! I want to dial after i range anything. I am pretty much disabled do to arthritis so my hunting will be in ground blinds or towers. I will not be walking anywhere in the mountains, only walking will be to my blinds. Deer are mostly my primary target maybe some black bear.

So if i am in my blind and a nice buck shows up and i range him a 560 yards and i dial for distance do i really need FFP scope? Now i am not sure but when people say (HOLD FOR WIND) WHAT does that mean in basic terms? I apologize for my ignorance in this but this is going to get expensive but i want the best. Explain that process. I have in my mind that hold for wind means old Kentucky windage if its a left to right wind at 10 mph i will hold off the deer so the bullet drifts into the deers vitals. Not using any reticles to assist. Zero use of hash marks just a guess.

I do kind of like the use of using the hash marks for wind if its known MPH and i can adjust accordingly. But as i said before i have zero desire to use reticle for range.

I am kinda thinking that sfp is petty much perfect for what i want but dont want to not be missing anything where a ffp will be just as good.

I know this has been talked to death but even reading everything i still come out confused on this topic.

Thx for any assistance on this topic

Brian

Generally, dial for distance, hold for wind. Wind varies such that dialing for it means you dialed to what is WAS. Range for distance, dial for distance. Read the wind, hold off for wind, take the shot. Reticle subtensions on SFP are only accurate at one specific power setting.....typically only accurate at full power.....confirm for your specific scope. FFP reticle subtensions are accurate at any power. FFP reticle can be difficult to see at lower power.

 

[jimbires]

445 supermag , I'm glad you could make up your mind this easy . I'm in the market for another scope for my long range rig . I currently have a nightforce NXS 8-32 SFP , with the NPR1 reticle . I like everything about this scope , except it does not have enough elevation adjustment . I'm looking , and reading , but can't decide what I want . the guys I shoot with all use FFP scopes . about every time we get together , I grab one of their rifles and play around with the scope . I look at targets from 600 - 2000 yards I just can't warm up to the FFP . maybe if I adjusted the eyepiece for me , it would help . I don't know , I won't twist that on another guys scope . I'm not even sure if that's the problem for me . I can see the advantage of the reticle being true at any power setting , but so far I can't commit to FFP . I dial elevation , and wind . then I hold as the wind changes . when I miss , if I see the splash I gauge it with my reticle and hold that . it doesn't matter if it's true moa , I measured it . it's a tough decision for me .

 

[Shooter J]

I really like how you said generally. I agree that is most often how it happens. There have been cases where I have to hold wind and elevation. I am watching and gauging the wind constantly when hunting. If someone in the group spots an animal at 435 yards I can look at my DOPE card that shows my elevation and windage, I can drop down quickly and hold for both. This works for me because of the FFP scope. I know the wind a full value approx. 12 mph and I can hold 2 mil high and .9 mils left. I often practice with hold overs as well. Again practice with the gear you have. Great comments.

 

[Michael Eichele]

The only advice I can give here is do not let yourself feel like you're missing something magical with a 2FP. A lot of shooters tend to make those that prefer 2FP feel like second class shooters. Personally I prefer 2FP scopes. I like having a full size reticle regardless of power. If my target is at a distance that requires elevation compensation, it's on max power (some aren't calibrated for max) and can use holdovers without doing any math. The only real advantage to a 1FP is the holdover values are the same regardless of the power set. Like I said, for me, the only time my scopes are lower than max is if I'm hunting close up and in which case, I am aiming center crosshair. If you decide 1FP works best for you, so be it. 1FP is preferred by some. All I am saying is, don't get caught up in the hype for the sake of fitting in with others.

If you decide you prefer 2FP, don't get a 1FP simply because you want to keep up with the Jones' so to speak. I have 7 scopes and only one is 1FP and the only reason is that NF doesn't make a 50mm ATACR in 2FP anymore and I'm stuck with a 4-20x50 in 1FP. All that said, this model is perfect for me except the FP and I can live with a 1FP. It's just not my preference. I can afford whatever scopes I want and still prefer 2FP. You'll have to figure out which version fits your A: needs and B: your shooting style.

 

[6.5x300 WBY]

I like ffp for everything. It's more simple to me. They make them without the busy Christmas tree style with simple hash marked windage and elevation. I always dial drop but hold for wind since it's always changing. FFP gives you accurate holds at any magnification so I feel they are more useful. FFP gets my vote. It's better to have and not need than need and not have.

John i couldnt of said it any better and what my exact uses look like.

Guys thank you all, but my mind is made up. I dont want this to turn bad. I appreciate everyones point of view. My next post will be reticles. for hunting.

 

[Shooter J]

All great points. Final answer....it depends. Generally speaking it always does.
If you shoot benchrest a red dot is not going to work. If you shoot 3 gun a 40X scope is not going to work.
If you shoot small game, a .375 it a bit too big. If you hunt lion, a .223 is not your friend.
If you are camping in Arizona in summer vs Canada in winter your sleeping bag will not work for both.
What your intended use is determines more than anything else. Whatever you end up with use it as often as you can and understand all of the benefits and downsides. When that trophy jumps up in front of you, at whatever range or condition, you have the confidence to make the shot. That is the ultimate goal. A clean shot with no regrets afterwords.

 

[Shooter J]

John i couldnt of said it any better and what my exact uses look like.

Guys thank you all, but my mind is made up. I dont want this to turn bad. I appreciate everyones point of view. My next post will be reticles. for hunting.

Glad you have found the input you needed. The information I've seen has all been great and positive. I am not new to the game, just this forum, and I must say everything I have read has been great. Sometimes the posts have been on complete opposite sides of the spectrum, but everyone I feel is trying to help. I am really enjoying the forum a lot.

Now you are just looking to start a fight with your next posts about reticles! Just kidding post away, this forum seems super helpful for sure.

 

[73driver]

Personally I've never had a problem with seeing the crosshairs on my FFP scopes. Yes, if you have a dark background, on low power, and you use a less expensive FFP optic, then I would expect that it's not a easy to see the crosshairs as the thicker crosshairs that you normally find on a SFP scope. But if you take time to select a good reticle and if you choose one that has the capability of being lit, I doubt that you'd have any problems using the FFP reticle.

The bottom line;

FFP Designed to make seeing the reticle better at longer ranges Reticle sub-tensions stay the same regardless of magnification Professionally trained shooter uses the size of the reticle features to help aim at different ranges, typically over 300 yards Preferred by the military because it helps to make fast shots in life threatening situations

SFP Designed to make seeing the target better under any condition Reticle sub-tensions change with magnification and can only be used for ranging at one magnification Typical shooter just aims and shoots, uses Kentucky windage as necessary, most often used at ranges of 300 yards or less Most often used by untrained, casual, shooters

Pffff. Using a SFP is easy. You just have to be better knowledged about it all and what you have. Inside of 350 yards you should know whether you hold spine, at the hair line or a little above hair. Out past 400 yards if you can't handle full power then you have way to much scope/weight on your rifle. I have been using a duplex reticle on my SFP scope to help me with hold overs. Wind hold is whatever 3, 6 or 9 inches is on the target body. The more experience and knowledge you have the less it matters.