FFP VS SFP need a answer

[HARPERC]

.............Never thought picking out a scope would be this involved..........

So many choices!

I don't know the SWFA's reticles or anything else.

I do have a Nightforce FFP, and one in SFP.

If I was still crawling dark timber SFP would be my choice. Then again it wouldn't be in a model as heavy, or this much magnification.

 

[DartonJager]

Miker, mallardaddict, and gohring, thanks for your explanations of what is a practical explanation of how a SFP scope compares to a FFP scope in real world hunting applications.

As I said any scope's reticle system I buy must be capable of being clearly seen and utilized in both close and long range while set at both the lowest and highest power settings. Although my longest shot at a animal, a 211 yard shot at a deer hardly qualifies as long range, I have however made many closer range shots in heavy woods where I literally had to so call "thread the needle" and make my shot through VERY small openings in the foliage, and on the other end of the spectrum I have had to make shots at very last legal light (read that to mean deer in shadow of the woods and the lowest shooting light that still affords a shot opportunity) with the deer tight to the woods only seconds from vanishing into them and I loosing my opportunity.

It has become apparent to me that FOR MY specific style of hunting the best ALL AROUND choice for me will be a scope with a SFP reticle location, as this will allow me to be able to best make the closest and longest shots with in my scope (pun intended sorry) of capabilities.

In short as gohring and others said and I now share their opinion the SFP is a better all around choice for me.

Thanks to all for your great help and for the time you took to share your knowledge with me.
DartonYager.

 

[Greyfox]

While the FFP has advantages for tactical work, I very much prefer the consistent sight picture and reticle orientation of a SFP scope for LRH. I use a 1 MOA reticle that scales at 20x with my 5x20 scope. If I have the need to use lower lower power in tighter quarters or close range, I simply use 10x or 5x which scales my MOA reticle to a 2 or 4 MOA scale respectively. It's an easy conversion and precise at the closer ranges for a wind correction, or quick elevation adjustment using a quick reticle hold. At the longer ranges I dial for elevation. Wind is always corrected with the reticle. Rather then pay the extra cost of a FFP, I'd rather put the extra $$$ into better glass.

 

[FEENIX]

May I ask you to please explain why this is so? and in the process increase my limited wealth of LRS knowledge.

"IMHO", this simply boils down to "personal" preference and application(s). Most of my scopes are SFPs, however, 2 of my last 3 scope purchases were FFPs and enjoying my transition with FFP scopes without any problem.

[ame]https://youtu.be/4XgugJSqpoE[/ame]

While the FFP is considerably new to the US but slowly getting notoriety, the Europeans has been using it for a while now. Not all FFP reticles are created equal, prime example is ...

[ame]https://youtu.be/9Gl3d0pxkvI?t=5[/ame]

Having said that, there are many LRH members that are very pleased with theirs.

BTW, just in case you did not know, the SWFA 3-15 is available in SFP or FFP and MOA or MIL. I have the 4-20x50 HD FFP on my .300 WSM and they are awesome.

[ame]https://youtu.be/9fe4l_CAthI?t=1497[/ame]

Another option on FFP scope for the similar price range is the Burris Veracity line. I have the 4-20x50 FFP with varmint reticle on my .270 AI and again another awesome scope choice.

Cheers!

 

[DartonJager]

WOW!!! Are both those videos accurate representations of how small and hard to see the reticle becomes at low power? If so SFP scopes are definitely better for my application and use.

 

[FEENIX]

WOW!!! Are both those videos accurate representations of how small and hard to see the reticle becomes at low power? If so SFP scopes are definitely better for my application and use.

Like I said ...

Not all FFP reticles are created equal,

Below is my SWFA 5-20x50 HD FFP at 5X looking @ 50 yards fence

and @ 645 yards highway signs;

not the best phone picture but good enough to show the reticle.

 

[DartonJager]

Thank you FEENIX for an over and above effort to supply me with accurate information. That is an excellent visual demonstration that the mods here might want to consider turning it into a sticky as an aid to novices such as myself.

Do you know off hand how much area one of the diamonds cover at 600 yards? Or the better question would be is their an explanation at SWFA's website that explains how much area the diamond subtends cover at each distances in intervals of say 100 yards? IIRC do not the the dots in mil-dot scopes cover a known area at certain distances?

I ask because I wish to be certain the subtends will not be so large as to cover to much of a deer or elk's vital area so as to make precise aiming difficult.

Thanks for your patience and indulging so many questions form a novice such as myself, but this scope represents a significant investment so I wish to be sure before I commit.

Thanks again,
DJ/Art.

 

[FEENIX]

Thank you FEENIX for an over and above effort to supply me with accurate information. That is an excellent visual demonstration that the mods here might want to consider turning it into a sticky as an aid to novices such as myself.

Do you know off hand how much area one of the diamonds cover at 600 yards? Or the better question would be is their an explanation at SWFA's website that explains how much area the diamond subtends cover at each distances in intervals of say 100 yards? IIRC do not the the dots in mil-dot scopes cover a known area at certain distances?

I ask because I wish to be certain the subtends will not be so large as to cover to much of a deer or elk's vital area so as to make precise aiming difficult.

Thanks for your patience and indulging so many questions form a novice such as myself, but this scope represents a significant investment so I wish to be sure before I commit.

Thanks again,
DJ/Art.

You're quite welcome! Perhaps this might help >>> SWFA SS Reticle Subtensions - The Optics Talk Forums

 

[DartonJager]

Thanks to all who took the time to share with me their experience in helping me make my choice. By a stroke of luck while doing one of my Goggle searches a review of the exact SAFA scope I'm interested in complete with excellent pictures of the FFP reticle's size on a target at multiple ranges popped up from of all places but this website.

It showed quite clearly although not perfect, the FFP reticle is more than acceptable at both 100 and 500 yards for making precise shots on game.

Again,
Thanks to all,
DJ/Art

 

[Rymart]

This more a matter of specific reticles used in a specific FFP scope, than a general SFP vs FFP issue.

The reticle on the FFP SWFA SS scopes (I have the 5-20x50 HD) is pretty thick, which is good if you need to use it at low magnification. It's very functional for big game hunting. Other FFP scope reticle designs not-so-much. I have a FFP Leupold mark 4 with the TMR reticle. It is a very fine reticle designed originally for SFP scopes and carried over to the FFP scope line up. It is almost useless in dark timber at low magnification, period. The only issue I've had with the SWFA reticle was trying to shoot ground squirrels at 1000+ yards. The reticle size at that distance was enough to cover some of them completely. I just used one of the corners of the center crosshair as my aiming point and adjusted appropriately.

Some FFP scope reticle designs are quite innovative and have features that make them usable at all magnifications. A good example is the reticle on the Bushnell LRHS scopes. It has a circle around the center of the reticle at the 2 mil sub-tensions. At high magnification, it is unobtrusive (IMO) and just there, when zoomed down to lower power where the reticle is thin, the circle works as a quick acquisition aiming circle. On other purposed-designed FFP reticles, the fine hash-marks (0.2 mil) on the reticle are very functional for wind holds at high magnification, and at lower magnification they make the reticle crosshairs appear thicker. A good feature to have on a FFP scope is illumination. At low power in dark timber with a thin FFP reticle, illumination makes it useful.

Also note that on FFP scopes, diopter adjustment is much more fussy and requires precise adjustment. If the diopter is not properly adjusted, the glass will appear to be sub-par.