Load Analysis, Your assistance would be greatly appreciated

[Canhunter35]

Honestly I was just shooting for velocities, wind was terrible that day. I didnt even walk down and look at my target. I can shoot 100 yards out the back door of my shop so I'm trying to do all my load development at that distance. It's a couple hours drive for me to get a 400 yard shot. Only range I know of around here with more than 100 is only 300 and steel plates, so not ideal

That target I posted on ur other thread, I developed that load at 100. I shot groups in increasing powder charges, recorded group sizes then shot larger groups within the node, identifying the outer limits then chose a powder charge in the middle. From there I shot groups using varying seating depths.
The flat spot in velocity does not necessarily indicate your most accurate node.
Good luck in ur load building

 

[birdiemc]

Thanks. I was trying the Saterlee method I saw at 65guys, but have since figured out that one of the keys to his method that I've been lacking is excellent brass prep. So anybody out there wondering if his method works, not if you have crappy cases...and I'm

 

[BallisticsGuy]

Thanks. I was trying the Saterlee method I saw at 65guys, but have since figured out that one of the keys to his method that I've been lacking is excellent brass prep. So anybody out there wondering if his method works, not if you have crappy cases...and I'm

I've had extremely good results with Boxtobenchprecision.com 100yrd load development targets and the method that they come with (see the site for instructions). Run 2 powders or 2 bullets or 2 whatevers, keep everythig else the same. Load in .2-.5gn increments at .040 bullet jump to find one that groups decently. Take that one and play with the seating depths from .010 to .120. Somewhere in there you'll find a decent load. Using this method I'll load 20 or 40 rounds (5 shots per set) and run the powder test. Usually I'll find a good one before those shots are all fired. Then I'll tweak with the seating depth at the coarse increments listed on the target and set up 10 rounds of each. I'll fire five of each and if one shows really sparkly results I'll fire the other 5. I haven't burned more than 50 rounds developing a load since I found them even when I was screwing around racing paper.

I even did a test recently (https://longrangehunting.com/thread...n550-rl23-imr-4166-h4350.213871/#post-1554941) with 4 different powders with 6 different powder charges on that target for my new 6XC barrel and nailed my match load in under 50 rounds. The nice bit is they're not paper. They're a kind of plastic sheeting so you can pull it down and keep it on file, even re-post it later and shoot at it again without it degrading or tearing like paper.

 

[birdiemc]

Dusty, I ordered some stuff from brownells just waiting for it to get here, then going to do exactly what you suggested. Got a primer pocket uniformer and flash hole deburring tool coming. Figure if I'm gonna do it I might as well do it right. I even been eyeballing my lathe complemplating the best way to use it to turn down necks. And by best way I mean cheapest way with what I got, but still achieve perfect results.

Finally got my package in the mail so I took 32 cases I had been waiting to try and I took off a lot of metal cleaning up flash holes and primer pockets. Now need to trim them, and sort by weight. Still not to turning necks yet but I think from what I've read on here this should help things come a long way. Hopefully can get them trimmed, sorted and loaded up tomorrow, and depending on the wind try to re do the test I started out to do.

 

[DUSTY NOGGIN]

so did you get a turner?? which one ??

 

[birdiemc]

so did you get a turner?? which one ??

No I meant I'm not to that point yet, but I think fixing primer pockets and flash holes should help quite a bit.
I have seen a video where somebody chucked up a neck Turner in the 4 jaw, then held the case in their hand and fed it onto the rotating mandrel instead of turning the case and holding the mandrel/cutter still. Got me to thinking how I could rig up something like that with the lathe I got sitting a foot from my reloading bench

 

[birdiemc]

All right for all of you who have just been sitting around biting your nails waiting to hear how my load development is coming along. I got my primer pocket uniformer, I got my flash hole deburring tool, I figured out how to anneal my brass, got it looking like the ones dusty sent me (thank you again for that) ditched the Lee lock rings and went with hornady rings on my dies. Continued on with the test I had begun at the start of this thread. 15 rounds total 3 each at following charges, 44.6, 44.8, 45.0, 45.2, 45.4
.308 win, Varget, 168 smk,
Not sure what happened on that 3rd shot string but it looks awful, if you take that out the other 2 seem to have a trend, but the average with all 3 factored in looks more like the target IMO. Either way looks like 45.0 is the magic number right?

 

[Elkeater]

Umm, how did the shots group on paper?
What I would do is leave the chrony off the barrel, and load up in .5gr increments starting at 43-46 and shoot 400yards or farther on a calm day, your grouping and vertical spread will come together and that's your node. Then you can do the same thing with a seating depth test if you're still not happy with results
I would be surprised if your gun doesn't like near 44gr of varget with those 168s

+1 on the 44 gr of varget. My .308 really likes 44gr of varget with a 168 eldm loaded to mag length in Hornady match brass with WLR primers.

 

[birdiemc]

I guess just for grins I'll load up some at 44 when I test 45 just to see how it groups since that seems to be a common recommendation...I'm definitely not one to think I have to have the highest velocity possible

 

[birdiemc]

Just realized I marked my target wrong, the bottom middle group was 45.4 not 45.2. 2 shots at black dot were sighting in

 

[sedancowboy]

I would load 45.2, Look at your second graph. Also that group is the most concentric.

 

[birdiemc]

Yes 45.2 measures 0.634" but 45.4 opens up to 1.02 and POI shifts up and left, so it seems 45.0 would provide a little more room for error in charge weight. From what I understand I should be able to tighten that group (0.735") with seating depth adjustments. Currently I'm at max COAL to fit in my magazine 2.883"(avg) CBTO 2.308" +- .001.
To be honest, this is my first ever "successful" load development since I've started trying to reload. I've been fighting a crappy factory rifle and using heavier bullets than this rifle likes. I had a couple posts that went into everything that got me to this point, but short version I've managed to go from 3" groups with occasional 6" - 9" flyer to this, so I am very pleased.

 

[BallisticsGuy]

You've got solid sub minute grouping going on. I'd be loading 45.1 as your optimum and allow 45-45.2gn. You've got the accuracy and the velocity spread there is very small. It's a good idea to set yourself up so that tiny variances in your loads won't disturb your expected performance. When I'm loading small batches for development I'm a lot more conscientious and slow than when I'm loading huge batches for competition. It helps to have a nice flat spot where .1-.2gn up or down won't have any appreciable effect.

 

[L.Sherm]

I might have missed it but have you seated the bullets closer to the lands to see if accuracy improves? I did see where your seating them at max mag box length but if it shoots longer o.a.l and your satisfied with the rifle maybe worth adding a wyatts extended box.
Just some thought.