Hammer Bullets and Hyper Velocity, The Misconception

[Alibiiv]

There is one thing going for them, it looks like they are one of the only ones with product in stock and ready to ship.

67g SH in 257 WBY, hmmm...

Or the 116g AH in 270 Win, might be worth a try.

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..........................................don't tell everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[snox801]

If you are adding published data as a means to pick a bullet I would have to assume it based on safety. If you rely on that for safety you already are being unsafe. If you follow proper load building safety guide lines you only use that published data for a starting point. Anything other than that is worthless. Each rifle is different and needs to be laid as a individual rig. So load data is just a guideline which can also be completed and to a better degree with quick loads.
So I'm not seeing your point.
Not to mention we are talking about bullets note data collected for reloading. I clearly stated that I find nothing a Barnes could do better. Not the company itself or anything.
I used to be all in on Barnes. If you looked up old threads you would see. Then I tried hammers and all I personally have experienced is they do everything better than Barnes did for me for my given use.
Small
List includes
Easier to load for
Better on game performance based on what I believe is softer copper,
And more velocity. Sure I'm missing some but u get the point.

 

[snox801]

https://bergerbullets.com/barnes-tests-proves-why-berger-hunting-vlds-are-so-successful/ Thought I'd share this info.

Sorry I know I'm gonna get crap for this but I can never get behind Berger. They are like mechanical broadheads when they work nothing is better when they fail well.
For every guide or hunter who says they are amazing you hear just as many or more with horror stories. Something you never hear for other consistent bullets. Have you ever heard a guide say he won't let or frowns upon partition? Nope.
But I really do have to admit that they do impress me when they work and I have no real experience with a failure so I may be off base. But I don't have a lot of money so when I go after a once in a lifetime hunt I give up certain things for a guarantee.
Same reason I still use fixed blade.
Let's all be glad we have choices.
If everyone drove a ford I would get to feel vastly more manly then many on the road.

 

[Pdvdh]

Berger performance on game is one big reason Hammer bullets have such a devoted following.

You wanna eat steaks, or hamBergers?

 

[snox801]

I'm always more worried about the dreaded not opening or pencil of Berger you hear about or the I hit the shoulder socket and lost the animal. And let's be fair failures can and will happen to everyone and everything. It's just seems to be way to prevalent in Berger's than any other. In fact broz even goes the extra mile to clean the tips out of his. Maybe that is why he has such success. Or because he can frickin shoot and rarely has less than ideal **** placement.

 

[ButterBean]

I'm always more worried about the dreaded not opening or pencil of Berger you hear about or the I hit the shoulder socket and lost the animal. And let's be fair failures can and will happen to everyone and everything. It's just seems to be way to prevalent in Berger's than any other. In fact broz even goes the extra mile to clean the tips out of his. Maybe that is why he has such success. Or because he can frickin shoot and rarely has less than ideal **** placement.

No such worries with the Hammers

 

[Pdvdh]

I've had Bergers both pencil, and blow.
Never again for me. My leftover Bergers are solely used on paper.
I consider them explosive varmint bullets, when they do expand. FMJs when they don't.

 

[jwp475]

If you are adding published data as a means to pick a bullet I would have to assume it based on safety. If you rely on that for safety you already are being unsafe. If you follow proper load building safety guide lines you only use that published data for a starting point. Anything other than that is worthless. Each rifle is different and needs to be laid as a individual rig. So load data is just a guideline which can also be completed and to a better degree with quick loads.
So I'm not seeing your point.
Not to mention we are talking about bullets note data collected for reloading. I clearly stated that I find nothing a Barnes could do better. Not the company itself or anything.
I used to be all in on Barnes. If you looked up old threads you would see. Then I tried hammers and all I personally have experienced is they do everything better than Barnes did for me for my given use.
Small
List includes
Easier to load for
Better on game performance based on what I believe is softer copper,
And more velocity. Sure I'm missing some but u get the point.

I have an 1885 Highwall in 35 Whelen with 28" barrel. I'm shooting 220 grain Hammer with 64 grains of Power Pro Varmint and chronographing an average of 2911 FPS with less than 1/2 MOA accuracy. Easiest load development I've experienced.

 

[Red88]

I just got back from a WY elk hunt and got a bull at 150yds with the 260gr hammer doing 2950 out of my 338 RUM. First round was a head on shot when they spotted or winded me. The second shot was through the shoulders as that was all I could see through the trees. The bull never went 10yds. Found the shank of the first bullet in the back strap due to the angle he was facing me. Also found five petals. Didn't get to do much of an autopsy on the bull because of grizzly county but was pleased with the results.

 

[DUSTY NOGGIN]

what media are you using to test minimum expansion

 

[ButterBean]

what media are you using to test minimum expansion

Water in jugs and Ballistic Gel have both been used

 

[Stgraves260]

Bullet Reference Charts

DESCRIPTION LEGEND FB: Flat Base High BC FB: High BC Flat Base BR Column: Bench Rest Flat Base BT: Boat Tail Long Range BT/Juggernaut: Long Range Boat Tail VLD: Very Low Drag Hybrid: Combination Secant and Tangent Ogive LR Hybrid: Long Range Hybrid AR Hybrid/Classic Hunter: Short Nose Hybrid...

bergerbullets.com

 

[Hard rock]

Bullet Reference Charts

DESCRIPTION LEGEND FB: Flat Base High BC FB: High BC Flat Base BR Column: Bench Rest Flat Base BT: Boat Tail Long Range BT/Juggernaut: Long Range Boat Tail VLD: Very Low Drag Hybrid: Combination Secant and Tangent Ogive LR Hybrid: Long Range Hybrid AR Hybrid/Classic Hunter: Short Nose Hybrid...

bergerbullets.com

If your trying too discuss the Pros and cons of Berger bullets why don't you start your own thread on that subject this thread is about Hammer bullets no offense intended would like too hear the responses of Bergers might be interesting

 

[Stgraves260]

It appears that Berger bullets is revamping their bullets and how they get their data. I have been hunting long range sense the 90s. Started long range shooting in the 80s. That being said I stated in a comment I made that Berger bullet only need 1300 FPS for proper expansion. I have that data in my personal data book. I'm following up to give accurate and proper data. I can not find on any of my research to back up my info on 1300 FPS for proper expansion other than what I have in my sniper data book. I have had the 1300 FPS in my data sense the 90s because that's when my bullets were made. I do have bullets that we're made in the 2000s. On my 6.5 cal 140 grain bullets, the BC show to be .612. The new 6.5 140 BC show to be .600 and some .589 in social media. Berger has a video out that I will be getting soon that talks about all this. I will give updates when I get the video/DVD. As of now I will be using the 1300 FPS min for proper expansion on my pre 2000 Berger bullets because that's seams to be when they started making changes. Walt Berger sold the company in 1999 or 2000 so that probably has something to do with it. I have read that Bryian Litz is in Berger's research and development team. Mr Lits is the man who created JBM ballistic calculations. I think people should look him up and you will find a lot of bullet manufactures use his theories for bullet drag/BC/form factor. I found a post that Barns Bullets posted some misinformation about Berger bullets needed 1800 FPS for proper expansion. This is misleading people in a negative way. Barns has refrained his post but you can still find the old post in the web. I would suggest following the manufactures suggestions on what is needed for their bullets for optimal performance. I used to use wet newspaper to test my bullets on proper expansion, but I would get my results at the actual distance, meaning 50 yards, 500 yards, 1000 yards 1500 yards and so on. I would NOT get my info at 50 yards and just make light loads so that they would get minimum velocities. I feel this would give improper date because the bullet would not have time to stabilize after leaving the barrel. Back in the day when I started my own research I found by using that method bullets would sometimes smack the newspaper sideways and not fly true. The bullets need time to stabilize and the proper velocity just to be able to exit the barrel correctly. That's a hole other discussion. Hope this all helps. Sorry so lengthy. It was not a easy answer.