Best Elk Bullet

[WildRose]

korhil78

I couldn't help but notice as I was reading your post that you think deer run pretty far when shot. I've shot a couple of dozen and I can't recall one that ran more than a few steps other than the 3 or 4 that were already running when hit but even they flopped over in 10 yards or so. I'm talking whitetail up to 250 pounds but averaging maybe 160 lbs. Eighty percent of those deer were shot with a 6mm Rem using 100 grain Sierra Game Kings. I'd almost always find the bullet on the opposite rib just under the hide. I can only conclude that I made a lucky pick in the equipment I used compared to what I might have tried. Thanks for the info.

I'm with Korhill here. Most of the white tail I've shot or seen shot took off like a shot if they weren't hit in the spine or head. I've been amazed by some of them that covered over a hundred yards before expiring only to find that pretty much everything in the chest cavity was the consistency of runny jello once I opened them up.

Two or three years ago I took a nice 10 point that in spite of being shot straight though the shoulders still managed to cover about forty of fifty yards before finally crashing. He was shot with a .300wm, at just over 300yds and the bullet was a 180gr Sirocco II. Exit wound was a little bigger than a golf ball.

 

[bigngreen]

I bought some of the LR to try.

They blow up worse than a Berger from the hits I've seen, don't know anyone personally who has even finished a season shooting them.

The ONLY reason I responded is you started your thread wanting the best elk bullet and I though I'd try to see if you were open to learning, obviously not, some Berger's that work best for hunting are not designated as such because if they are classed as hunting they can not be sold for military and some other uses which sell far more bullets.
I honestly couldn't care less about what make the bullet is as long as it destroys elk, I've shot a lot of "elk bullets" that were in no way fit to be shot at elk, I would consider it stupid to just go hunting with a bullet based only on manufacture suggestions, I'll shoot some deer then I'll shoot some elk in situations where my buddy can back the shot up if something does not work or I can easily shoot them again before I'll consider a bullet one that I'd carry and recommend shooting elk with, body count not marketing!
Accubonds work well, keep them over 2200 fps impact and if you shoot lighter than the 200 don't shoot them in the shoulder, you get some blood trail most of the time.

 

[WildRose]

Ok good I think you both need to call and tell Berger to stop giving out wrong information since you know them by name. I was told not to use anything but hunting bullets for hunting from Berger tech. I was also told Their bullet is design to shed its weight on impact and create damage inside the cavity. I CAN'T BELIEVE I have to keep repeating my self! It like arguing with my 4 year old I tell him something and he just doesn't listen. So when you say I should have ask sooner I did. I can only use the information I got from them and that was not to use them for hunting Period. """" PER BERGER TECH!!!!!!!!!!""""" Also I have to be honest with you if a Berger 185 is too small for deer then I guess I will go back to my 6mm 95gr Sierra partition. Always a blood trail and Never lost an animal. Really getting sick of it all maybe I will just hunt elk with it to and shoot them in the head. Look I think what I wrote was NO BERGER when I ask. I'm not saying that some Berger don't come out but I know from my experience is on a perfect broad side shot on a lot of animals I had no exit. You can Buy all you want I'm not. I have a lot for all cal.

Broz, Feenix, and the other guys who have killed more elk than most of us will ever see are guys you want to listen to when it comes to killing elk. I promise you they have more real world experience hunting and killing elk than anyone you can talk to at Berger.

I'm not a Berger guy and don't shoot them at game animals but they do and have a great deal of success. For myself I don't like to use any frangible bullets on game animals.

I like clean, caliber or sub caliber size entrance wounds, massive internal damage and exit wounds the size of a golf ball or less with minimal meat loss. If I'm shooting lead core bullets I want a quality bonded bullet like the Hornady Interbond (all time favorite) Nosler Accubond or Accubond LR's.

 

[ski-dooz]

From what you have been stating, you need to stick with a bonded bullet like the regular accubond. The LR Accubond is going to be too soft for your tastes. It will come apart on you at closer ranges. The regular accubond will retain a lot more weight. The hornady interbond used to be a really good bonded bullet but they quit makIng it.

Also take a look at the trophy bonded bearclaw and the swift scirocco 2. Those should be right up your alley but I would go with the regular accubond.

Ok I will put the LR On the shelf. My buddy had some factory loads with scirocco in them. He bought them to get more casings for reloading. He shot them one day just to get his gun on paper from a new scope purchase. I was impressed at the group he shot with that factory ammo.

 

[ski-dooz]

Broz, Feenix, and the other guys who have killed more elk than most of us will ever see are guys you want to listen to when it comes to killing elk. I promise you they have more real world experience hunting and killing elk than anyone you can talk to at Berger.

I'm not a Berger guy and don't shoot them at game animals but they do and have a great deal of success. For myself I don't like to use any frangible bullets on game animals.

I like clean, caliber or sub caliber size entrance wounds, massive internal damage and exit wounds the size of a golf ball or less with minimal meat loss. If I'm shooting lead core bullets I want a quality bonded bullet like the Hornady Interbond (all time favorite) Nosler Accubond or Accubond LR's.

Thanks good info just what I was asking for. Like I said I don't care how many elk they shot. I was looking for what you exactly what you just gave me. I will look at that intrebond. Thanks Again

 

[WildRose]

Awesome Where can I Buy some?

Contact Hermann Weidemann who is their rep here in the US.

<[email protected]>

Here is their website. Their graphics don't do the actual bullets any justice so don't get hung up on the way they look.

https://www.peregrinebullets.com/plainsmaster-reloading-bullets/

The bullets you are interested are the Plainsmaster VRG4 and the VLR. The VLR is still in development, it is a more streamlined higher BC version of the VRG4. I shot about a hundred of the VLR's over the last few months and they do just exactly what they are intended to do. They fly very well, hit very hard and leave things dead, dead, dead as long as I do my part and put them where they need to be.

I've shot a lot of different bullets over the years and I've never seen the kind of consistent terminal performance on game that I've gotten out of these.

They are not an inexpensive bullet for sure but they pair each of the VRG4's with a target bullet (OTM) that you can use for load development, practice, varmints and such and the difference in POI is negligible. Because of the OTM design they are much simpler and cheaper to produce and are priced accordingly.

 

[WildRose]

That's good to know, I have some 212s and 220s to try. gun)

I shot a couple of deer and several hogs with the 6.5 and .30 cal versions.

They seem to hold together pretty well as long as the impact velocity is under 2,500fps but above that they were coming apart on me. Basically they act pretty much identical to their regular Interlocks.

 

[WildRose]

I don't see it as an issue at all. The bullets resulted in dead deer in short order. Doesn't bother me at all that they don't hold together super well. The dead deer was a good enough result for me.

On deer it's not that big of a deal.

Where it can become a real problem is on bigger, heavier bodied animals and particularly on big hogs because not only are they extremely densely bodied the shield that covers their shoulders can be three inches or more thick. It's amazing what you can find stuck in the shield of a big old boar.

 

[BULLBLASTER]

On deer it's not that big of a deal.

Where it can become a real problem is on bigger, heavier bodied animals and particularly on big hogs because not only are they extremely densely bodied the shield that covers their shoulders can be three inches or more thick. It's amazing what you can find stuck in the shield of a big old boar.

That is completely understandable. We don't have hogs around here and for elk I'd grab a bigger rifle than my 6.5. My impact velocities were also pretty high as the shots were 140 and 300 yards. I'm a fan of big bullets for big or tough animals.

 

[WildRose]

From what you have been stating, you need to stick with a bonded bullet like the regular accubond. The LR Accubond is going to be too soft for your tastes. It will come apart on you at closer ranges. The regular accubond will retain a lot more weight. The hornady interbond used to be a really good bonded bullet but they quit makIng it.

Also take a look at the trophy bonded bearclaw and the swift scirocco 2. Those should be right up your alley but I would go with the regular accubond.

The Interbond is actually back in production and starting to show up in some of their factory ammo. I talked with one of their development guys a couple of months ago who told me we should expect to see them on the shelves again sooner rather than later.

I also asked him if they'd be adding some heavy for caliber Interbonds to the old/existing lineup and to that he couldn't say for sure. If they do I'll be selling a few hundred Accubonds, Accubond LR's, and ELD-X's at a real bargain before long.

 

[Axl]

I agree nice write up. The reason why I ever started this all is two years ago I lost a elk that I shot at 150 yards with a 185 Berger and it has haunted me ever since. I know I hit it in the lungs quartering forward it folded and ran away. No blood looked for 4 hours never found it. I know it was dead some where but again no blood. When I got back I started looking for answers so I called Berger. That's when I found out they are not supposed to exit. I ask about heavier bullets and they said to use the 210 hunting. Whitetails are tough animals and they do take a lot to KO.

Ok just a little of my background I have hunted the west for 40 years. I have worked at my family wild game shop for most of that time primarily at intake. i have always had a keen interest in ballistics both terminal and external. While not scientific I have questioned every hunter about the bullet/broad head, range etc. on close to 10,000 animals.

There is not a single bullet or broad head that is by some accounts the most lethal to be had and by other accounts the reason a game animal was lost. Every bullet you can name I have had guys swear by them and guys swear at them.

If you don't recover the animal bullet performance and placement are NOT something you can say for certain.

Bullet placement should be your focus. There is a gentleman that used to come into the shop every year for 20+ years with a mature bull and a big buck that he shot with a m 700 in 22-250 with factory 55 grain. Not something I would recommend but he was very happy with his set up.

One of my hunting partners has used a 120 gr barnes out of a 7 stw for a long time collecting many elk, deer, and bears out to 650 yds without any long tracking.

I have personally used Hornady btsp, speer grand slams, lots of barnes, siroccos, SMK's Hornady IB, and Berger. In 270 win, 280 ai 28 nos 30/06 300 wby 300 win 338 Lapua. When I went from the 270 to the 300 wby the first 5 or 6 elk I shot ran farther than any i shot with a 270 (both using barnes).


I am now shooting a 300 win with 215 Bergers and a 28 Nos with 180 Bergers.
My son shot a Bull moose with the 28 Nos this past year at 188 yards through the lungs. It was the first moose I have witnessed out of 12 that dropped dead in his tracks with 1 shot. The 180 grain vld was under the opposite side hide weighing 77 grains. I have also seen a few bergers not expand much at long range.

Bottom line is there are a lot of good bullet choices out there find one that your gun shoots well and shoot it a LOT!

The best elk bullet is one you have confidence to place it where it needs to go.

 

[Pharmseller]

I've killed a few elk with 180 grain .308 caliber Partitions. A few from a .30-06, a few from a 300 Weatherby Mag, back when I thought I needed a magnum. I didn't, but I didn't know it yet. The elk didn't go far.

I've also killed a few elk with 180 grain Core-Lokts (good old green box) out of a .30-06. The elk didn't go far.

I'll tell you two secrets about elk hunting: finding them is harder than killing them. The second secret is shoot them through the lungs and they'll die, sooner rather than later. I'd spend more time thinking about what boots I'm going to wear rather than what bullet I'm going to shoot.





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[Rymart]

Ok good I think you both need to call and tell Berger to stop giving out wrong information since you know them by name. I was told not to use anything but hunting bullets for hunting from Berger tech. I was also told Their bullet is design to shed its weight on impact and create damage inside the cavity. I CAN'T BELIEVE I have to keep repeating my self! It like arguing with my 4 year old I tell him something and he just doesn't listen. So when you say I should have ask sooner I did. I can only use the information I got from them and that was not to use them for hunting Period. """" PER BERGER TECH!!!!!!!!!!""""" Also I have to be honest with you if a Berger 185 is too small for deer then I guess I will go back to my 6mm 95gr Sierra partition. Always a blood trail and Never lost an animal. Really getting sick of it all maybe I will just hunt elk with it to and shoot them in the head. Look I think what I wrote was NO BERGER when I ask. I'm not saying that some Berger don't come out but I know from my experience is on a perfect broad side shot on a lot of animals I had no exit. You can Buy all you want I'm not. I have a lot for all cal.

6

OK AGAIN! ONE MORE TIME FOR THE SLOW GUYS THAT CAN'T READ SO GOOD! I said I was looking for some experience from other bullets. NO BERGER! Right in my question! So before you chime in again elk killer learn how to read! Now I know why are country is so screwed up. People want to tell you all about what you don't want to know so they can hear themselves talk about themselves and how great they are. I do not care if you made all elk extinct with Berger bullets! I'm not looking for Berger data at all! I DON"T CARE!!!!!!!! Now Please I'm Looking for another manufactures bullet and their performance on elk. Thank You!

FYI: If Berger said don't use them for hunting. To say language edit I'm going to use them anyway is not only show you have mental problems. It shows your risking not being a good ethical hunter knowing the bullet you are using was not designed to kill humanly it was designed for putting holes in paper. In fact that was the exact quote!

OMG!!! This would be funny if it wasn't so pitiful. Talk about a 4-year old! More like a 2-year-old throwing a tantrum when he doesn't get the answer he expects/wants, lol. Some newbie with 31 posts (almost half of those on this thread) whining about getting the BEST answer to his original question "What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal...."

But let's move from the topic of reading comprehension and go to the topic of how to ask an intelligent question... verses a ****-poor, unspecific, rambling question, that contradicts itself. What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal?... but let's eliminate the obvious answer, haha... Kind of a trap.

WHY NOT just ask what the best bullet for elk is that's not a Berger?

And while you're at it, why not specify what cartridge and barrel length you're using and at what ranges you expect to be shooting.

I'll break it down further:

What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal. –---- You got your answer over-and-over-and-over-again

Has anyone used the ELDX? –--- You got that answer too

What weight is the best? –--- Again! Have you ever tried a 215 gr Berger, or just the 185's? They're two completely different bullets. For longer range shots, and penetration in general, heavy-for-caliber is best (higher sectional density = better penetration.)

Looking for Blood trail bullets. –--- Try an arrow ... Big exit/entrance holes leave good blood trails. Shot placement matters. Worst blood trails I've ever seen were from bullets that penetrated completely and left pretty much 'pencil hole' wounds (Barnes and Accubonds).

No Berger's. ---- Lol, so much for the first question.

I don't want a bullet the loose 90% of its weight. ---- False premise in this statement. You've already been shown plenty of evidence in this thread about much less than 90% weight shed. Nice grammar/spelling on this part by the way...

All that said, I made two kills this season with the ELD-X bullets (6.5mm, not 30 cal) and they were all I had hoped for. Shot a cow elk at 350 yards, with a 143 ELD-x from a 260 Rem. (2810 fps muzzle velocity). Broke both shoulders and exited. The blood trail was excellent (all 5 yards of it )!

Berger Target/Tactical bullets have thicker jackets than the 'hunting' bullets (as per Berger) and as such they typically shed less weight and penetrate better. Some of them make excellent hunting bullets. I prefer them to the 'hunting' labeled bullets. They really are right up your alley, just make sure the tips are open.

If you're not smart enough to understand how the Hauge Convention affects the way bullet manufacturers market to remain eligible for military contracts, if you're not competent enough to do your own testing, if you don't have the sense to listen to others with more knowledge and experience than you.... Well then just keep on listening to the Berger Tech and reading the side of bullet boxes. Have fun with those Barnes/Partitions. Use them at long range and you can write a thread about how that blood trail just kept going and going and going...

 

[WildRose]

OMG!!! This would be funny if it wasn't so pitiful. Talk about a 4-year old! More like a 2-year-old throwing a tantrum when he doesn't get the answer he expects/wants, lol. Some newbie with 31 posts (almost half of those on this thread) whining about getting the BEST answer to his original question "What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal...."

But let's move from the topic of reading comprehension and go to the topic of how to ask an intelligent question... verses a ****-poor, unspecific, rambling question, that contradicts itself. What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal?... but let's eliminate the obvious answer, haha... Kind of a trap.

WHY NOT just ask what the best bullet for elk is that's not a Berger?

And while you're at it, why not specify what cartridge and barrel length you're using and at what ranges you expect to be shooting.

I'll break it down further:

What is the best elk bullet for a 30 cal. –---- You got your answer over-and-over-and-over-again

Has anyone used the ELDX? –--- You got that answer too

What weight is the best? –--- Again! Have you ever tried a 215 gr Berger, or just the 185's? They're two completely different bullets. For longer range shots, and penetration in general, heavy-for-caliber is best (higher sectional density = better penetration.)

Looking for Blood trail bullets. –--- Try an arrow ... Big exit/entrance holes leave good blood trails. Shot placement matters. Worst blood trails I've ever seen were from bullets that penetrated completely and left pretty much 'pencil hole' wounds (Barnes and Accubonds).

No Berger's. ---- Lol, so much for the first question.

I don't want a bullet the loose 90% of its weight. ---- False premise in this statement. You've already been shown plenty of evidence in this thread about much less than 90% weight shed. Nice grammar/spelling on this part by the way...

All that said, I made two kills this season with the ELD-X bullets (6.5mm, not 30 cal) and they were all I had hoped for. Shot a cow elk at 350 yards, with a 143 ELD-x from a 260 Rem. (2810 fps muzzle velocity). Broke both shoulders and exited. The blood trail was excellent (all 5 yards of it )!

Berger Target/Tactical bullets have thicker jackets than the 'hunting' bullets (as per Berger) and as such they typically shed less weight and penetrate better. Some of them make excellent hunting bullets. I prefer them to the 'hunting' labeled bullets. They really are right up your alley, just make sure the tips are open.

If you're not smart enough to understand how the Hauge Convention affects the way bullet manufacturers market to remain eligible for military contracts, if you're not competent enough to do your own testing, if you don't have the sense to listen to others with more knowledge and experience than you.... Well then just keep on listening to the Berger Tech and reading the side of bullet boxes. Have fun with those Barnes/Partitions. Use them at long range and you can write a thread about how that blood trail just kept going and going and going...

What powder and load are you using for the .260 with the 143gr ELD-X?