Am I about to blow my face off?

[Joefrazell]

Using your velocity to watch pressure along with other things is good practice. Rl26 is known for being fast. I've gotten 2930 with the 225's and a 26" bartlein barrel in the win mag with no pressure signs. I backed off the load just a touch and was getting just over 2900. If I were you I'd shoot for the 2930-2960 range. You should have a good node somewhere in that area. Remember it's winter and to be careful come summer with a iffy load

 

[Subzero]

RL 26 is known for it's impressive velocities. There's also several members on here (myself included) that have seen some weird velocity/pressure spikes in temps over 80 degrees when using this powder. I wouldn't push it any more if I were you. Before I switched over to H1000 in my .300 Win Mag I was running the Berger 210 vld's, ADG brass and Federal GM215M's with 73.1 gr RL 26 (26" barrel) and getting slightly over 3,000 fps muzzle velocity as measured with a Magnetospeed. Below is a 5-shot velocity confirmation check I did this past summer several months before hunting season opened.
View attachment 252297

Thanks for sharing your data. It puts me at ease knowing someone else was in the 3,000fps range. I never thought that kind of velocity was possible with a 210/212gr bullet in a 300 win mag.

With the simple parameters you gave, I ran the numbers in QL. What I am missing is your case capacity, which is a deal breaker. 76gr yields 61K in pressure.
BUT, big but, you had ejector marks at 75gr, whether new brass or fired, time to quit. Velocity is a result of pressure, no getting around that. If you feel the velocities are high, find another chrono and find out.

There is no set standard for speeds from different platforms, barrels are not the same, nothing is linear here. And don't compare a different bullet of close to the same weight, bearing surface, maybe even a slight diameter difference plays hard here.
Pull the bullets from the 76gr loads and call it a day, you probably won't blow your face off, but why go there? Shoot a lighter bullet if you need more speed.

Thanks for running the numbers for me. It seems like your data and my observations on my brass are in the same ballpark at least.

 

[Subzero]

Using your velocity to watch pressure along with other things is good practice. Rl26 is known for being fast. I've gotten 2930 with the 225's and a 26" bartlein barrel in the win mag with no pressure signs. I backed off the load just a touch and was getting just over 2900. If I were you I'd shoot for the 2930-2960 range. You should have a good node somewhere in that area. Remember it's winter and to be careful come summer with a iffy load

Shooting 225's at over 2,900fps!? Thats awesome. I want to try the 208 and 225 ELDM's if I can find any...

 

[Deputy819]

Thanks for sharing your data. It puts me at ease knowing someone else was in the 3,000fps range. I never thought that kind of velocity was possible with a 210/212gr bullet in a 300 win mag.

Welcome! My final load was also with once fired brass and ADG brass tends to run on the 'heavier' side....mine is @ 256 grains. With new brass the load was actually 1 grain higher at 74.1 gr for the same velocity range.

 

[Joefrazell]

Shooting 225's at over 2,900fps!? Thats awesome. I want to try the 208 and 225 ELDM's if I can find any...

Yes sir, that's with adg brass and fed 215's. I worked up a load with rl25 just for fun and it only ran them at 2860. It was accurate as all get out though at 2840. Have 5 lbs of the stuff but don't like the velocity instability

 

[ID Mtn Man]

The point here is not to pick on you at all, just to point out that when something seems wrong, or your not sure why your seeing something odd, (like your velocity seems too high) it's time to stop. This is where I messed up.

Agree with this completely. It takes a lot of courage for someone to post up something like this.

If it helps, my attitude about risk has completely changed since working in the ER. An astounding number of self inflicted firearms injuries I see are those more experienced with firearms. As with avalanche safety, it is often the most experienced skiers and mountaineers who make fatal decisions. The thought pattern is frequently traced back to group think and "I've skied this slope in the same conditions a dozen times before". I find this analogous to "this load has worked in my rifle".

In the past, I've pushed the limits with reloading. A lot of that changes when you see the life altering effects of a gun injury.

 

[Tripodmvr7]

I would try 71.2 for a speed of 2870fps on the chrony 5m away. Below is what QL calcs for the 75gr load.

 

[floyd kittrell]

Your intuition seems sound. Several things from your post worthy of investigating before you start shooting again.

Observation:
Lights start going off when you are getting 3031 fps with a load published at 2960 fps- a delta of 60 fps. I immediately find that suspect. Without being able to find anything on how Remington measures velocity on their ammunition, it is hard to tell. We all know the trick, publish the velocity from a high end 26" barrel and slap it on the box. I do not think I have ever seen factory rifles produce velocities above published velocity. I normally expect to see 50-200 fps less than published.

Hypothesis:
The velocities you are getting could be from a chronograph giving an erroneous reading. A lot of the less expensive optical chronographs are notorious for erroneous readings. A slight bend or flex in the body on two, closely spaced optical sensors can skew results greatly. This is a diagram showing how it can happen from the folding style chronographs. A similar effect could happen from a misaligned sensor that is just hot-glued in there, an over-tightened screw, etc.

View attachment 252300
https://precisionrifleblog.com/2012/07/20/chronograph-accuracy-tips-15-practical-tips-to-increase-accuracy-reliability/

Perhaps check your chronograph against a LabRadar, Oehler, Magnetospeed, etc.

In regards to reloading:
Looking at what I have for information Nosler load data goes from 200gr-210gr. This is only for their bullets.
Compare the longest 210 gr bullet Nosler makes, the Accubond LR, to the ELD-X.
Accubond LR o.a.l 1.550"
Hornady 212-gr ELD-X 1.600"
The difference in length: +0.050" from Nosler to Hornady.
The ELD-X is also 2 grains heavier.

None of this says DO NOT use RL26 with that bullet. I'm sure there are TONS of folks who already do. I would suggest you STOP until you find published data for it. Again, your intuition is right. When powder ignites, you are dealing with >60,000 PSI. Small changes can lead to major jumps in pressure. This stuff does not scale linearly. Manufacturers can be a phenomenal resource. Quickloads might help guide you, but it is never a tool from coming up with a new recipe. Keep consulting others who load with that powder and bullet.

Keep us updated with the progress and of course, don't blow yourself up!

Yes Sir Mr. Mtn Man . I have experienced this very thing and saw a known load jump in speed . Had it not been a load I had shot for years , I would have believed the chrony !

 

[Alibiiv]

I just bought a Remington 700 Long Range in .300 win mag. First off, I shot 10rds of factory 180gr core-lokt ammo (the cheap stuff) just to sight in the scope and shoot a couple of groups. Both groups were just under 1in at 3,031fps. I'm pretty happy with that. Now on to reloading.
I started off using 212 ELD-X's and RL-26. I'm using load data from my Nosler manual with loads listed for the 210gr Accubond LR. It lists a max of 76.0gr, at a velocity of 2,874 out of a 24" barrel.

I have a 26" barrel. These were my readings from my Caldwell chronograph:
Remington brass, CCI-250, 74.0gr RL-26, 3.600 COAL = Avg. 2,926fps with no pressure signs at all.
Remington brass, CCI-250, 75.0gr RL-26, 3.600 COAL = Avg. 2,996fps, easy bolt lift, primer still pretty round on edges, slightest ejector mark barely visible.

I was hoping for good speed, but this doesn't seem right. I didn't shoot the rest of my ammo, which I loaded at 76.0gr of RL-26, for fear of blowing myself up.
What do you guys think about these velocity's?
Anyone with QL care to chime in?
Thanks.

I would like to add that the barrel length used for the load data in the Nosler manual is a 24 inch barrel 1-10 twist, you are shooting a 26 inch barrel, twist ??. And......76gr of RL-26 "is" listed at maximum pressure, "for that barrel/twist combination". It does not surprise me that you are getting some additional FPS with the 26 inch barrel over the 24 inch barrel that the loads were developed from. What I have found that the loading manuals are a place to start and work my loads according to the pressure signs that I am getting for my particular rifle. My son and I both have Ruger 77s, tang safety rifles chambered in 35 Whelen. Both rifles were built with the same components/parts by the same gunsmith. Loads that are not "high pressure" loads in my Whelen will blow primers when they are shot in my son's rifle. I personally do not believe that getting an extra 100-200fps due to the extra 2 inches on the barrel is unreasonable as "long" as there are not any other signs of pressure.

 

[StumpGrinder]

I just bought a Remington 700 Long Range in .300 win mag. First off, I shot 10rds of factory 180gr core-lokt ammo (the cheap stuff) just to sight in the scope and shoot a couple of groups. Both groups were just under 1in at 3,031fps. I'm pretty happy with that. Now on to reloading.
I started off using 212 ELD-X's and RL-26. I'm using load data from my Nosler manual with loads listed for the 210gr Accubond LR. It lists a max of 76.0gr, at a velocity of 2,874 out of a 24" barrel.

I have a 26" barrel. These were my readings from my Caldwell chronograph:
Remington brass, CCI-250, 74.0gr RL-26, 3.600 COAL = Avg. 2,926fps with no pressure signs at all.
Remington brass, CCI-250, 75.0gr RL-26, 3.600 COAL = Avg. 2,996fps, easy bolt lift, primer still pretty round on edges, slightest ejector mark barely visible.

I was hoping for good speed, but this doesn't seem right. I didn't shoot the rest of my ammo, which I loaded at 76.0gr of RL-26, for fear of blowing myself up.
What do you guys think about these velocity's?
Anyone with QL care to chime in?
Thanks.

I'm not familiar with that powder however when loading at or near max preassure little things can cause pressure spikes causing potentialy dangerous situations. For instance as temperatures rise so do pressures. Some powders are very temperature sensitive and others are very stable. Check with the manufacturer on the stability of that powder. I would back off half a grain for safety.

 

[Tex_Hunter]

Are you about to blow your face off? Well lets review the details here:

- Brand new rifle with little/no data: check
- used load data from a completely different bullet/weight: check
- Velocity WAY over book max (albeit for a completely different bullet): CHECK <- emphasis added here
- Preliminary pressure signs on brass: check... again

Yeah... Id agree with others that you are well on your way to being faceless, at a minimum please try not to do it at a public range where others could get hurt too.

Seriously, read what actual experts have written on this topic:
1) load data is NEVER interchangeable between two completely different bullets/components
2) Velocity is ALWAYS your best indication of pressure
3) Pressure signs wont show up on brass/primers until you are already dangerously over pressure... again re-read point number 2

Something small like a 223 or a 308 in a decent action (read mauser/weatherby etc) is probably not that dangerous (beyond damage to your wallet) if you have a case failure... you are running almost 2x the amount of powder that the action will have to safely vent in a failure in an action that isnt as well designed.

At a MINIMUM, at least you should be using data for your actual bullet/powder combo. Powder manufacturers post it for free, and load books are cheap, go buy a Hornady manual (they even post data for new bullets on their website for free until a new version is printed) and cross reference it with data from the powder manufacturer. If both of those say you are gtg... THEN and ONLY THEN are you safe.

Just my opinion, worth what you paid for it.

 

[L.Sherm]

The problem I've seen with manuals is ive seen 2 grains different in load data from one to the next with same combo for max.
Its just a guide use commons sense and start low and work up

 

[KS2506]

Where you are at is certainly not going to blow up that 700. It is probably one of the strongest actions made. The three rings of steel they used for advertising for years is no joke. I have had three of them in my shop that had the actions locked up from overloads. One guy forgot and substituted 4895 for 4831 in a 264 Win Mag. The 2nd one in a wild chase after a coyote reloaded his 270 with his buddies 308 reloads. The third one did the same thing with a 25-06. After several days of soaking with Kroil and finally getting the bolt to move, cut off the case, dug out the stuck shell head. Could not find any damage to the bolt every thing worked fine. Fired shells showed no more expansion than normal.

 

[jarnold37]

I have come to the conclusion after many years of reloading that the loading manuals are just a guide line. Some rifles of the same cartridge and barrel can produce different chamber pressures even with exact same load. Many causes for this. Difference in bore diameter, loose or tight chamber, brass hardness or elasticity powder inconsistency and many other variables. I have noticed that almost all of the dozens of best loads for certain gun was not a full case up to the neck. So extra case capacity, by moving the bullet closer to the lands to allow a grain or two more powder made little or no difference in pressure and accuracy. Most of my best loads have been with the bullet either touching or just off ten thousands. Bigger bullets that had the boat tail below the neck shoulder junction did not cause a loss in velocity as seldom had a full case of powder. In the rare instance there was more room needed then a faster burn rate powder was used. Dont think that you have to have a full case of powder. Determine best bullet seating distance from lands and adjust pressure with different burn rate and amount of powder. If your choice of bullet extends deeper into powder area preventing enough powder, the small amount of extra powder space gained by moving bullet out 50 thousands or so will make little if any difference. I order reamers not to cut long throat to "gain" extra powder space but to have the particular bullet touching the riflings with the pressure ring of the bullet very close to the bottom of the neck. If using a bigger bullet which extends deeper than bottom of neck, less powder is needed.