9.53 Saturn, 375-416 Rigby Imp anyone shooting them?

[durak]

Durak, Norma does make Weatherby brass. The Rigby imp in 338 and 375 holds slightly more powder than the 378 case but performance is very close. The rigby imp is slightly faster on average. For me not worth all the extra effort of forming the 416 Rigby brass when you can just get a 378 wby that you probably will not notice the performance diference with. I am having good success with mine at long range. At safe operating pressures the Norma/wby brass has worked well for 60+ years to set numerous 1000 yard world records and win untold numbers of matches. It has been tested succesfully on probably millions of big game animals worldwide during that period. Amazing now new keyboard comando kids come along with limited knowledge/experience trying to tell everyone Norma/Wby brass is no good.

The Lapua brass can perform at higher pressures allowing the lapua cartridges to perform slightly better than equal case capacity cartridges. However you must look at staying within the safe operating pressures of the rifle which haven't changed for the lapua. The 338-300 RUM vs the 338 Lapua is an example where the 338 Lapua may be the best choice with 338 lapua brass. However that does not mean norma/wby brass or remington brass for the 338-300 RUM is no good. I shoot well over 150 rifles from my collection with brass and bullets from all manufactures and when shooting I can not tell a difference which brass is in the chamber. Results and performance are what matter.

The 338-378 wby and 378 wby will outperform the 338 and 375 Lapuas at reduced loads with extremely safe pressures with excellent brass life. Some try to hot load the lapuas to unsafe pressures trying to get within 100-150 fps or so of the 378 case cartridges lessening the life of the brass. I prefer to shoot safe pressures with the 378 case. I have shot norma/wby brass since the 70's at safe pressures with good success. The safe pressures still allowed me to shoot faster and outperform lesser cartridges at higher unsafe pressures.

I guess it all boils down to performance when you get that once in a lifetime chance at an animal. I want the top performance and put every odd in my favor. I have taken hundreds of trophy animals by putting every odd in my favor. All through the years as people have admired my many trophy animals not one person has ever cared what brass I shot them with. Also as I was preparing for the shot for each never once was I concerned that I was shooting worthless wby/norma brass instead of the fantasticly great supperior superperformnce lapua brass.

Thanks for the insight - My main concerns for this build are safety, performance, and repeatability. You're spot on with the brass - My 300 RUM DOES NOT CARE what brand of brass it shoots - Remington, Nosler, or Federal all shoots the same. Case life, well, that's another story......

 

[IdahoCTD]

Amazing now new keyboard comando kids come along with limited knowledge/experience trying to tell everyone Norma/Wby brass is no good.

Nice snide comment. What I basically said is compared to Lapua the Norma/Weatherby brass is soft. I also said Lapua is cheaper. I never said anything about it's accuracy or how it's proven itself. I had a custom 338-378 16-17 years ago when it was a wildcat and I still own a .30-378 Imp. both I built myself. To get decent velocity (not what I would consider excessive) the brass life in my rifles has been poor. Since you seem to be the one who knows it all you might have found a way to get it to last longer but I haven't. Despite what you may think there are other people besides yourself with plenty of experience building their own guns, shooting stuff long range, killing animals, and testing products. I've built my own guns since my early 20's and while I might be a kid to you I'm not a kid. BTW I was on the old site for quite a few years when there was probably 2-3k members at most so it's not like I'm really new to this site either. I'm pretty sure you weren't around then. So you might consider giving your input and not telling everyone else they are idiots or they don't know what they are talking about because they don't do it your way. Despite what you may think or say I'm still going to build what I want for the reasons I want to.

durak,

The Weatherby has more capacity and is longer than a .338 Lapua Imp. case So if your looking for the the highest velocity between the two at normal pressures go with it or the Saturn or the .416 Rigby Imp. I'm not looking for the absolute most velocity or I'd do a .378 Imp like my .30-378 Imp. (at that point it would be just about as easy to go to a 408 Cheytac based case and be done since I order a new action anyway). I don't mind fire forming brass especially if the factory brass headspaces correctly without any modifications. I can fire form breaking in the barrel and a lot of times with fire forming rounds the accuracy is really good. It cost power, bullets, and primers but it's practice with the gun too so it doesn't really bother me. I can order a resizing reamer as well and build my own dies so that really isn't a issue for me either.

For you it just depends on how much work you want to do and if it's worth it over a standard case.

 

[Franklin]

Very well said Nathan. Alot of what LTLR posts about, is spot on and I respect his opinions, but they're just that. (his opinions) People just need to sift through all the info out there and decide for themselves what they want. By the way, looking at our # of posts, we're no where close to being keyboard commandos compared to some.

 

[durak]

Like the 375 Allen I guess. I don't know what Kirby uses for a shoulder angle or shoulder diameter. I talked to Dave Kiff at PTG and he recommended a 33-35*shoulder and a .562 shoulder diameter. So I'm going to go 35* and .562. He said the 33-35* shoulder angle has been proven to be more accurate when he tested them than the 40*. I'll do a .338 version later too as I have 2 Stiller actions coming.

I intend to try the CE copper bullets between 300 and 330gr and I have 260gr Accubonds I can try also. It depends on how much CE wants to do a custom order but I might have them make me brass bullets designed after the copper bullets. So high BC but lower weight and higher velocity.

Would you share your cartridge drawing with me?

 

[IdahoCTD]

I'm waiting for the 350gr SMK's to send a dummy cartridge to PTG. I also need to know how big to make the neck diameter from a loaded case. Once I get all that I will.

 

[durak]

Thanks - that would save me a lot of time.....what are you going to call it?

 

[IdahoCTD]

.375-.338 Lapua Imp. . I don't name stuff other then what it's designated. I could care less about a name as long as it shoots.

 

[durak]

.375-.338 Lapua Imp. . I don't name stuff other then what it's designated. I could care less about a name as long as it shoots.

Good call - that eliminated the confusion of what it actually is!

 

[LazzInc]

we have modified a new Lazzeroni model 2012 reciever to accept special bottom metal and a 3-round removable mag box, with an internal mag box length of just over 3.9" ,,, which is long enough to allow the ogive of the 375 dia, 350gr Sierra bullet to be seated far out against the barrel lands and still fit in the magazine box ,,,,,,

I should be shooting the new rifle in the raw very soon ,,,,,, I will post photos here when I do ,,,,,

new ballistics data to 1,000 yards for the new Lazzeroni 9.53 (.375) Saturn round here http://www.lazzeroni.com/ct_lacart.htm ,,,,,

 

[cowboywhorses]

Have you looked at the 338 Excaliber for a larger case.

 

[2g5mk]

I know this thread is a bit old. Durak, did you actually build your rifle. If so, do you mind sharing the results: Bullet choice, velocity, and accuracy?

I am considering a similar build. I was hoping to get at least 2800 fps out of a 350 SMK. I did not want to reinvent the wheel if someone else has already had some success.

Thanks in advance for any information.

JDM

 

[LazzInc]

Lazzeroni 9.53 (.375) Saturn ,,,,,,,

 

[2g5mk]

Thanks John. I am building a Saturn as we speak. Nice groups by the way. I am using a Stiller TAC 338 with a 29" barrel. Once I get it together we can compare notes.

 

[LazzInc]

reloader 22 might even achieve another 40fps or so at the same pressure, but the NP3 coating is really the secret sauce that allows the faster powders to be used, with better shot to shot consistency in both pressure and velocity ,,,,