7mm Rem. Mag vs 300 Win. Mag

[Greyfox]

Greyfox, I've been looking at the 6.5x284 and think that will be my next rifle build for deer and antelope! I really like everything I have read on the ballistics in addition to every thing you pointed out!!!

Capt Academy, Yes, the ballistics of the 6.5x284 driving a 140 VLD at 3000FPS are excellent, and while not in the "Suoer Cartridge" category, it is a true sleeper and will stand with the best. While I have always been cautious of the term "inherently accurate", this cartridge has changed my perspective. My buddies and I play around with our 6.5-284, 10 pound deer rifles, shooting PD's at 800+ yards and coyotes well past 1000. After five+ years, and a few dozen deer and antelope, most between 500 and 1000 yards, I am hooked, and my bigger magnums have been collecting dust.

 

[captacademy]

The 6.5x284 will be my next build. I too had also heard nothing but great things about that caliber, the only down fall ever mentioned was barrel life, some have said about 1500 rounds, but as a hunting rifle only, I'm not concerned with that!

Thanks for the info Greyfox!

 

[Clark]

I have both reamers 7mmRM and 300WM.
I have hunted with both.
I have (8) 7mmRM rifles and (3) 300WM rifles
I am currently building a 300WM for the 2015 hunt.

-----------------------------------------------------
7mmRM
I shot a mule buck and an antelope buck in 2014 with 7mmRM 26" barrel 140 gr Nos BT 70 gr 3.34" H4350 chrono 3400 fps.

Quickload thinks that is 74.88kpsi 3386 fps

Quicktarget thinks the bullet at 500 yards has dropped 47 inches, drifted 14.7" in a 10mph cross wind, slowed down to 2407 fps which is 1801 foot pounds
---------------------------------------------------------
300WM
If in the 300WM 26" barrel I put 150 gr Nos BT 69.8 gr H4895 3.34"
Quickload thinks I get 74.91 kpsi 3455 fps
Quicktarget thinks the bullet at 500 yards has dropped 47.2", drifted 16.2" in a 10mph cross wind,
Slowed down to 2361 fps which is 1856 foot pounds
-----------------------------------------------------

What does it all mean?
Rosencrantz and Guildenstern
Tweedle dum and tweedle dee
Six of one and half a dozen of the other

 

[Broz]

If we are talking long range here, and since this is LRH I will assume we are? Why would anyone load a 150 gr bullet in a 300 win? The answer, to make it perform like a 7mm REM. with a 150 gr bullet. Load them both for long range, 180 in the 7mm REM at 2850~2900 and 215 in the 300 win. 3000 to 3050. Now we have a true comparison and the 300 win. wins with little effort. That's why they call it the 300 "WIN". More velocity, more BC, less drift and less drop.

Jeff

 

[Clark]

Broz,
The best I can figure with your suggestion, less than 105% case fill of Hodgdon:
3025 fps 300WM 215 Berger hybrid 3.34" 72.4 gr H4350 is 84.97 kpsi
2875 fps 7mmRM 180 gr Berger hybrid 3.34" 67.3 gr H1000 is 56.80 kpsi

The problem I have with your idea is that 74kpsi is the limit for my belted magnums with temp stable powder.

 

[bigngreen]

That's the problem with computer based loading and shooting vs actually loading and fielding a rifle!

 

[Broz]

yes, as BnG says something wrong there. I have been loading in the same brass since the rifle was built with well over 10 firings on these cases. No hard bolt lift with H-1000 and 3035 fps across both my Oehler 35 and my Magnetospeed V2. Case still not 100% fill and shake. The velocities I posted were real world safe loads I have produced with both myself. Not just an idea I had or a dangerous load. Also there have been many others on here get 3K with 215's in a 300 win with H-1000 and a 26" barrel.


Jeff

 

[Broz]

I would imagine the program is not accounting for the shorter bearing surface of the 215 Hybrid. At least that could be some of it.

Jeff

 

[bigngreen]

Broz,
The best I can figure with your suggestion, less than 105% case fill of Hodgdon:
3025 fps 300WM 215 Berger hybrid 3.34" 72.4 gr H4350 is 84.97 kpsi
2875 fps 7mmRM 180 gr Berger hybrid 3.34" 67.3 gr H1000 is 56.80 kpsi

The problem I have with your idea is that 74kpsi is the limit for my belted magnums with temp stable powder.

Try a 3.7 COAL for the 300 Win, that's about where you'll run them.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

I have both reamers 7mmRM and 300WM.
I have hunted with both.
I have (8) 7mmRM rifles and (3) 300WM rifles
I am currently building a 300WM for the 2015 hunt.

-----------------------------------------------------
7mmRM
I shot a mule buck and an antelope buck in 2014 with 7mmRM 26" barrel 140 gr Nos BT 70 gr 3.34" H4350 chrono 3400 fps.

Quickload thinks that is 74.88kpsi 3386 fps

Quicktarget thinks the bullet at 500 yards has dropped 47 inches, drifted 14.7" in a 10mph cross wind, slowed down to 2407 fps which is 1801 foot pounds
---------------------------------------------------------
300WM
If in the 300WM 26" barrel I put 150 gr Nos BT 69.8 gr H4895 3.34"
Quickload thinks I get 74.91 kpsi 3455 fps
Quicktarget thinks the bullet at 500 yards has dropped 47.2", drifted 16.2" in a 10mph cross wind,
Slowed down to 2361 fps which is 1856 foot pounds
-----------------------------------------------------

What does it all mean?
Rosencrantz and Guildenstern
Tweedle dum and tweedle dee
Six of one and half a dozen of the other

At best this is a pot/ kettle black scenario. At worst you just ate a cow pie. I've never seen Broz touting an overload.

a 150 in a 30cal magnum is only good if your rifle is a problem rifle that only likes fly weight bullets, and it handicaps it to a mid range rifle. Any good barrel in a 300 mag and you start at 190 and go heavier. Same for the 7's... start at 150 and go up from there.

The 30's are going to beat the 7's by a decent amount. Whether you need the extra performance is largely dependent on what you are shooting. I'm a deer hunter so I'll use either caliber. The elk guys are going to want the extra momentum/energy the heavier bullets afford them.

 

[MudRunner2005]

I see we've come full-circle with this crap, because even though they're basically identical on paper, nobody ever wins with this arguement...

 

[FEENIX]

If we are talking long range here, and since this is LRH I will assume we are? Why would anyone load a 150 gr bullet in a 300 win? The answer, to make it perform like a 7mm REM. with a 150 gr bullet. Load them both for long range, 180 in the 7mm REM at 2850~2900 and 215 in the 300 win. 3000 to 3050. Now we have a true comparison and the 300 win. wins with little effort. That's why they call it the 300 "WIN". More velocity, more BC, less drift and less drop.

Jeff

Jeff,

You're going to give someone a heart attack. gun)

Ed

 

[Broz]

even though they're basically identical on paper...

Actually, No they are not, not at this time with the production bullets available today. The only way to make them the same would be to handicap the 30 caliber by feeding it light bullets. Who does this for long range? The guys that have a personal preference for the 7 Rem and want to tip the scales that way.

Kinda like this, My tricycle will out run your Ninja, it will really. That's right, but you have to tie one wheel behind your back.

Jeff

 

[FEENIX]

Actually, No they are not, not at this time with the production bullets available today. The only way to make them the same would be to handicap the 30 caliber by feeding it light bullets. Who does this for long range? The guys that have a personal preference for the 7 Rem and want to tip the scales that way.

Kinda like this, My tricycle will out run your Ninja, it will really. That's right, but you have to tie one wheel behind your back.

Jeff

LL!