1000+ yard deer hunting

[remingtonman_25_06]

425 yards and kentucky elevation and you think that somehow justifies how good the cartridge is?? Everyone on this forum knows better then that...

Plenty of us use or have used the 7 mag and dial up like everyone else, (not kentucky elevation.) Used with a rangefinder and all your other gadgets, it does great to A LOT farther then 425 yards...

The 3 longest kills I"ve seen with a 7 RM was 750 yards on a spike elk, 800 yards on a buck, and 900 yards on a cow elk. All 3 were 1 shot kills, the 750 yard spike was 140g XLC from a guy we hunt with at elk camp. The 800 yard buck was shot by me with the 162g amax. The 900 yard cow elk was shot by another member of our elk camp with a 168g VLD.

Based on what I've seen with the 7 mag, I really wouldn't hesitate to "wack" any buck at 1K.

I'm not saying its the cats *** for 1K, but it WILL do the job IF you do yours, nuff said.

 

[trebark]

Agreed....a 7RM pushing a 168VLD certainly has the velocity/momentum/power to cleanly kill deer at 1k.

425 yards and kentucky elevation and you think that somehow justifies how good the cartridge is?? Everyone on this forum knows better then that...

Plenty of us use or have used the 7 mag and dial up like everyone else, (not kentucky elevation.) Used with a rangefinder and all your other gadgets, it does great to A LOT farther then 425 yards...

The 3 longest kills I"ve seen with a 7 RM was 750 yards on a spike elk, 800 yards on a buck, and 900 yards on a cow elk. All 3 were 1 shot kills, the 750 yard spike was 140g XLC from a guy we hunt with at elk camp. The 800 yard buck was shot by me with the 162g amax. The 900 yard cow elk was shot by another member of our elk camp with a 168g VLD.

Based on what I've seen with the 7 mag, I really wouldn't hesitate to "wack" any buck at 1K.

I'm not saying its the cats *** for 1K, but it WILL do the job IF you do yours, nuff said.

 

[angus-5024]

I think I must side with MontanaRifleman on this one. Though a havent ever shot anything past 500 yards, just looking at the numbers I would think that there are BETTER CHOICES for 1k plus. not to say that 7RM is not a capabile long range cartrige, just that there are better choices out there. I think that the 7RM is one of the best cartriges ever designed and my next rifle is going to be one.
i have seen the "Best of the West" once or twice, and I didnt think too highly of it. not that the hunters were'nt making great shots, i just think that they try to make it look easier than it is. one video I saw on youtube showed a hunter taking a bull elk at beyond 900 yards with a 6.5-284. though some may argue, I know that that is an inappropriate cartrige selection. I also see guys that dont know dirt about ballistics making shots over 650 on their guides instruction, off a log with poor form. I too wonder how many 2,3,4 and 5 shot kills dont make it on air.
As far as kentucky eleavtion goes, It does work with practice. the shooter must know the limitations is all. I have taken a black bear at 400yards with a .340Wby useing holdover (simply because I couldnt afford a new scope), and have seen an old LE vetran shoot goat sillouettes out to 500 yards with a .375 HH in 15mph winds without dialing. not to say that it is anywhere near the best method for even mildly long shots, but it can get you to 500 yards with the right caliber.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

I guess I need to repeat myself again, and this will be for the last time. The title of this thread is "1000+ deer hunting" That was the OP's question (about a year ago). Notice the "plus" sign? The 7RM, with a good load on a good day in good conditions can deliver a bullet 1k down range with enough velocity to penetrate and expand and kill a deer But it is at the limit of it's performance at 1K, which is why I have said several times that it is a "marginal" cartridge for 1K killing. Is that clear as mud???

425 yards and kentucky elevation and you think that somehow justifies how good the cartridge is?? Everyone on this forum knows better then that...

Everyone on this forum??? I just mentioned the 425 yd shot to give you my experience with this cartridge at "LR", not to justify how good the cartridge is. The numbers will justify or not justify the cartridge. I have spent a lot of years hunting with the 7RM and reloading for it and researching a lot of data on it. That gives me a pretty "good feel" for its potential.

The bottom line though is this.... The ballistic calcs that we use to derive our drop charts and windage with also tell us how fast the bullet is going at "x" yds and how much energy and momentum it will have on impact. This is really ~ALL~ you need to make a good assessment of the cartridges ability to make a killing shot, provided the accuracy is there.

Plenty of us use or have used the 7 mag and dial up like everyone else, (not kentucky elevation.) Used with a rangefinder and all your other gadgets, it does great to A LOT farther then 425 yards...

Yeah.... how much further?

The 3 longest kills I"ve seen with a 7 RM was 750 yards on a spike elk, 800 yards on a buck, and 900 yards on a cow elk. All 3 were 1 shot kills, the 750 yard spike was 140g XLC from a guy we hunt with at elk camp. The 800 yard buck was shot by me with the 162g amax. The 900 yard cow elk was shot by another member of our elk camp with a 168g VLD.

Interesting.... I don't see any 1K kills on the list???

Based on what I've seen with the 7 mag, I really wouldn't hesitate to "wack" any buck at 1K.

So you see a 900 yd shot on a cow elk and figure its good to go on a deer at 1K? How about back to the original question... 1K plus....? So if you see a deer killed at 1K with a 7RM does it mean it's good to 1100 yds... and so on?

The fact is, that 900 yds is about the limit for good bullet expansion out of most hunting rifles with most loads under most conditions in the 7RM. Period.

I'm not saying its the cats *** for 1K, but it WILL do the job IF you do yours, nuff said.

It will do the job if all the variables are right, in most cases, it would be a very questionable shot.

Agreed....a 7RM pushing a 168VLD certainly has the velocity/momentum/power to cleanly kill deer at 1k.

That is a very open ended statement. How long is your barrel and what is your MV and what elevation are you shooting?

Let's take a look at some REAL numbers....

26" barrel, 168 VLD (BC .617) and lets use an MV of 3000 fps which would be about average for that bullet in that tube length. Remember, the Bergers are advertised to open @ 1800 fps...

1000' elevation
1000 yds, vel 1680
900 yds, vel 1791
800 yds, vel 1907

5000' elevation
1000 yds, vel 1811

9000' elevation
1000 yds, vel 1936

These numbers tell me that @ 900-1000 yds the 7RM is at the limits of its performance with this bullet and this load which would be about average.

To say.... "a 7RM pushing a 168VLD certainly has the velocity/momentum/power to cleanly kill deer at 1k".... is IMHO a bit of a stretch.

One more time.... If what you have is a 7RM and your data looks good, by all means take the 1K shot.

But would I recommend a 7rm to someone asking me what is a GOOD 1K PLUS? No. I would recommend a 7STW, 7 Dakota, 7 RUM or 300 RUM or equivalent.

-nuff said....

-MR

 

[car]

Hi all, new to this site. I have to say, what great reading. I'm going to enjoy this site. Oh and I own a 7RM also.

 

[remingtonman_25_06]

My bad, didn't even notice the "+" sign.

Your right, none of those were 1K kills or further, but a cow elk at 900 is close. A cow elk is roughly 2.5X the weight of a buck, so I would say yes again, I would not hesitate to wack any deer out to 1K. They dont weigh near as much, and they aren't near as hard to kill as elk. Granted it was a cow, not a huge 900 lb 6 point, so again there is a little difference there.

IMHO, the 7 RM will get you to 1K on deer if you and your rifle/load are up to it on that given day, given the conditions.

For 1K plus, there are certainly better calibers for that task at hand.

Clear as mud!!!

 

[liltank]

So does the 7STW and 7RUM hawking 180 grn bullets out to 1350+ yards count as a decent caliber? I read on this very site a guy shot a bull elk at 1350 yards using 162 A-max's. I believe it was an STW.

Tank

 

[MontanaRifleman]

A cow elk is roughly 2.5X the weight of a buck,

Yeah it is, (well actually a cow will go about 400-600 lbs and a good size mullie buck can go 300)... but what counts really is will the bullet have enough velocity to expand. It might loose that velocity somewhere between 900 and 1000 yds. Then you have a pencil hole in the animal. It'll probably die, but how far will it run and will you find it?

My general rule of thumb is if a 160 gr bullet or larger that has enough velocity (1800 fps) to expand then it has enough momentum to penetrate and kill an elk. But I would only take the best shot at that extreme. For deer a 110 gr bullet or larger @ 1800 fps or faster should do the trick.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

So does the 7STW and 7RUM hawking 180 grn bullets out to 1350+ yards count as a decent caliber? I read on this very site a guy shot a bull elk at 1350 yards using 162 A-max's. I believe it was an STW.

Tank

Yep, I remember that thread. Here it is...

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f17/1350yd-colorado-bull-elk-37290/

7STW
30" barrel
162 AMax, BC .622
MV 3320 (wayyy faster than a 7RM)
I'm guesssing somewhere in the 7000-9000' elevation range, so if we plug in 8000' we get impact vel of 1811 ( I beleive the AMax expands at less than 1600 fps) with a KE of 1188 and a momentum of 42 lb/ft

Three bullets, two exit holes, and one through both shoulders.

 

[Booney]

300 RUM 210gr Smk

 

[remingtonman_25_06]

So lemme give you scenario #2 for 7 RM.

What doesn't quite make sense to me is how the 7 stw and RUM push the same bullet 250-350fps faster, but yet it gives you 450 more yards of effective range?? Those numbers dont quite work out.

If were going with 1800fps for all bullets but the AMAX's, then the 162g amax from a 7 RM at 3100-3150fps w/26" barrels and Retumbo, (I've gotten 3100fps with 24") is no slouch compared to the STW and only gives up 150 yards of maximum range.

225fps gain in bullet speed dont make up for 450 yards in effective range.

You take the same 162g amax at 3100fps at 8000elevation it has 1800fps and 1150ft lbs at 1200 yards (7 MAG)

You take the same 162g amax at 3325 at 8000elevation it has 1821fps and roughly 1200ft lbs at 1350 yards (7 STW)

Plus if you go down to your now advertised of 1600fps for AMAX, then that just gives the 7 RM that much more range.

Really not trying to stir the pot anymore, but that really got me thinking.

 

[Topshot]

Hi. was wondering if you gave any thought on the .338 win mag as a 1000+ yd deer rifle. I am about to buy a second hand Ruger in that cal which has had only a few rounds down it since new. I am going to use it for Sambar deer and Northern Territory Cape Buffalo. all the material i have read on the pro's and cons between the .300 and .338 win mag the .338 comes up a better caliber to use. what is your or anyone else who may comment think about this.

Hi Bruce55, welcome to LRH.

Get the .338WM, no better walk about Sambar cartridge made. Forget the .300WM they are all bang and no bite.

Have a look in the Aussie/NZ section of LRH forum, there is a few posts there that deal with hunting Sambar.

 

[MontanaRifleman]

Yup, I mentioned the AMax earlier...it will extend your effective range.

With *most* bullets the 7 RM is a 900 yd cartridge at lower elevations. At higher elevations it is a 1K rifle, and with an AMax it's a 1k plus cartridge. But way out there at those lower velocities, a little bit of wind will blow it around.

So anyway if you do the math it all works out. I used 3000 fps for the 168 VLD, which is 320 fps slower than the 162 out of the STW with a 30" barrel... factor in the 8000' of elevation and it all comes out right.

If I ever did a 7 build, it would be an improved Dakota, probalby an improved 7-300 Dakota.

 

[bruce55]

Hi Bruce55, welcome to LRH.

Get the .338WM, no better walk about Sambar cartridge made. Forget the .300WM they are all bang and no bite.

Have a look in the Aussie/NZ section of LRH forum, there is a few posts there that deal with hunting Sambar.

Thanks for your reply mate. cant wait to get my hands on the .338 wm. It will
be interesting to see or should i say feel what the recoil is like. but hey i use
12 ga slugs in my coach gun at the range and when i go pig hunting. what loads do you like for different animals ? Bruce... Ps. where do i find the NZ/aussie LRH ?