Those particular bullets, from that box because I remember I only bought 1 box, are the only bullets I have ever had that failed. One exploded on a shoulder on a quartering to shot. They worked the second shot but it was evident when I skinned the deer that the first shot didn't work well.
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Best All Around Caliber for Whitetail and Mule Deer?
- Thread starter bearhtr2
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memtb
Well-Known Member
While we're discussing bullet failures…..I have 3 abysmal failures, followed by a phone call to the manufacturer. Of the several excuses given, none were the bullet nor the manufacturer…..38 years later, I never have nor will I purchase their bullets!
Stepping back in time, it was Fall of 1986, my first season as a Wyoming resident …..I was about to kill my first elk, a spike bull!
While the shot opportunity was not those that make the front cover of hunting magazines, it was my "only" shot in near dark conditions…..and I "knew beyond a shadow of a doubt", it was a very easy shot and I had the rifle and bullet to accomplish it!
I've never been more in all my years of hunting. Though, to confirm my total stupidity……I used that same bullet the following Spring on my first bear!
The shot: At last light, nearing the end of the season, a small group of elk filtered out of heavy brush/timber about 60 yards away, easing out onto an open grassy hillside to feed. I watched as cows and calves slowly walked past, a bit difficult to see clearly in the failing light and timber / brush behind them….once into the opening, very easy to see. Then came the lone bull, a spike, following the group. But, instead of entering the open hillside with the cows, he made a 90 degree turn to his left…..walking straight away, about to disappear into the timber.
I took the easy shot…..couldn't have been easier had he had a "bullseye" hanging on his tail.
At the shot, he humped-up a bit then ran, disappearing into the dark timber. I listened as he ran through the dry limbs and brush…..then silence.
I opened my fanny pack, retrieved my red marking tape…..tying it to the tree I was standing beside when I took the shot. Then headed to the area where the elk had stopped. I hadn't made 20 steps…..when I heard my elk crashing through the timber, going straight away from me.
My hunting buddy soon joined me after hearing my shot, we tried to find him until well into the night…..finding nothing.
I was back at first good light, found where he was standing at the shot…..a small "tuff" of rump hair on the ground, indicating that it was not a "raking hit"! Several hours later, only finding a few tracks in the hard, dry dirt and zero blood…….I gave up.
The following Spring, I shot my third animal with that rifle/bullet combination. Only then, did I finally determine that I had serious bullet issues.
The first time, a young buck Mule Deer, sprinting broadside left to right about 20 yards away the bullet hit behind the diaphragm…..no exit.
The following Spring, my bear. A 90 yard, standing broadside shot. The bullet entering behind the shoulder between ribs, the bear immediately went down, rolled onto his back and gave a "death moan"….. again no exit wound. I did find part of the jacket base….no sign of a core. The bullet apparently…..completely fragmented.
I can only conclude that with my elk, the bullet needing to penetrate a couple feet of wet, packed grass……wasn't up to the task.
The bullet: a .375 ca. Sierra 300 grain SBT only pushed at moderate velocities from a .375 H&H…..the cartridge it was designed for!
A call to Sierra brought me these startling revelations: Perhaps I was pushing it too fast… BS! Perhaps I was using the wrong powder, as this was from their own data, more BS! A finally, perhaps my rifling was too sharp, cutting through the jacket……more BS!
Thus my search for a better bullet and my first time to meet and visit with Bob Millek. Getting to briefly know Bob was then only good thing coming from my experiences with that bullet!
Sometime later, I got to visit with Craig Boddington…..he told me that Sierra had improved on the design of that bullet! IMO….Much too late on a bullet that someone may have tried using on "dangerous game"! memtb
Apologies for the book!
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jamie eaton
Well-Known Member
The way things are going on here right now I would say the 6mm in any cartridge . But that may may be over gunned 
. Sorry Im just being an 
. Sorry Im just being an I will make a prediction. With the high BC and Sectional density of the new Heavy 25-caliber bullets, I predict that all 25-calibers will have a resurgence, starting with the lowly 25 Creed and outdated 25/06. Cartridges like the 250 Savage, AI, Roberts and AI will get a new lease on life with little recoil and Impact velocity way above old timmey BC bullets that are in the 3's.
When you are shooting a bullet with BC in the .600 and above range, amazing things happen even at 300 yards.
When you are shooting a bullet with BC in the .600 and above range, amazing things happen even at 300 yards.
I'm working on 21 grain high BC .177 pellet for a moose//brown bear hunt next year. Should work on deer as well. The gun will be my trusty Crossman pellet rifle. I figure with 10 or maybe cheating a little with 11 pumps that rig ought to stack em up. Plus I don't have to worry about primer, powder, or brass
. Or a suppressor!
. Or a suppressor!That has always been my only hang up with 25 caliber. Lack of bullet choices that offered a good BC. You're probably dead on with your prediction.
Wilderness Blacktail
Well-Known Member
Yep, with Hornady makin 25Creed brass this year its off to the races for the whole caliber lineup now. We have loong sleek bullets needin a 8 twist or more and normal length sleeker than normal bullets that can run in the 10 twist.
Makes me happy.
Wilderness Blacktail
Well-Known Member
Whats ur twist??I'm working on 21 grain high BC .177 pellet for a moose//brown bear hunt next year. Should work on deer as well. The gun will be my trusty Crossman pellet rifle. I figure with 10 or maybe cheating a little with 11 pumps that rig ought to stack em up. Plus I don't have to worry about primer, powder, or brass
I was thinkin of going that route with my crosman pistol. Lol
I do honestly want to make a 25 cal pellet gun tho. For grouse!
A couple years ago I worked with a guy that had a pellet rifle in something around 25 or 30 caliber. My memory is awful. This gun was a state of the art precision pellet rifle. It had a special compressor used to fill the cylinder. Also had a rangefinder in the scope where you could press a button and it would move the crosshairs and adjust for elevation and windage on the fly. At 100 yards we were able to hit shotshell hulls easily. He actually had video from the scope of him killing deer with this thing with headshots. I'd hate to know how much $ he had in it.
memtb
Well-Known Member
Just a fraction of what some folks on this forum have invested in one rifle!
memtb
jamie eaton
Well-Known Member
I really want a .25 bad . My father will most likely be laid to rest with his prized Savage 99 250-3000 , but I can hope to fight it out with my brother . Might just have to settle on contacting Mr. Allen for one of his .25 laser beams !
. Might just have to settle on contacting Mr. Allen for one of his .25 laser beams !AussieWriter
Well-Known Member
Sounds like many are trying to out do the trendy fisherman who tries cstching 15lb fish on a 3lb line and making excuses when the line keeps breaking.
What goes around, keeps going around and our sport is not immune from trends.
Wasn't too long ago that hunters wanted to slam big game to the ground where bigger was always better.
Another popular trend was bigger bullets at moderate volocities. Didn't we love small to medium bore magnums untill we failed on the cup and core bullets not designed for them?
Now we are chopping barrels, adding a can, maybe a tripod or bipod and a spotting scope to carry around for that one surperb shot always another hill across the mountain range and just to show how we have progressed, we redesigned the cartridges so the reach 90%-95% of the velocities we always got from our existing magnums.
Seriously, There is nothing wrong with innovation but a chronograph and trigger time is a wonderful teacher and the best groomer that can help you prepare for that shot you were born for.
Oh, and can't wait to see what the next trend is going to be.
What goes around, keeps going around and our sport is not immune from trends.
Wasn't too long ago that hunters wanted to slam big game to the ground where bigger was always better.
Another popular trend was bigger bullets at moderate volocities. Didn't we love small to medium bore magnums untill we failed on the cup and core bullets not designed for them?
Now we are chopping barrels, adding a can, maybe a tripod or bipod and a spotting scope to carry around for that one surperb shot always another hill across the mountain range and just to show how we have progressed, we redesigned the cartridges so the reach 90%-95% of the velocities we always got from our existing magnums.
Seriously, There is nothing wrong with innovation but a chronograph and trigger time is a wonderful teacher and the best groomer that can help you prepare for that shot you were born for.
Oh, and can't wait to see what the next trend is going to be.
memtb
Well-Known Member
I believe that we're using the same "playbook" pretty often! And, I really have an undying love for medium bores pushed to higher velocities.
It seems that I'm trapped in a "time warp" and can't "choke down the "Koolaid" of today's "new" hunting philosophy! I'm old, and without reservation, relish the fact that I'm a dinosaur!
I've also "shockingly" discovered that a medium bore pushed to higher velocities will kill deer sized pretty well! memtb
AussieWriter
Well-Known Member
MemtbI believe that we're using the same "playbook" pretty often! And, I really have an undying love for medium bores pushed to higher velocities.
It seems that I'm trapped in a "time warp" and can't "choke down the "Koolaid" of today's "new" hunting philosophy! I'm old, and without reservation, relish the fact that I'm a dinosaur!
I am with you and was about to cut out of this website altogether when I saw your post.
I came here to help people with a few loads now and then, still like to contribute my 63year experience popping primers, but this shorter than short carbine barrel fad leaves me cold.
