Compact stove advice

cohunt said:

When does altitude/cold start affecting lighting and burn on these canisters ?

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About 15 degrees for isobutane.

The reason some of us mention altitude is because of the change of boiling point. The canister/stove doesn't have to work as hard at 18 f, at 10k vs if it was 18f at 2000 ft for instance.

cohunt said:

When does altitude/cold start affecting lighting and burn on these canisters ?

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It all comes down to boiling points. High altitude has basically no impact. You can push them a bit colder at high altitudes since liquids boil at a lower temperature the higher you get, but it's not a huge difference. You'll likely never notice. Temperature depends on the fuel mix. Most canisters are a mix of butane and propane. High n-butane blends will start to struggle in the mid-upper 30s and completely fail around freezing. Isobutane blends work well down to around 20 and completely fail around 10. Inverted canisters work well to about 0, maybe a bit colder. The propane will still vaporize and push liquid butane out to the stove. Pure propane will work even colder, but given the weight penalty of a propane canister I'd rather just carry a liquid fuel stove (and probably wouldn't be out in the first place).

If some of you are wondering about the limitations of these butane canisters in cold, here's a visual representation:



Not the most scientific but you get the idea.

Also if you're interested in some of the brands and how much fuel they have in them:

All good info, what liquid/gas stoves are the best ---- I have a coleman old school white gas stove (the kind you pump up , but the fuel is kept in the stove baee and i worry about fuel leakage if put in a pack) and it works well at normal temps but is heavy compared to the ultralight stoves--- I guess I've never realized that white gas stoves were better in the cold

I see msr has "dual fuel" stoves that can use iso/but or white gas/kerosene/unleaded fuel

I guess the real thing comes down to total packable weight, size, and how low of temps you expect to encounter--- also weather you are boiling water for freeze dried food or if you plan to cook any traditional food too---- and length of your trip and availability of water.

If you aren't packing all your water then your boil times per meal for freeze dried food would be increased due to having to purify your water--- In the areas i hunt, there is water available but often times its in a pond and would definitely need increased boil times--- you could use the water filter systems but I'm still not 100% trusting they get all micro nasties out and still boil/purify my water

I suppose on longer adventures, something like the biolite would eventually over come the weight penalty of having to carry a bunch of iso canisters since you just use sticks for fuel on the biolite stove and can easily increase cook times for traditional food with more sticks.

Sounds like you get about 18 liters boiled ( not purified/sterilized) per 8 oz canister -- and maybe 10 liters purified per canister

If you were boiling/purifying 1 gal per day for food/drinking ypu would get 2 to 2.5 days per 8 oz canister -- so if you had a 10 day hunt you would need 2.5 pounds of iso fuel plus the stove and pot so about 3.5 pounds for the combo-- where as the biolight stove and pot weigh about 3 pounds - you use sticks but also have the ability to charge your phone off the battery pack, I wonder how the biolight battery pack performs in cold weather ?

All good stuff to consider

I kind of have a "stove problem". I have about every model of MSR stove and most of the older Coleman stuff. The setup a carry in my pack is the Soto Windmaster paired with the Olicamp heat exchanger pot. The Soto Windmaster is a regulated stove so isn't impacted by the cold weather and the efficiency (speed) at which it boils water is shocking. The Pocket Rocket Deluxe is another solid option but needs to be the Deluxe to have the regulated burner. The Zetboil Stash would be a perfect setup if they had put a regulated burner….

skookum said:

I know he's not everyone's favorite guy but he does use a lot of gear and there is some merit in this video. I gave the MSR Pocket Rocket and the titanium cup a try this fall and my only complaint is they don't lock together like the Jet Boils and the MSR Reactor. Otherwise, it's a great lightweight set up; I'm always in wet or snowy environments so I always have at least 2 lighters on me so that's never been an issue.

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I have two jetboils and a Pocket Rocket Deluxe. The Pocket Rocket goes most of the time as it's much more compact. I just use the jetboils as loaners at this point. I have seen some places where Jetboil is somewhat "anti hunting" and I don't want to support that plus they are heavier and larger. I was going to buy a Reactor setup this summer for a Wind River trip but they were out of stock and then I saw this video. I was surprised at his results and decided to try that heat exchanger pot that won his tests. It's no joke, that thing on the Pocket Rocket is FAST! After that trip I no longer am looking for the Reactor setup. The Pocket Rocket Deluxe with that pot does everything I want. If it's just light day trips, etc. I have a titanium pot which barely holds the stove and a small cannister that gets the nod. I have the original MSR Titan kettle and a cheaper, slightly smaller chinesium titanium pot. I actually prefer the cheap one. If I am going to be using the stove for more than just me I usually pack both and use the Titan Kettle to cook on with the smaller pot what I eat out of. If it's more volume of water boiling, as in multiple days, then the new exchanger pot is worth the extra size/weight and replaces the Titan Kettle. My speculation is the larger diameter pot with exchanger captures more of the heat and thus the faster boil times. I still need to find a decent fry pan to actually cook on but for boiling water, etc. the other pots (titanium for occasional and exchanger for heavy use) work great.

Pocket Rocket original vs Deluxe w/ignitor and pressure balance valve. I haven't owned the original but the Deluxe works very well. The ignitor is super nice and convenient though I carry a lighter just in case. I like having that enough I would replace the ignitor if it ever goes out. No complaints on fuel regulation and it works as intended. The Deluxe is just a solid little stove.

Jetboil is convenient in that they lock together and you don't have to balance the pot on top. Other than that the pot/Pocket Rocket Deluxe combo is better in all other ways.

I also added the MSR metal lock on cannister stand and that helps immensely with the stability of the setup. It's worth the 1.2oz weight penalty. https://www.msrgear.com/stoves/stove-accessories/universal-canister-stand/05346.html

I have had the MSR Dragonfly liquid fuel stove that I sold years ago. That thing was LOUD, sounded like a jet taking off. I have since purchased the Primus Omnilite TI. If the conditions/fuel required something other than a cannister (low temps/air travel). I would use that but they are messy, harder/longer to start and get running, potentially more dangerous, heavier and generally just a pain to deal with. They will however work in much worse conditions and if things got crazy will burn most any liquid fuel.

I use Jetboil Flash and MSR XGK EX when temperature drops to freeze.

I have an MSR windburner and think they missed the boat by not having a built in ignighter, so much so that I've only used it twice and then got a Jetboil with the built in ingighter. I bought MSR's little ignighter thing and it was a waste of money and would not light the stove.

tops911 said:

I have an MSR windburner and think they missed the boat by not having a built in ignighter, so much so that I've only used it twice and then got a Jetboil with the built in ingighter. I bought MSR's little ignighter thing and it was a waste of money and would not light the stove.

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IMO if you're going into a situation where you're gonna need/ want a mini stove you're gonna need a lighter anyway.

Taylorbok said:

IMO if you're going into a situation where you're gonna need/ want a mini stove you're gonna need a lighter anyway.

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I think we all have lighters. We just don't like to dig for it to start dinner after a long day.

Taylorbok said:

IMO if you're going into a situation where you're gonna need/ want a mini stove you're gonna need a lighter anyway.

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Am I the only one who has a ferro rod and uses it to light my Coleman or Svea stove?

ObiJohn said:

Am I the only one who has a ferro rod and uses it to light my Coleman or Svea stove?

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It's a fine skill to have but it's just not efficient when it comes to conserving fuel unless you're extremely fast with it. Imo
Most of us just want to eat, and not mess with the camp stove for fun. Especially in the cold.

I was out last week, and temps dropped on me into the single digits and I left the stove on a rock next to my tent.

I was so hungry that morning after climbing in 12 miles. I had to skip eating and coffee and put the canister in my down jacket pocket to warm it up while I glasses that morning. Not a big deal, it was good to go well before I was done glassing but I was ****ed off the whole time for the tiny inconvenience.

ObiJohn said:

Am I the only one who has a ferro rod and uses it to light my Coleman or Svea stove?

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That would work also. I usually have a lighter handy in a pocket, my ferro rod is in my pack in a fire kit. (less handy)

tops911 said:

I have an MSR windburner and think they missed the boat by not having a built in ignighter, so much so that I've only used it twice and then got a Jetboil with the built in ingighter. I bought MSR's little ignighter thing and it was a waste of money and would not light the stove.

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I'd agree with that on the Windburner. The MSR ignitor built into my Pocketrocket Deluxe has been a rockstar. The two in my Jetboils, not so much. One went DOA in short order the other is 50% on a good day. I'd still carry a lighter no matter what.

Good looking dog in your avatar @tops911! That a Drahthaar? I am looking for one. Going to go away from the Braque Auvergne's I have had to something a little tougher and more capable with waterfowl. Any connections for a good one? I've seen where some of the breeders are pushing for a little less crackhead on fur and less apt to fight with other dogs which appeals to me.