10mm heavy bullet load data?

Alibiiv said:

I just purchased some 220gr hard-cast bullets from Rim Rock bullet company. Now that I have the bullets I cannot seem to find a load for a bullet heavier than 200gr for the 10mm.. I recently picked up a Hornady #10 reloading manual, the manual lists a maximum load of 7.3gr of Longshot for a 200gr bullet. I was told that Buffalo Bore uses "7.1gr" of Longshot in their 10mm ammunition. I guess I could do some pressure testing with different loads in .05gr increments, don't like doing that with a handgun, or any gun. With a rifle there are familiar signs when pressure is getting too high, with a handgun that is not such a luxury. I've checked some of the other forums, this situation does not seem to be unique to these bullets. What I did find was that for any accuracy out of the heavy bullets in a Glock the bullets have to be moving at least 950fps to stabilize. Any one have suggestions or resources for load data for the heavy, 220gr, hard-cast bullets?

Click to expand...

12-13 grains AA#9 with 220s at 1.260 OAL. Right at 1110-1120 fps. I think running them much faster causes feed and eject issues regardless of which barrel. I run BarSto or KKM barrel and still occasionally have those issues if I run them too hot. I find 1100 fps to be the sweet spot with that bullet weight. I use 220 MBW-GC bullets. I have them coated with Hi-Tek coating from the company feeding goes smoother also.

Alibiiv said:

I just purchased some 220gr hard-cast bullets from Rim Rock bullet company. Now that I have the bullets I cannot seem to find a load for a bullet heavier than 200gr for the 10mm.. I recently picked up a Hornady #10 reloading manual, the manual lists a maximum load of 7.3gr of Longshot for a 200gr bullet. I was told that Buffalo Bore uses "7.1gr" of Longshot in their 10mm ammunition. I guess I could do some pressure testing with different loads in .05gr increments, don't like doing that with a handgun, or any gun. With a rifle there are familiar signs when pressure is getting too high, with a handgun that is not such a luxury. I've checked some of the other forums, this situation does not seem to be unique to these bullets. What I did find was that for any accuracy out of the heavy bullets in a Glock the bullets have to be moving at least 950fps to stabilize. Any one have suggestions or resources for load data for the heavy, 220gr, hard-cast bullets?

Click to expand...

One of the reasons load data for 220 grain bullets in the 10 mm Semi auto are not common is the changes that have to be made to most pistols in order to function correctly.

The 180 and 200 grain bullets are the weights that most 10 mm auto's are designed for, plus they produce much more Muzzle energy and less recoil.

The muzzle energy for the 180 is 662 ft/lbs at max load. (1287 average max velocity)
The 200 grain bullets produce 610 ft/lbs at max load. (1172 avreage max velocity)
The 220 class bullets can only be pushed to 941 ft/sec without extensive modifications to the pistol and at these velocities only produce 433 ft/lbs of muzzle energy.

Maximum SAMMI pressure for the 10 mm is 37,500 Psi and the 950 ft/sec 220 grain load averages 36.000 Psi so you can't go much/any faster without pressures exceeding design.

For self defense, I would recommend jacketed bullets with a round nose or similar shaped hollow point for enhanced feeding. And past experience tells me that any cast bullets or gas check designs are not as dependable as jacketer designs.

The extra energy and dependability favors these Bullets in the 10 mm in my opinion.

For what its worth.

J E CUSTOM

J E Custom said:

One of the reasons load data for 220 grain bullets in the 10 mm Semi auto are not common is the changes that have to be made to most pistols in order to function correctly.

The 180 and 200 grain bullets are the weights that most 10 mm auto's are designed for, plus they produce much more Muzzle energy and less recoil.

The muzzle energy for the 180 is 662 ft/lbs at max load. (1287 average max velocity)
The 200 grain bullets produce 610 ft/lbs at max load. (1172 avreage max velocity)
The 220 class bullets can only be pushed to 941 ft/sec without extensive modifications to the pistol and at these velocities only produce 433 ft/lbs of muzzle energy.

Maximum SAMMI pressure for the 10 mm is 37,500 Psi and the 950 ft/sec 220 grain load averages 36.000 Psi so you can't go much/any faster without pressures exceeding design.

For self defense, I would recommend jacketed bullets with a round nose or similar shaped hollow point for enhanced feeding. And past experience tells me that any cast bullets or gas check designs are not as dependable as jacketer designs.

The extra energy and dependability favors these Bullets in the 10 mm in my opinion.

For what its worth.

J E CUSTOM

Click to expand...

This is the homework I came up with. For personal defense is use the lighter bullets offering more velocity and energy. For quadroped or woods defense I think the numbers here work more in your favor with the heavies. After numerous testing with 180/200/220s in ballistic gel, the 220s performed far better deeper in the Gel.

VLD Pilot said:

This is the homework I came up with. For personal defense is use the lighter bullets offering more velocity and energy. For quadroped or woods defense I think the numbers here work more in your favor with the heavies. After numerous testing with 180/200/220s in ballistic gel, the 220s performed far better deeper in the Gel.

Click to expand...

I agree with you with those kinds of velocities, But I can't find any loads that will produce those velocities that are within the SAMMI pressures. Curious what powder gives you that ?

I like the heavies in pistols and would use 220's for hunting hogs if I could safely push them that fast.

Just talking.

J E CUSTOM

J E Custom said:

I agree with you with those kinds of velocities, But I can't find any loads that will produce those velocities that are within the SAMMI pressures. Curious what powder gives you that ?

I like the heavies in pistols and would use 220's for hunting hogs if I could safely push them that fast.

Just talking.

J E CUSTOM

Click to expand...

Ya it's tough but I manage to do it at 1120 fps with safe pressures using the 220s. Going into and beyond 1150 fps causes issues with dependability in the pistol feeding and ejecting. I prefer the 200s ultimately for both and still offers plenty of penetration and power for bear country.

-10mmfirearms forums has data
-Glocks don't like 220's
'220s usually don't have better velocity or energy than the 200s so I stick with 200 class in my 10s
-I use no.9 and get just above 1300fps from my 5.25- 6" barrels and I'm not over book max charge-- i know I'm on the edge though

1157fps with 11.8gr of no.9 for 200gr is what accurate arms posts for a 5" bbl, but some barrels are faster than others - some have tighter chambers-- i run heavy recoil springs in my 10s which helps a bit too

Even though I think the 10 mm is the ultimate carry pistol, I now have a new hunting pistol that has all the power that I will ever need. The 460 S&W It will push a 300 grain out of a handgun at 2100
ft/sec and almost 3000 ft/lbs of energy. (Over 3 times the energy of the 10 mm, And more than double my 44 mag

J E CUSTOM

Iron Worker said:

I have a Glock MOD 40 What weight and where can I get the right spring ?

Click to expand...

Frog4aday said:

Hey Iron Worker, I'm not seeing recoil springs for the Glock 40 widely available, so not sure where to point you. But for the Glock 20 shooting heavy loads up to 200 grain bullet weight, I am using a 20lb recoil spring. If I was going to try 220 grain loads, I would probably look at getting a 22lb recoil spring.

Click to expand...

I too have the G40 MOS. I am using HSM Bear Load 200g at the moment without any issues. I also purchased Lonewolf's 6.6' barrel but I haven't shot it yet. I am told the G20 and G40 springs are the same (?). The spring is on my upgrade list too.

cohunt said:

-10mmfirearms forums has data
-Glocks don't like 220's
'220s usually don't have better velocity or energy than the 200s so I stick with 200 class in my 10s
-I use no.9 and get just above 1300fps from my 5.25- 6" barrels and I'm not over book max charge-- i know I'm on the edge though

1157fps with 11.8gr of no.9 for 200gr is what accurate arms posts for a 5" bbl, but some barrels are faster than others - some have tighter chambers-- i run heavy recoil springs in my 10s which helps a bit too

Click to expand...

Cool, thanks!

J E Custom said:

Even though I think the 10 mm is the ultimate carry pistol, I now have a new hunting pistol that has all the power that I will ever need. The 460 S&W It will push a 300 grain out of a handgun at 2100
ft/sec and almost 3000 ft/lbs of energy. (Over 3 times the energy of the 10 mm, And more than double my 44 mag

J E CUSTOM

Click to expand...

Jerry,

Looking forward to a video of you doing rapid-fire with that beast.

FEENIX said:

Jerry,

Looking forward to a video of you doing rapid-fire with that beast.

Click to expand...

Believe it or not, it is very manageable. The big X Frame handles better than My 44 mag and 454 casull. The 9 mm is what I did the CHL qualifying with But after shooting the 460 I would use it if the instructor would allow it but the fellow shooters would probably object,

I have done some rapid fire to get use to 5 in a row and it points well and is not bad like some other pistols I have shot. 5 Shots don't mean anything if you can't get them on target quickly and accurately. Once you get over the mental worries, the big pistol is a lot of fun.

The worst has been a TC Contender in 444 marlin. using a 265 grain bullet @ almost 2400 ft/sec, recoil was 60.4 ft/lbs. The big X Frame 460 doesn't quite reach 30 ft/lbs (Half the recoil of the 444 contender. I am not recoil sensitive (Maybe brain dead) but I do have my limits, and the 444 contender is it for a pistol.

J E CUSTOM

J E Custom said:

Believe it or not, it is very manageable. The big X Frame handles better than My 44 mag and 454 casull. The 9 mm is what I did the CHL qualifying with But after shooting the 460 I would use it if the instructor would allow it but the fellow shooters would probably object,

I have done some rapid fire to get use to 5 in a row and it points well and is not bad like some other pistols I have shot. 5 Shots don't mean anything if you can't get them on target quickly and accurately. Once you get over the mental worries, the big pistol is a lot of fun.

The worst has been a TC Contender in 444 marlin. using a 265 grain bullet @ almost 2400 ft/sec, recoil was 60.4 ft/lbs. The big X Frame 460 doesn't quite reach 30 ft/lbs (Half the recoil of the 444 contender. I am not recoil sensitive (Maybe brain dead) but I do have my limits, and the 444 contender is it for a pistol.

J E CUSTOM

Click to expand...

I've actually shot a friend's 460 XVR (?) IIRC. Did well when I take my time for accuracy. While I managed close to rapid-fire, however, my accuracy was terrible at 15 yards. My G40 MOS shooting 3 15-rounder series at a pie plate target at the same distance was awesome. I got it primarily as a bear defense to replace my .44 Mag. I too am not recoil-sensitive but the muzzle rise on the 460 is hard to manage.

FEENIX said:

I've actually shot a friend's 460 XVR (?) IIRC. Did well when I take my time for accuracy. While I managed close to rapid-fire, however, my accuracy was terrible at 15 yards. My G40 MOS shooting 3 15-rounder series at a pie plate target at the same distance was awesome. I got it primarily as a bear defense to replace my .44 Mag. I too am not recoil-sensitive but the muzzle rise on the 460 is hard to manage.

Click to expand...

No comparison in accuracy and shots on target for timed shooting. Did some testing with a couple of my big bore wheel guns and a buddies 454 Casull. All ported and fairly manageable but not nearly as much so as any of my 10mm's. Putting 19 rounds per mag on a paper plate at 20 yards in under 19 seconds was doable but putting 6 big bore rounds on that same plate in 5 seconds was not all that easy. Throw in the "**** your pants factor" during a bear charge and you'll not get any on that plate.

Frog4aday said:

Hey Alibiiv,
I've been searching for you and can't find any 220 grain cast load data for the 10mm either. But I did come across this tidbit of wisdom from the guy that produces the 220 grain Buffalo Bore ammo. He refers to needing a stiffer recoil spring than 'stock' in the Glock 20. Here is the partial quote:
Owner of Buffalo Bore Tim Sundles on Heavy 10mm Ammunition:
Full power 10mm ammo has always generated enough recoil and pressure to require a pretty stiff recoil spring in your handgun - this of course depends on several variables such as your slide weight, etc. When the cartridge fires, it generates enough pressure/recoil to prematurely open your breech face in some guns. When this happens, the opening breech face has an effect on the burn rate of the powder. This can result in some fairly high extreme spreads in velocity. If you are experiencing extreme velocity spreads of more than 50 fps, simply install a stiffer recoil spring. For example, I have an original Colt Delta Elite. This gun with the factory spring runs extreme spreads of about 35fps with both of these 10mm loads. I am happy with 35 fps, so I leave the Delta Elite as is. I also have a custom built Para Ordinance with a Nowlin barrel. It runs extreme spreads of about 70 fps with its original recoil spring. When I install a spring that is 4 lbs stiffer, the extreme spread drops to about 35 fps. The new Glock model 20 comes with a recoil spring that allows the breech face to open too soon and my new Glock model 20 will get extreme spreads of about 100fps with the factory spring installed. When I go to a stiffer recoil spring, the extreme spreads drop to about 50 fps in my new Glock model 20."

Full write up can be found here: https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1001484052
(scroll down to wear it shows PRODUCT OVERVIEW)

Click to expand...

J E Custom said:

Even though I think the 10 mm is the ultimate carry pistol, I now have a new hunting pistol that has all the power that I will ever need. The 460 S&W It will push a 300 grain out of a handgun at 2100
ft/sec and almost 3000 ft/lbs of energy. (Over 3 times the energy of the 10 mm, And more than double my 44 mag

J E CUSTOM

Click to expand...

JE, I agree with most of what you print and your thoughts on firearms. I believe that you have extensive knowledge about firearms, and totally respect the knowledge that you impart, however I cannot agree with the 460 S&W unless you know something that I am not aware of. The sole use for my Glock 20 is that of a back-up gun for black bear hunting and nothing more other than some occasional plinking. I do have a custom Ruger Blackhawk in 44 magnum that occasional will come out of the safe just to play with, and....that is it. The G20 suits all of my needs for a back-up gun, it is not too heavy to carry and it is not so big that it takes two hands to shoot, and I can hit what I am aiming at very proficiently; shot and carried one for 20+ years, and.....my life did depend on it. I was carrying a Glock 40 as a hunting back up gun, however found it too long to clear out of the Bianci holster due to its length and my four rotator-cuff surgeries. Another plus is while hunting there are 31 rounds of handgun ammunition on my at all times; 16 in the gun and one extra on my belt. Hunters tend to "think" in terms of firepower/knockdown power, sometimes the extra rounds (rifle/pistol) come in very useful if one is lost or injured, or....is looking for someone who is lost by providing a signal. After some extensive research I settled on a Kramer cross-draw holster, I'm waiting for delivery so cannot comment on that holster. I don't hunt from a tree stand as most do, I hunt from a ground blind, thus the cross-draw holster. I looked at the S&W 629PD, found it to be too big and bulky for me, and although there are a number of configurations of the Alaskan style rigs I don't find those holsters conducive to my requirements and style of hunting. If I were in grizzly country, I "might" consider one of the larger cartridges, however I am not hunting grizzly and have confidence in the Glock 20. Also.....one last thing is that I have 500, hard cast, 220 grain bullets from RimRock that I have to get rid of. Also have quite a few boxes of Lehigh 200gr and Buffalo Bore 220 gr bullets sitting on the shelve. And....thank you for all of the input you give to this forum.