Who's planning on using a suppressor in WYO?

[blksno]

Sounds expensive. In NZ most suppressors are $500-600 and most shops have 7 day turn around. and the good ones are down under 500grams(17 ounces) some are down to 390grams(13ounces). Maybe one day the USA will catch up to New Zealand haha.
Do you guys shorten your barrels so overall length is much the same?? I have two rifles shortend and have found them great to use in bush and much better balanced for off hand shots.

I would love to see statistics between the best of the best here (length, weight, db reduction, poi shift, overall accuracy), and those made over seas.
IMO, db reduction is so close across the board here, that the other factors are much more important. You can't hear the difference between 2-3 db unless you've got the chance to hear them side by side or a sound meter.

Some guys shorten the barrel, some don't. It's just personal preference that depends on what you plan to do with the rifle.
LongRifles Inc built us a suppressed 22-250 with an 18" pipe for one specific purpose; shooting coyotes inside 400 yds. It works perfect for its application.
I kept my 7mm Rem Mag at 25" because it'll rarely be shot off hand, it's a dedicated LR prone rifle to the length is of no concern...but would not be opposed to running a .260 or .308 at 18-20"

 

[JP100]

I would love to see statistics between the best of the best here (length, weight, db reduction, poi shift, overall accuracy), and those made over seas.
IMO, db reduction is so close across the board here, that the other factors are much more important. You can't hear the difference between 2-3 db unless you've got the chance to hear them side by side or a sound meter.

So would I. Ive found that accuracy doesnt really change much for lighter calibers(.223,.22-250,.243) but can be a big improvement on bigger calibers(7rem mag,300mags ect) because there is less recoil and you can shoot them easier.(I dont like recoil much)
The supressors rated with more sound reduction are heavier and bulkier and as you said you dont notice a few decibels diference.
The big focus here has been on weight and they use duralumin for most the light weight supressors here. the good ones as I said are down to 300-400grams(10 to 14 ounces).
Are there many that light in the USA?
The ones here are rated to 5000rounds plus for the light weights or 20 000 rounds for the heavier models. so you arnt really going to wear them out.
Some here sit 3inches forward of the muzzel and 4.5inches back @ 290grams(10ounces). So are pretty compact.

 

[blksno]

The ones here are rated to 5000rounds plus for the light weights or 20 000 rounds for the heavier models. so you arnt really going to wear them out.
Some here sit 3inches forward of the muzzel and 4.5inches back @ 290grams(10ounces). So are pretty compact.

Most of our top name suppressors actually improve accuracy, even on the samller calibers...not because of recoil reduction, but because of the physics of the suppressor design.

Weight and length don't really have much play in the suppressor game as far as improving dB reduction. An 8" can that is 25oz isn't necessarily quieter than a 6" can that weighs 14 oz.
Its much more about an efficient design, than it is about volume. There is a point of diminished return, where adding baffles and inches to the suppressor can actually makes them function worse.

And if only 5000 rounds is the failure point...yikes, I'd be ****ed if my suppressor only lasted 5k rounds. I'll be ****ed if some of mine don't last 50,000 rounds.
I don't know that I've ever seen one actually destroyed and some of the torture tests have been pretty intense.

...duralumin.

Isn't that just a fancy aluminum alloy? I'm not sharp on my unique metals.
If so, I understand why your cans are only $500

 

[JP100]

Most of our top name suppressors actually improve accuracy, even on the samller calibers...not because of recoil reduction, but because of the physics of the suppressor design.

Weight and length don't really have much play in the suppressor game as far as improving dB reduction. An 8" can that is 25oz isn't necessarily quieter than a 6" can that weighs 14 oz.
Its much more about an efficient design, than it is about volume. There is a point of diminished return, where adding baffles and inches to the suppressor can actually makes them function worse.

And if only 5000 rounds is the failure point...yikes, I'd be ****ed if my suppressor only lasted 5k rounds. I'll be ****ed if some of mine don't last 50,000 rounds.
I don't know that I've ever seen one actually destroyed and some of the torture tests have been pretty intense.


Isn't that just a fancy aluminum alloy? I'm not sharp on my unique metals.
If so, I understand why your cans are only $500

Most the guys here say that they improve accuracy in the same way but I personally have not noticed it except in bigger guns(all my guns shot under 0.5MOA before suppresors so its hard to improve on that with a factory gun)
The 5000 rounds is for the very light weight models and they will replace them if you wear them out I understand.
not many barrels will last 50,000 rounds so why would a suppresor need to last that many?????
Do you think youd fire 50K from one barrel in a hunting rifle?

Not many hunters ever shoot that many rounds. I know proffesional shooters who have had light weight suppressors for 6-7years and they are fine. These guys shoot a couple hundred rounds every week(this isnt target shooting this shooting goats and long strings of 10+ shots are common)

As I understand Duralium is yes a aluminum alloy. hence they are cheap and light. Whats wrong with using that?(Im no expert on metals either)

 

[Outlaw6.0]

JP,

I think you missed the point of suppressor life. I fully agree with C_bass that a suppressor should last MANY barrels worth of shooting a precision rifle. We can't just run down to the hardware store & get another one, we have a 6+ month wait before we get ours. That's usually why guys opt for the Titanium suppressors that usually run in the $1200-$1500 range, we need the extra life.


TBAC's rebuttal to suppressor life: "If used within the intended use of the device, it will last virtually indefinitely. There are no "wear" parts in our suppressors. On a precision rifle, you will wear out many barrels before the suppressor shows signs of wear."


t

 

[blksno]

Exactly as Outlaw pointed out.

My barrels might only last between 1500-5000, maybe 10-15,000 for some of the slower, less damaging calibers...but a guy might have one suppressor mounted to 5 guns different guns for 50+ years. Or a match shooter, or competitive shooter might burn up 10,000 rounds each season.

The manufacturer doesn't know how a suppressor will be used, but they understand how much of a hassle goes into buying one. No one wants to replace parts or rebuild a suppressor that wears out prematurely when a simple change in materials can make it last longer than the life of the shooter.
I'm more than willing to spend 2x the money if the suppressor will last 5x as long.

I hope my suppressors are still going strong, long after I've passed them down to my children.

There's nothing wrong with using an aluminum alloy for a more mild caliber. We use them for rimfire and even some pistol suppressors, but you'd be hard pressed to find a center fire can that doesn't have a blast baffle made from inconel and at the very least, stainless steel baffles.

There is a reason that combat suppressors that can handle full auto, are still relatively heavy and made from inconel and stainless steel, rather than Titanium.
The Ti doesn't react well to being overheated and it won't take long for them to fail.
I've seen SS cans fired red hot again and again and again and they just keep on tickin.
But Ti works excellent on precision suppressors that don't see high strings of fire.
The ThunderBeast cans are a prime example. They have a design that puts their suppression right at the top with all the rest, but a design that lends them a reputation for being an accurate suppressor. That, paried with being light weight Ti, means they're a great choice for hunters and match shooters.
Ti and Inconel will likely last longer than the shooter that bought it.

 

[JP100]

JP,

I think you missed the point of suppressor life. I fully agree with C_bass that a suppressor should last MANY barrels worth of shooting a precision rifle. We can't just run down to the hardware store & get another one, we have a 6+ month wait before we get ours. That's usually why guys opt for the Titanium suppressors that usually run in the $1200-$1500 range, we need the extra life.


TBAC's rebuttal to suppressor life: "If used within the intended use of the device, it will last virtually indefinitely. There are no "wear" parts in our suppressors. On a precision rifle, you will wear out many barrels before the suppressor shows signs of wear."


t

well here it takes 7 days to get a suppressor and they are cheaper than new barrels. so you can just go to the store and get a new one(in NZ).
Why is there a 6+month wait???
these suppressors are designed for the average NZ hunter who in his life time would maybe fire 2-3000 rounds. And I would imagine the average US hunter would be much the same.
From what Ive seen all other rifle parts/accessories/ammunition are WAY cheaper in the US than here. Just found it interesting no one is making cheaper suppresors for the "budget" hunter. Not everyone can afford $1200+ for a suppressor.

 

[JP100]

My barrels might only last between 1500-5000, maybe 10-15,000 for some of the slower, less damaging calibers...but a guy might have one suppressor mounted to 5 guns different guns for 50+ years. Or a match shooter, or competitive shooter might burn up 10,000 rounds each season.

Do you have to get the suppressor modified for differnt barrel profiles ect..??

 

[Outlaw6.0]

well here it takes 7 days to get a suppressor and they are cheaper than new barrels. so you can just go to the store and get a new one(in NZ).
Why is there a 6+month wait???
these suppressors are designed for the average NZ hunter who in his life time would maybe fire 2-3000 rounds. And I would imagine the average US hunter would be much the same.
From what Ive seen all other rifle parts/accessories/ammunition are WAY cheaper in the US than here. Just found it interesting no one is making cheaper suppresors for the "budget" hunter. Not everyone can afford $1200+ for a suppressor.

Supprressors are an NFA item in the USA, just like SBR's & Full autos. Back ground check with a elbow length rubber glove, $200 tax stamp etc.

Suppressors are FAR from normal here, the average hunter mostly believes they are evil & have no place in the game fields (at least here in Wyo). They are usually used by the Tactical & target shooters who shoot a couple thousand rounds a year.

You're right, not everyone can afford a quality suppressor, they make cheaper ones too & for bubba the whitetail hunter who doesn't shoot as much as others, they work just fine.


t

 

[JP100]

Supprressors are an NFA item in the USA, just like SBR's & Full autos. Back ground check with a elbow length rubber glove, $200 tax stamp etc.

Suppressors are FAR from normal here, the average hunter mostly believes they are evil & have no place in the game fields (at least here in Wyo). They are usually used by the Tactical & target shooters who shoot a couple thousand rounds a year.

You're right, not everyone can afford a quality suppressor, they make cheaper ones too & for bubba the whitetail hunter who doesn't shoot as much as others, they work just fine.


t

I hope they become more common place. the benifits are soo great for all types of shooting. Interesting that you cant EVER get a full auto here(thank god) but anyone can buy a suppressor off the shelf.
Interesting as well that target shooters use them.
Here most target shooting clubs/disiplines do not allow suppresors/muzzel brakes as they give an unfair advantage over shooters with out them.
Good to hear of what it is like over in the US.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

I hope they become more common place. the benifits are soo great for all types of shooting. Interesting that you cant EVER get a full auto here(thank god) but anyone can buy a suppressor off the shelf.
Interesting as well that target shooters use them.
Here most target shooting clubs/disiplines do not allow suppresors/muzzel brakes as they give an unfair advantage over shooters with out them.
Good to hear of what it is like over in the US.

I lobbied heavily for a state bill allowing the use of suppressors while hunting here in Wyo (it was illegal prior). After several failed attempts, we succeeded & the bill went into effect July 1st. They are increasing in popularity, slowly; with any luck (& an act of god) they will become easier to procure sometime in the future. Full auto's are still fully legal (in most states) as long as it's registered etc. Fun times


t

 

[JP100]

I lobbied heavily for a state bill allowing the use of suppressors while hunting here in Wyo (it was illegal prior). After several failed attempts, we succeeded & the bill went into effect July 1st. They are increasing in popularity, slowly; with any luck (& an act of god) they will become easier to procure sometime in the future. Full auto's are still fully legal (in most states) as long as it's registered etc. Fun times
t

I wish you guys luck with getting more support. No one here really opposed suppressors at all(that I know).
Why did people oppose them??
To me it seems a bit weird that full autos are legal and suppresors anrt(in some states I understand). In my view full autos have no place on the civilian market they arnt needed for hunting and just cause alot of problems with anti gun groups whan a nut job gets ahold of one.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

I wish you guys luck with getting more support. No one here really opposed suppressors at all(that I know).
Why did people oppose them??
To me it seems a bit weird that full autos are legal and suppresors anrt(in some states I understand). In my view full autos have no place on the civilian market they arnt needed for hunting and just cause alot of problems with anti gun groups whan a nut job gets ahold of one.

Suppressors aren't allowed in all states either. I recall a local rep actually calling me a nut job for advocating the use of a suppressor in the game fields (still have the email)..... Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level & beat you with experience...


On the subject of full autos. Our Constitution guarantees the right of the people to keep & bare arms first & foremost as a viable opposition & defense agains tyranny of government. Lets face it, scopes & suppressors aren't needed for hunting either.


t

 

[blksno]

I wish you guys luck with getting more support. No one here really opposed suppressors at all(that I know).
Why did people oppose them??
To me it seems a bit weird that full autos are legal and suppresors anrt(in some states I understand). In my view full autos have no place on the civilian market they arnt needed for hunting and just cause alot of problems with anti gun groups whan a nut job gets ahold of one.

Technically speaking, that's not 100% correct.

Both are legal and have always been legal. A more correct description is that they are regulated differently.
The FEDERAL government added full autos to a ban list, but still maintains that legally registered items that were MADE BEFORE the ban went into place, are still legal to own, with the proper paperwork, which is why they bring such a premium on the open market. Quite simply, they aren't being made for the civilian market anymore, so their value has skyrocketed.
It's still the same NFA paperwork that it takes to buy a suppressor or SBS/SBR.

The NFA (National Firearms Act) is a list of items that are Federally regulated by a $200 tax, and each state maintains the right to limit their use; either by completely prohibiting them, making them 100% legal for legal use...or something in between.

Part of the reason ours cost more, is because of the harder, more durable materials used (which wears out tooling faster than a material like Aluminum) and the years of R & D that goes into development in a very fierce market. All-be-it a small market...it's still fiercely competitive...even though they all support the over all goal of getting suppressors off the NFA list.
Any jack wagon can make a suppressor in their garage for a few hours of time, and a couple bucks worth of materials...they aren't that hard, and some can be pretty effective (but you still have to register and pay your tax for what is called "A Form 1") but you'd be hard pressed to make anything home made that is on the same level as a more precision designed can.
The technology that goes into the design makes them more expensive.