Which short action magnum?

[Calvin45]

I had a custom Borden done in 300 WSM. My first powder I tried with Norma brass, as my other commercial 300 WSM rifles love that brass. I found such extreme pressure with even the lowest powder charges that it literally locked the bolt shut. I could not open it at all. Frustrated, I packed up my junk and went home. I called Mr. Borden to discuss. He asked, "what brass are you using?" When I told him, Norma, he started laughing. He went on to inform me of the different ductility properties of market brass & that Norma was the softest of all. He asked if I got the bolt open yet & told me to get a hammer handle or a substantial piece of wood and literally beat the bolt open. He said he'd done it many times. He suggested I try a different brass mf'r & start with the highest charge & that the first two shots would tell me everything I would need to know. So, I loaded 5 R-P brass with 64gr VV 550, 155 Scenar's & fired the first two rounds of five. All of them printed 1/2 moa @ 3285 fps & ZERO pressure signs. Bolt lift was normal. That is my hunting load for that rifle now. And this all started with my first load development work with a brand new gun. It went from unusable to dialed in after 12 rounds fired.

That's surprising. I did know Norma was pretty soft but it's also what weatherby has used for decades to outrun pretty much everyone else

 

[nralifer]

I had a custom Borden done in 300 WSM. My first powder I tried with Norma brass, as my other commercial 300 WSM rifles love that brass. I found such extreme pressure with even the lowest powder charges that it literally locked the bolt shut. I could not open it at all. Frustrated, I packed up my junk and went home. I called Mr. Borden to discuss. He asked, "what brass are you using?" When I told him, Norma, he started laughing. He went on to inform me of the different ductility properties of market brass & that Norma was the softest of all. He asked if I got the bolt open yet & told me to get a hammer handle or a substantial piece of wood and literally beat the bolt open. He said he'd done it many times. He suggested I try a different brass mf'r & start with the highest charge & that the first two shots would tell me everything I would need to know. So, I loaded 5 R-P brass with 64gr VV 550, 155 Scenar's & fired the first two rounds of five. All of them printed 1/2 moa @ 3285 fps & ZERO pressure signs. Bolt lift was normal. That is my hunting load for that rifle now. And this all started with my first load development work with a brand new gun. It went from unusable to dialed in after 12 rounds fired.

Your story is interesting to hear. I have, and continue to use Norma brass in my 2 WSM rifles with no issues so far. Both have custom barrels I'll keep an eye for trouble.

 

[Rick Richard]

Your story is interesting to hear. I have, and continue to use Norma brass in my 2 WSM rifles with no issues so far. Both have custom barrels I'll keep an eye for trouble.

Me too. NEVER had any issues other than I can't find any.

 

[Shortmagman]

You need to check the capacity of Norma brass. I have found that Norma WSM brass has less capacity than other WSM brass.
I usually start 2-3 grains less when I am loading my WSM'S using Norma brass. This is true for only WSM brass in my experience. My Norma 270 Win brass has more capacity than RP or WW brass. I have gotten myself in some difficulty using different brass with the same load. My Starline 6.5 Creedmoor brass has less capacity than the Hornady brass I started out using.

 

[Outlaw6.0]

I've been using Norma 270WSM brass in my 6.5WSM since it was built. I've never had any trouble with it. Perhaps someone got a bad lot?



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[Calvin45]

You need to check the capacity of Norma brass. I have found that Norma WSM brass has less capacity than other WSM brass.
I usually start 2-3 grains less when I am loading my WSM'S using Norma brass. This is true for only WSM brass in my experience. My Norma 270 Win brass has more capacity than RP or WW brass. I have gotten myself in some difficulty using different brass with the same load. My Starline 6.5 Creedmoor brass has less capacity than the Hornady brass I started out using.

That makes a heck of a lot more sense than Norma brass somehow being too soft. Peterson brass is tougher than anything (or at least nothing is tougher than it) but they'll straight tell you it's less roomy and you'll pressure up faster.

Additionally, there was a lot of buzz a decade or so ago surrounding Richard Franklin's .300 varminter, which is just a .300 wsm with a real slow twist long barrel on a nesika or something like that action driving varmint bullets stupid fast…people (rightly IMO). Called him out on being overpressure. He certainly was but that doesn't mean he didn't get the speeds he claimed, the chrono don't lie…

He claimed part of the "secret formula" was Norma brass….

 

[Rick Richard]

If anyone has that less than desired Norma 300 WSM brass, please let me know and I will be happy to take it off your hands.

 

[nralifer]

It sounds to me like an overpressure situation that happened for reasons that are not apparent. I can easily shoot our 150 gr BD bullet from a either of my WSMs at 3400+ fps with that brass and our 175 gr BD2 bullet at just over 3200 fps from the 1:9 26.5" Benchmark barreled WSM with no bolt lift problems.

 

[Just a hunter]

I didn't say I didn't get good speed out of it, I said I got pressure at lower velocity than I was getting with N560. That was just my experience.

 

[Mike D Texas]

What powder do you shoot out of that 300 saum imp mike? Also what barrel length? I have h4350, 5lbs of rl16, but also wonder about vhit 555 with that 185 juggernaut. thanks

I haven't actually built the rifle yet. And that's a 6.5 SAUM Improved case necked up to .308. The neck on an actual fire formed 300SAUM case will be slightly longer.

I have run some hypotheticals in QL but I don't have them handy at the moment.

 

[MallardAddict]

Whatever you do, please take some time to complain to Lapua, Peterson, Alpha and ADG about the lack of available WSM brass right now. I've been on a 2yr hold basically due to lack of quality brass.

ADG 300 wsm brass was available a few months ago as I got 300 pcs. They are also slated to make more 02/23

 

[nralifer]

ADG 300 wsm brass was available a few months ago as I got 300 pcs. They are also slated to make more 02/23

How many do they make at one time?

 

[Goldengun]

Ballistics don't lie. Do a 270 WSM and don't look back. Since you already have a 300WSM, going fast twist and heavy isn't necessary. Your 300 will always do more, if you need it. The beauty of the 270 is what it will do with the 130's - 150's. Sometimes less is more. If you want to do a fast twist for the options, I'd consider the C.O.A.L. of the 6.8 Western(longer than the 270WSM) when chambering barrel and handloading, if appropriate. I admittingly don't know if that's functional with your rifle or any other one for that matter. But the longer COAL will give you a little "more" for handloading, and still fit in a short action, I think??( The 6.8Western does, right?). I could definitely be seriously wrong. I'm sure someone on here knows. I have a 300wsm as well and have been wanting to do this with a 270wsm, if doable?? Totally hoping I'm GUESSING right!! My plan was to just rechamber a 6.8Western, which already has the fast twist, depending on what my gunsmith tells/teaches me. Food for thought.

 

[nralifer]

Ballistics don't lie. Do a 270 WSM and don't look back. Since you already have a 300WSM, going fast twist and heavy isn't necessary. Your 300 will always do more, if you need it. The beauty of the 270 is what it will do with the 130's - 150's. Sometimes less is more. If you want to do a fast twist for the options, I'd consider the C.O.A.L. of the 6.8 Western(longer than the 270WSM) when chambering barrel and handloading, if appropriate. I admittingly don't know if that's functional with your rifle or any other one for that matter. But the longer COAL will give you a little "more" for handloading, and still fit in a short action, I think??( The 6.8Western does, right?). I could definitely be seriously wrong. I'm sure someone on here knows. I have a 300wsm as well and have been wanting to do this with a 270wsm, if doable?? Totally hoping I'm GUESSING right!! My plan was to just rechamber a 6.8Western, which already has the fast twist, depending on what my gunsmith tells/teaches me. Food for thought.

Not clear to me what you are getting at, but if you like WSM cases 300 or 270, both will benefit from a 3.2-3.3" action to use the highest BC bullets and feed from the magazine. I find feeding is actually easier. McGowan makes 1:8 and a 1:7 .277 caliber barrels that are of very high quality and are made in reasonable periods of time. The twists are tight enough to stabilize the highest BC 277 cal bullets available. If you choose to chamber one of these in a WSM then the clearance between the leade and the bullet diameters should be about 0.0008" total. Leade length should be 0.150" long or so to give you enough room for adjusting bullet jump. The longer action will allow you to use long ogived bullets necessary to achieve the high BC without having to worry about magazine feeding.