When do you stop chasing accuracy?

[xsn10s]

This is out of my 308 Win PSS that's I've had since 1991. I think I have close to 10k rounds through it, but I didn't document them so I could be wrong. Most of those rounds were shot the first 8 years I had it. The 3 shot group is recent, prone off Harris bipod no rear bag. My bag completely gave out that day. The Tide jug is at 1100 yards prone off bipod with a towel rolled up for a rear rest. Two in the center and the top left were the #3, #4, and #5 of five shots. The lower right was one from another five shots of a different load and bullet. Both pictures are with me rushing because I have very little free time these days. Neither loads have any load workup or time spent seeking best seating depth. I just have a good idea what this rifle will do since I've had it for thirty years.

 

[Jon Bischof]

Xsn10s, you have my permission to no longer worry about what that rifle will do!

 

[orkan]

I don't think that set up is comparable to the OP's T3X shooting ELD-X bullets.....

Oh I see. Maybe a carbon fiber barrel, titanium action, and carbon fiber stock? Would that be acceptable you you? … because I could show similar groups with 2 rifles like that at the moment.

My demands don't change just because the rifle changes.

 

[xsn10s]

Xsn10s, you have my permission to no longer worry about what that rifle will do!

I never worry about what this rifle will do. More of what I can with this rifle lol. I'd like to have more trigger time with my rifles and handgun. I could stand to lose about 60 lbs too lol.

 

[Jon Bischof]

I never worry about what this rifle will do. More of what I can with this rifle lol.

Yup, there's a lot to be said about shooting the same rifle for 30 years.

 

[2buffalo]

Oh I see. Maybe a carbon fiber barrel, titanium action, and carbon fiber stock? Would that be acceptable you you? … because I could show similar groups with 2 rifles like that at the moment.

My demands don't change just because the rifle changes.

Still not apples to apples.

 

[orkan]

Still not apples to apples.

Well I don't shoot factory rifles because they don't shoot well enough.

 

[xsn10s]

My PSS when we were both younger.

 

[2buffalo]

Well I don't shoot factory rifles because they don't shoot well enough.

Understood but the man's question was is .5 good with his factory rifle.

 

[xsn10s]

I have a Tikka T3X Veil in 6.5 PRC, I am loading 143 ELD-X not because I particularly care for them but that's what shoots so far. I am using RL26, Nosler blem brass and Fed 210M primers. If I have not had much coffee, it shoots .5 to .6 at 100. My intent is to use it for whitetail to 800 yards. My longest shot so far is 519 yards with a 257 weatherby. Is there any point looking for another 1/4" of accuracy since I will be shooting off a bipod in field conditions?

I haven't loaded for the PRC but I wonder if a magnum primer might help? I agree with maybe try a Berger like b6graham mentioned. Nosler listed Norma MRP as their most accurate load for 140 class bullets. Could try that.

 

[bigngreen]

First pic is 5 first rounds out of a 300 Win and 215 Berger.
Second pic is a 3 gr pressure ladder from a wildcat magnum 7mm with 195 Berger, 6.8 lb gun, it grouped in the in the 3 inch range at 1000.

 

[Jon Bischof]

Understood but the man's question was is .5 good with his factory rifle.

No, the OP's question was about his 0.6 MOA rifle.

 

[Professor Doolittle]

If you're interested some statistical validation for when to quit chasing precision, Brian Litz offers a chapter on it in his book Accuracy and Precision For Long Range Shooting. My take away is that precision matters for long range but chasing more than about 0.5 MOA might not be a good return on effort for most people given all the other variable that come into play.

As an example, here is some data from one of his figures for effect on accuracy at different distances considering +/- 1 mph wind,+/- 1 yd range and 10 fps SD. The numbers are hit percentage on a 10 inch target

Range 0.5 MOA 1.0 MOA
500 100% 99%
600 99% 93%
700 92% 83%
800 78% 67%
900 56% 49%
1000 40% 35%

I didn't go back and dig through the chapters for more info but I think for the example above, working on bringing down the fps SD would prove beneficial because you'll notice at 900+ yds the benefit of improved precision has diminished from intermediate ranges.

If you're interested in being able to quantify the variables in long range shooting, the Litz books are pretty interesting.

Yes, but I queston how many shooters appreciate that the tiny errors are all adding up to a total worst case error. If he is .5MOA but also .5 off in accuracy, then the total possible error is now 8 inches at 800 yards. And that's only two types of error, without getting into muzzle velocity standard deviation, bullet temperature, the list goes on and on, not to mention target panic and other mental factors. On top of that is confusion around not understanding that errors are bipolar and can add up to your advantage sometimes and be very misleading. My feeling is always reduce the errors you can reduce to hedge against the errors you can't reduce.

 

[Jon Bischof]

Long range hunters who say MOA is good enough for 800 yard kills are not much different from short range hunters who say pie plate at 25 is good enough for kills as far as they can see a deer over 100 yards. Same "iffiness" involved.