What’s the BEST down right there (DRT) loaded ammunition/bullet for whitetail/pronghorn in 6.5 Creedmoor?

[Kentuckywindage]

I'll quote my original post, since reading is hard for you. Call me and I can sound it out with you if need be.

"The one you're most accurate with. The best DRT bullet is the one you put in the heart. Bullet construction won't make up for not hitting vitals."

I did, later make an apology that an FMJ (even M80 ball) in the heart will kill just as effectively as a ELDX...care to dispute that?

Then, you started making up your own definitions for things...you are entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts or definitions.

Mr. I will tell you this. You don't tell me or anyone else on here what they are entitled to.
You commented to me about full metal jackets being great killers. I simply said my friend hunts with Hybrids and from kills and his pictures they are excellent for that job. Now you can twist this here because of other comments but the fact is there is a hole in the end of said bullet. Call it what you want but the tip expands and breaks up after entry into game. You said it was a full metal jacket. I have never seen a full metal jacket do what that bullet does. Regardless of target or hunting. Again my argument was the Berger Hybrid in 300 mag is excellent as used by my friend. No mention of ballistic tip at all until recent post. A Berger Hybrid has a hole in its tip with a cavity.

 

[Deleted member 107666]

Mr. I will tell you this. You don't tell me or anyone else on here what they are entitled to.
You commented to me about full metal jackets being great killers. I simply said my friend hunts with Hybrids and from kills and his pictures they are excellent for that job. Now you can twist this here because of other comments but the fact is there is a hole in the end of said bullet. Call it what you want but the tip expands and breaks up after entry into game. You said it was a full metal jacket. I have never seen a full metal jacket do what that bullet does. Regardless of target or hunting. Again my argument was the Berger Hybrid in 300 mag is excellent as used by my friend. No mention of ballistic tip at all until recent post. A Berger Hybrid has a hole in its tip with a cavity.

You're right, you can totally make up your own definitions for things...not sure that will lend to your credibility though. But not to worry, I was never interested in your opinion either way...you replied to my post lile you had some point to make...turns out, you didn't, nor did you have any experience witb the actual bullet you were touting.

Make it stop...hitting the block button so I don't have to read your nonsense any longer

 

[lancetkenyon]

Superformance poppped primers when I was testing in a semi. I'd go with any of the hornady white box, that will be pretty close to what I reload.

I had major pressure with these in a bolt action too. Flat primers, ejector marks, stiff bolt lift.

 

[Kentuckywindage]

You're right, you can totally make up your own definitions for things...not sure that will lend to your credibility though. But not to worry, I was never interested in your opinion either way...you replied to my post lile you had some point to make...turns out, you didn't, nor did you have any experience witb the actual bullet you were touting.

Make it stop...hitting the block button so I don't have to read your nonsense any longer

Actually I did load the 168gr. Hybrid. I have used it as I mentioned in my posts. It just wasn't all that great in my rifle. Turns out, you are exactly what most folks are not, on this site.
A nice, helpful guy. The thread was about loaded ammo and bullets. Not really an argumentative on full metal jackets or whether Berger Hybrids alone are or are not. As my attempts to deter this run away diarrhea of the mouth argument rolled along. See I apologize a long way back but you in your better than thou attitude couldn't stop there. You had to use belittling and such. I've never had a cross word with no one on this site.......but you. Even at this point when others commented you twist things to make yours a white knight statement. When in reality the comments speak for themselves. Anyone can go back and read. Not that anyone cares, because most don't see you as you see yourself white knight and all your belittling. I may not be the smartest but I'm definitely glad I'm not an arrogant pompous person either.
Merry Christmas to All!

 

[orkan]

I've had lots of folks say those work excellent on game. What weight are you using if you don't mind?

110gr 6mm.


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[Kentuckywindage]

Th

110gr 6mm.


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Thanks, my Tikka 243, if memory serves is 1/10 twist. Which I'm pretty sure wouldn't stabilize the 110

 

[orkan]

For the record, berger hybrids are in fact considered to be a hollow point boat tail bullet.

The fact that it is pointed, doesn't make it not a hollow point anymore. This isn't open for debate. Also, the pointing done on some hybrids is super light, to the point of not being visible.

Here's a 7mm 180 hybrid.

As opposed to obviously pointed projectiles such as the 190gr Hybrid

The 180's have a prominent opening, while the 190's are significantly smaller.

It should also be known, that the 7mm 180gr hybrid is the most unbelievably effective DRT bullet I've ever used in anything in my career.

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[Deleted member 107666]

For the record, berger hybrids are in fact considered to be a hollow point boat tail bullet.

The fact that it is pointed, doesn't make it not a hollow point anymore. This isn't open for debate.


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According to the techs at berger, a "hollow point" is designed to facilitate expansion...their pointed tips HPBT are NOT designed to facilitate expansion. They will tell you, their naming convention is simply to imply the bullet is pointed, not that it is designed as a true hollow-point, which are designed to expand.

Those bullets are pointed for aerodynamic purposes, simply having a pointed nose does not = a hollowpoint, it may look similar, but design/function is not the same. Uniformity of BC. They don't sell bullet pointers as a means to make "expanding" rounds from target bullets, they are designed to uniform BC.

Not a hollow point according to the intended definition. also not a hollow point IAW the Geneva Convention.

Do they work, absolutely. But it's the thickness/design of the jacket that allows for expansion, not the pointed meplat

 

[orkan]

According to the techs at berger, a "hollow point" is designed to facilitate expansion...their pointed tips HPBT are NOT designed to facilitate expansion. They will tell you, their naming convention is simply to imply the bullet is pointed, not that it is designed as a true hollow-point, which are designed to expand.

Not a hollow point according to the intended definition. also not a hollow point IAW the Geneva Convention.

You really want to play "the techs at berger said" with me? Tell me the name of the person you spoke to... I'll call him right now and we'll see. Better yet, I'll call his boss or his boss's boss. I'll go right up the chain with phone numbers at capstone if you want to keep this pedantic behavior going.

Berger doesn't get to define what "hollow point" means. Look at the pictures I posted. Describe that portion in front of the lead core, but behind the tip of the bullet in rational terms. Then I want you to understand that the function something is designed to perform can be, and often is, separate from its defining features.

Meanwhile, if they can avoid the "definition" of hollow point to ease import/export restrictions around the world... of COURSE they are going to say "no dude, our hollow point is not a hollow point... I swear that's not what it does."

ALSO for the record, Full metal jacket bullet, is technically a misnomer, because actual full metal jackets would completely encompass the core. However, the majority of full metal jacket bullets, by description... are formed in reverse compared to a HP bullet. The FMJ is open at the rear in many instances.

However, if you two would like to keep this pointless slapfest going... by all means, proceed. I'm calling Kyle and getting his itinerary ready for his next video as we speak.


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[lancetkenyon]

I am just going to say this. If it applies to someones comments, so be it. If it doesn't, so be it.

A "Full metal jacket" bullet, oftentimes, is not actually a "Full" metal jacket around a lead core. The base is oftentimes exposed lead. A "Total metal jacket" TMJ is actually a "FULLY" encased bullet. And what most people consider a FMJ, they are referring to a closed tip with no means of expansion like an open tip, lead tip, hollow point, etc.

Berger "Hybrids" are not "pointed". They are an open tip match bullet. The meplat is open to the lead core below. Not a FMJ
The ones I use have been devestating on game.

Berger "LR Hybrids" use the "MRT-Meplat Reduction Technology" (pointing). They are built as an Open Tip Match (open meplat down to the lead core), then are "pointed in a separate procedure to close up the meplat more (but not completely) for increased BC and consistency of BC. Not a FMJ. The ones I use have been devastating on game.

"FMJ designed for military use" are illegal to use on game in AZ. But, since Sierra makes a Game King in FMJ, they are not all "designed for military use".

Here is the rule as it reads in the regs. The rule says any wildlife does not specify big or small game.

A. In addition to the prohibitions prescribed under A.R.S. §§
17-301 and 17-309, the following devices, methods, and
ammunition are unlawful for taking any wildlife in this
state:
1. An individual shall not use any of the following to
take wildlife:
a. Fully automatic firearms, including firearms
capable of selective automatic fire; or
b. Tracer, armor-piercing, or full-jacketed ammunition
designed for military use.

 

[Darryle]

Wow, 2 threads in one? I entered LRH and woke up at 24hr

 

[Deleted member 107666]

You really want to play "the techs at berger said" with me? Tell me the name of the person you spoke to... I'll call him right now and we'll see. Better yet, I'll call his boss or his boss's boss. I'll go right up the chain with phone numbers at capstone if you want to keep this pedantic behavior going.

Berger doesn't get to define what "hollow point" means. Look at the pictures I posted. Describe that portion in front of the lead core, but behind the tip of the bullet in rational terms. Then I want you to understand that the function something is designed to perform can be, and often is, separate from its defining features.

Meanwhile, if they can avoid the "definition" of hollow point to ease import/export restrictions around the world... of COURSE they are going to say "no dude, our hollow point is not a hollow point... I swear that's not what it does."

ALSO for the record, Full metal jacket bullets, is technically a misnomer, because actual full metal jackets would completely encompass the core. However, the majority of full metal jacket bullets, by description... are formed in reverse compared to a HP bullet. The FMJ is open at the rear in many instances.

However, if you two would like to keep this pointless slapfest going... by all means, proceed. I'm calling Kyle and getting his itinerary ready for his next video as we speak.


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Pm me a cell, I'll happily jump on a call with you and him. A pointed meplat does not facilitate expansion. If it did, the bergers with crushed meplats would not expand. Bullet construction determines expansive properties.

Also , attached is an actual berger hybrid, looks like it's fully jacketed to me...

 

[orkan]

Berger "Hybrids" are not "pointed".

Berger "LR Hybrids" use the "MRT-Meplat Reduction Technology" (pointing).

You certain on this? I know most LR hybrids are pointed (maybe all, I haven't used them all yet) ... but I could have swore I saw some regular hybrids that were pointed floating around at one point.

I know you don't go around talking out the side of your face, but I'm just wondering how certain you are about this. I've never actually thought about it, so I've never bothered to ask.

Pm me a cell, I'll happily jump on a call with you and him. A pointed meplat does not fscil irate expansion. If it did, the bergers with crushed meplats would not expand. Bullet construction determines expansive properties.

Also , attached is an actual berger hybrid, looks like it's fully jacketed to me...

Who are YOU that I should put you on with MY contacts?!?! Especially over something as pedantic as this?!?!?!?
... and I can see hollow point openings in YOUR OWN PICTURE! lol How does it look "fully jacketed" to you, when there is obviously a hole in the top? What you suppose is under that hole? A hollow area, perhaps?

You literally just contradicted your earlier posts. You're right, the pointed meplat does not facilitate expansion. The HOLLOW POINT UNDER THEM does though.

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[Deleted member 107666]

Who are YOU that I should put you on with MY contacts?!?! Especially over something as pedantic as this?!?!?!?
... and I can see hollow point openings in YOUR OWN PICTURE! lol How does it look "fully jacketed" to you, when there is obviously a hole in the top?

You literally just contradicted your earlier posts. You're right, the pointed meplat does not facilitate expansion. The HOLLOW POINT UNDER THEM does though.


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I couldnt care less about "your contacts", but pretty sure you wanted to name drop and feel special, so figured we'd all jump in on that phonecall. I'll get it in writing from them the design intent behind their pointed tips...Berger stated that they designed their hunting bullets with a thinner jacket to facilitate expansion. Hmm, but you say it's the points? So why wouldn't they say the target bullet is a hunting bullet? After all, it's a hollowpoint, so you say?

Man, you sound so much more official though when you type in bold, nice touch. Do more of that.