Un expected results.
- Thread starter Rosebud
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I believe this as well!
FrogFire7
Well-Known Member
My suspicion is that since it was a high hit and caught back top of lungs that's why it went so far without much blood. I would guess a lower third chest cavity hit would have produced a lot more blood on the ground.
I load the 6.5, 85 grain hammers for my brothers creedmoor, at 3,300 fps. If he is 3" high at 100 he can hold middle of body to 300 yards which is farther than we can typically shoot here, so effectively making it a point and shoot gun for him.
He's killed at least a couple deer with this combo with good results.
I load the 6.5, 85 grain hammers for my brothers creedmoor, at 3,300 fps. If he is 3" high at 100 he can hold middle of body to 300 yards which is farther than we can typically shoot here, so effectively making it a point and shoot gun for him.
He's killed at least a couple deer with this combo with good results.
High Hits in the chest area are always problematic for a trailing job. Unfortunately I have had more than I care to admit. I have had and seen lots of them as most people, even when range finders are used tend to hit high for some reason, at least the ones I hunt with. I shot a cow elk with a 300 RUM, 200 grain accubond, out of a herd of roughly 50 in about 12" of snow. I had a solid rest off of a tree at just over 100 yards and I felt the shot was good. Of course the herd blew out of there leaving tracks in all directions. When I got to the spot where I felt she was standing when I shot there was no blood. There were so many tracks in the snow I did not know which ones to follow. My thinking process was that it had to be one of the tracks heading downhill, since I knew I had hit her, so that where I started. Nothing, went back to the impact site and started following every trail and followed them for at least 100 yards to try and find some blood. I finally found her about 120 yards from the impact site, high lung shot and not a speck of blood in the snow anywhere except where she fell down. The relief was incredible but I would have never believed it if I had not seen it with my own eyes. When I gutted her the lungs had a huge hole in them but both the entrance hole and the exit hole were both high in the rib cage. The cavity was full of blood but it had not made it high enough for any of it to spill out. Sometimes **** just happens. Congrats on the deer and keep on slinging lead!
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
I don't know if a bigger gun will help, but that's just me
Shot placement is number one.
It would be great if you were able to include some photos, @Rosebud
Sometimes a picture is worth 1000 words!
I hunt some property lines that I need to respect. Even though I prefer shooting ribs, if I'm close to a boundary, I'll move the shot forward still holding midway up the chest. This often results in Dropped Right There condition.
When an animal goes down at the shot, I try to get on them as quickly as possible. Sometimes the shock will knock them down even if it's not a lethal hit.
More often I shoot ribs, and with Hammers, I'm accustomed to deer typically walking 100ft and falling over dead IF they are unaware of my presence.
I have noticed over the years that when deer are aware of me, they react differently to the shot than when they are not.
I have shot a number of deer with Hammers now, and the typical result is
-Deer unaware
-Poke ribs
-Deer walks 100ft and falls down dead
Last year I had to shoot a buck that was coming to chase me off. Probably an exaggeration, but it felt like a 'him or me' moment. Quartering toward me, I put a 140gr Absolute Hammer through the near side shoulder at less than 50yd - the bullet was still traveling well over 3000fps at impact.
He was fired up and ran well over 100yd!
I think 'time' plays a part as well. Even if you cut the aorta, it takes about 8sec for blood pressure to drop to zero.
How far can a deer go in 8sec?
...depends how fast it's moving!
Even though that 140gr AH was traveling over 3000fps at impact, that buck put as much distance between us as it could before BP dropped to zero.
That's with lungs completely destroyed, as evidenced by what I poured out of the chest cavity;
A high lung shot, especially farther back bleeds slower. Slower blood loss means the animal has more time to travel before blood pressure reaches zero. I learned my lesson tracking an elk for well over a mile, hit high and back with one of the early monometal bullets that doesn't fragment.
(Imagine your deer was 3-4x bigger, and your bullet didn't fragment @Rosebud - not something I will forget!)
Anyway, that's my story. I know we are all human, and perfect placement doesn't happen all the time. I like Hammers because they seem to be the most forgiving when it comes to different target resistances, different velocities and less than perfect shot placement.
Still not a magic bullet though! Will to live is amazing sometimes!
Shot placement is number one.
It would be great if you were able to include some photos, @Rosebud
Sometimes a picture is worth 1000 words!
I hunt some property lines that I need to respect. Even though I prefer shooting ribs, if I'm close to a boundary, I'll move the shot forward still holding midway up the chest. This often results in Dropped Right There condition.
When an animal goes down at the shot, I try to get on them as quickly as possible. Sometimes the shock will knock them down even if it's not a lethal hit.
More often I shoot ribs, and with Hammers, I'm accustomed to deer typically walking 100ft and falling over dead IF they are unaware of my presence.
I have noticed over the years that when deer are aware of me, they react differently to the shot than when they are not.
I have shot a number of deer with Hammers now, and the typical result is
-Deer unaware
-Poke ribs
-Deer walks 100ft and falls down dead
Last year I had to shoot a buck that was coming to chase me off. Probably an exaggeration, but it felt like a 'him or me' moment. Quartering toward me, I put a 140gr Absolute Hammer through the near side shoulder at less than 50yd - the bullet was still traveling well over 3000fps at impact.
He was fired up and ran well over 100yd!
I think 'time' plays a part as well. Even if you cut the aorta, it takes about 8sec for blood pressure to drop to zero.
How far can a deer go in 8sec?
...depends how fast it's moving!
Even though that 140gr AH was traveling over 3000fps at impact, that buck put as much distance between us as it could before BP dropped to zero.
That's with lungs completely destroyed, as evidenced by what I poured out of the chest cavity;
A high lung shot, especially farther back bleeds slower. Slower blood loss means the animal has more time to travel before blood pressure reaches zero. I learned my lesson tracking an elk for well over a mile, hit high and back with one of the early monometal bullets that doesn't fragment.
(Imagine your deer was 3-4x bigger, and your bullet didn't fragment @Rosebud - not something I will forget!)
Anyway, that's my story. I know we are all human, and perfect placement doesn't happen all the time. I like Hammers because they seem to be the most forgiving when it comes to different target resistances, different velocities and less than perfect shot placement.
Still not a magic bullet though! Will to live is amazing sometimes!
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This is absolutely correct, Thank you Bob
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
I think you are over generalizing @cajun
I put an accubond through a deer's neck one time
It broke the spine, but didn't kill the deer.
Paralyzed, but no blood.
May have died due to starvation if I hadn't come along and poke the carotid.
Poke small holes in lungs too if target resistance does not match bullet requirement.
Wish I had more pictures to show....
I put an accubond through a deer's neck one time
It broke the spine, but didn't kill the deer.
Paralyzed, but no blood.
May have died due to starvation if I hadn't come along and poke the carotid.
Poke small holes in lungs too if target resistance does not match bullet requirement.
Wish I had more pictures to show....
19elkhunter51
Well-Known Member
Agree with others and truly believe that some animals have a more intense desire to live than other animals. My brother shot a decent sized mule deer buck at about 110 yards with 180 grain SGK out of a 30-06. The buck was side hilling with about six inches of snow on the ground. The area that was on the off side of the shot looked like a scene from a bad horror movie. Two to three feet of blood spray and the deer looked to be DRT. My brother marked the deer and then went to help my father clean his deer. When all three of us went back to my brothers deer, he was gone. The blood trail away from the shot was very heavy and clear. We trailed that deer for almost 200 yards. When we cleaned him, we literally poured the heart and lungs out of the body cavity. The lungs were a thin mush and the heart was in multiple parts. To this day we don't know how that deer moved that far in that condition.
We're two 72 year old broken down men. We kill quite a few deer during Alabama's long deer season for ourselves and others. We rarely take photos of them unless its a big one our a kids deer. My friend is scheduled to have the nerves in his lower back burned by some procedure next week. The last one helped him for over six months. So, he's hurting big time, I could send my last MRI report where I had marked to severe stenosis in most of my lower spine. We've joked that you could combine both of us and not make a healthy person! So its basically gut it get in the Kubota. Take a pain pill. Here is a picture from a year ago though.
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Thanks for the response from everyone, I was doubting my little CZ Grendel a little. My friend had seen it in action with123 SSTs. He's not a fan of mono metal bullets. And pain is a motivator to help with his beliefs. We hate trailing deer into thickets, as I'm sure you do also. Just a bit off the mark with my bullet placement. Thanks again.
One year when my 300 Win Mag was unavailable, I shot a nice 4 point whitetail with another rifle that was handy. I was surprised it ran 80 yards, as I was used to them just collapsing or taking a step or two. Oh, and the rifle was a .375 H&H with Nosler Partitions; double lung and exit hole was huge. I didn't actually check for a blood trail as I could see where it fell. Sometimes they just run.
Thanks Yoda!
