Traditional Shooters

[zupatun]

I was reading a book by Maj. John Plaster (US Army Ret?), "Sharpshooters of the Civil War" I believe was the title.

I've fallin in like with the idea of percussion cap Gibbs or Whitworth in .451 long projectiles for LR hunting during muzzleloader season here in Virginia.

Anyone gone this route lately? Can I get a percussion cap something fairly inexpensive and have it re-barreled in 45 cal instead of popping for a new pedersoli reproduction or the like?

 

[azsugarbear]

When it comes to muzzleloading, I guess I am probably as traditional as it gets. I have been making and shooting muzzleloaders for quite some time now. Although I have made a couple of percussion rifles, I must confess that I have fallen in love with the geometry and romance of the old flintlock rifles and smoothbores. Not even a long range shot at a gong at 1000 yds will ever be quite as satisfying as hitting your mark with a rifle based on a 250 year old design that you have loaded, primed and fired yourself.

My favorite load is 70 gr. of Swiss powder (cleanest buring IMO) with a 230 gr., 54 cal. roundball cradled in a 12/1000" pillowticking spit patch.

Rifle is a custom build: Lock is a Siler Delux. Stock is piece of crotch walnut shaped after the style of the classic rifle builder Andrew Verner from Bucks Co.. PA. The barrel is a swamped 44" by Getz in .54 cal with a 1-in-70 slow twist with a coned muzzle. That about covers it: Lock, Stock & Barrel.

 

[bassin93]

about the closest I can come is my c-sharps 45-90 and my winchester 85 also in 45-90. I have never shot anything but black powder in both of these with a 560 grn 20-1 lead bullet from a custom steve brooks mold. I have MVA midrange soule and use the sharps for shooting black powder cartridge rifle silhouette matches. Unbelieveably accurate.

 

[iron brigade]

Has anyone ever tried one the Green Mountain drop-in replacement barrels? I've been told that they truely are a drop-in for the Thompson Center Hawken and are supposed to be more accurate...
Thanks!

i have the .58 cal 32" drop in barrel from gm. it is in a renegade stock and it did drop right in. but also had a .54 gm barrel for a tc hawken that i had to cut some of the under rib off to fit.
the .58 will shoot one holers @ 50 yards with correct patch/lube combo.
i shoot wano [grafs] powder and like it. the gm barrels are worth the money if you can find them. my 12 year old son and i also have several other tc muzzle stuffers that we shoot, all are traditional. either hawken or renegade rifles in .50 and .54 cal. we have a blast at the range. really cool to watch him load and shoot, he is a good lil shot.

 

[CogburnR]

I hunt with an Austin & Halleck Mountain Rifle sidelock percussion.

It may not quite qualify as traditional as it has a "bullet" barrel in 1:28 twist and I shoot saboted 240g Hornady XTP's at 1975fps over 90g 777 and a musket cap . It will put 3 shots inside of a quarter at 100 yards.

I also installed a Williams WRGS peep and front Firesite on it.

 

[HawkeyeFan]

Once I kill a wallhanger with my Omega I plan on going back to traditional. My dream rifle for this would be the Pedersoli Gibbs .72 with a ghost ring sight. It might be a tad out of my price range. Probably will go with Lyman .54 and add an aperture sight. I always wanted to use a smoothbore musket with shot to kill and pheasant in the morning and then a deer with a ball as the sun was going down but sadly the pheasants are pretty scarce around here now a days. I am just glad to know there are still some traditionalists out there.

HawkeyeFan

 

[BillR]

Custom built traditional s and shot competition with them for about 20 years. Then life changed and took me away from them. I still hunt with them and love them dearly but I just don't get much time to shoot them like I did. I hunt with a early style full stock percussion Hawken in .58 cal. Not going to give the load as it will scare most people or should anyway. Longest kill on deer with a round ball is 186 yds offhand. Hit him in the lower neck and knocked off his antlers, Literally. Seems he has been shot before and had been laying up sick prior to me shooting him and it must of loosened up his antlers prior to me shooting him. So full of infection that the Game Commission gave me another tag. I got to keep the antlers though. Cheap inline's ruined the Traditional ML building and as far as I'm concerned ruined the traditional ML hunting seasons. OH well. Its still the most fun you can have with your clothes on I have ever had.

 

[FreeTrapper]

I have always been and will always remain a traditional black powder shooter. Not quite all traditional, but nothing other than patched balls...

I shoot a Lyman GPR in .54, 1-60 twist, 32 in. Bbl. and have good luck using G.I. cotten cleaning patches (4in. cut into 1in. squares for my patches), lubed with vasiline "petroleum jelly"(which after 25 years, still works better than anything else I've used) 110 grains of Pyrodex RS and CCI #11 magnum caps on a hot-shot nipple. 1 MOA @ 100 yards. Made my powder horns from horns obtained through a friend who lived in Nevada, he picked em up out in the desert somewhere! Make our own bags from leather from Tandy.

FIO: I installed a T/C Hunter Peep Sight on the tang of my rifle and it works very, very well. Have to conform the bse to the curvature of the tang, but works like it was made for it.

Got my son his first BP rifle two years ago, a T/C Hawken .50 and made his horn and bag. Great fun and highly recommended. The old flints and percussion style rifles are satisfying to the soul of our kind, always will be. My friends have all abandone theirs in favor of the new in-line rifles... I have nothing against progress if it makes sense, but those new style of "muzzle loader" bear no resemblence to the meaning of the sport in my mind.

 

[mtnwrunner]

Was just kind of going through the muzzleloader categories and came across this one, the traditional one----lets see some of those trad harvests photos from over the years! Or just traditional photos.

Randy

 

[ENCORE]

... I have nothing against progress if it makes sense, but those new style of "muzzle loader" bear no resemblence to the meaning of the sport in my mind.

............... Cheap inline's ruined the Traditional ML building and as far as I'm concerned ruined the traditional ML hunting seasons. OH well. Its still the most fun you can have with your clothes on I have ever had.

First............. I have nothing to say bad about "traditionalists" or traditional muzzleloading. They are the ones who remind us where we came from but, also where we are now. I've shot thousands of round balls and enjoyed every shot.

However, the distaste for the "traditionalist" towards a modern in-line, is merely the repeat of those who were "traditional archers" when the compound came out. The compound hasn't ruined the "traditional archer's" ability to hunt with his/her traditional equipment nor, has the modern in-line ruined the ability of the "traditional muzzleloader's" ability to hunt with their "traditional" firearm. What really amazes me, is that those who shoot a "modern" weapon, don't complain about the traditionalist. Actually they're more inclined to be very inquisitive about traditional rifles, their beauty and functions, and the shooters capabilities, rather building or shooting them.

What the modern muzzleloader has done, is to put more hunters in the field and woods, extended many hunter's opportunity to hunt, boosted the economy and helped to control wildlife numbers in areas with an over population. There's a huge loss of upcoming younger hunters and shooters. A growing number of anti's out there.

Traditionalists, IMO, shouldn't be discrediting the modern muzzleloader or, the seasons which have been created or extended because of them. What they should be doing is teaching, phrasing and encouraging others, regardless of their personal choice of muzzleloader or firearm. Just my opinion......

 

[azsugarbear]

I believe the concern between traditional and modern muzzleloaders is a legitimate one to talk about. I am all for whatever it takes to get people more involved in shooting, hunting, fishing, camping, etc. It's all good, when it comes to exposing more of the public to the "outdoor sports".

However,hunting is by it's very nature, a competitive game. We compete against our quarry. We compete with each other. There have always been inequities in the hunting world: the guy who can afford better equipment; the guy who can afford to hire a guide, the guy who has access to private land; etc. We generally accept this and play the cards we are dealt.

But at some point, we all have to recognize that the inequities have become so great that the playing field needs to be leveled a little bit. That is how we got a muzzleloader season separate from the high-powered rifle season in the first place. Modern, in-line muzzleloaders are a natural evolution....they take it to the next level. But I think it is a valid question to ask if it has not reached a point where the playing field needs to be leveled once again.

Today's modern, in-line muzzleloading rifles have the ability (faster twist barrels) to shoot sabboted rifle bullets. These bullets have better ballistics and perform much better on game than round lead balls. Most have the ability to mount scopes that not only magnify your target, but have BDC stadia to help you compensate for elevation drop. Compare that to open iron sites and Kentucky windage. Their ignition systems are superior and are often protected from the elements. Taking an elk at 250 yds is unheard of with a traditional muzzleloader, but entirely possible with a modern in-line.

As has been pointed out, we have a similar situation with modern compound vs. traditional bows in the archery world. It would be nice if each weapon type could have their own season (Colorado for one, mandates iron sites for their traditional ML season). But in reality, most states do not have the luxury of hosting that many different seasons for each species of animal. Perhaps designation a few hunting units for traditional ML and archery seasons is one answer.

While most of us don't always have good solutions, we can all acknowledge that a problem or inequity exists and start a dialog to find answers. Ignoring the problem because "we don't have a horse in this race" is foolhardy, at best. As I look to the horizon, I can see other clouds gathering. It could be fellow firearm hunters who now feel that LR hunters with their rangefinders and custom guns possess an unfair advantage and want to level their field as well.

In helping others find solutions, we just might be helping ourselves.

 

[Tnwhip]

Was just kind of going through the muzzleloader categories and came across this one, the traditional one----lets see some of those trad harvests photos from over the years! Or just traditional photos.

Randy[/QUOTE

 

[Greyfox]

Being raised in the shotgun only/buckshot Northest in the 60's, the lack of appeal using buckshot quickly pushed me into bowhunting and muzzleloading which could be substituted during the shotgun season as well as their own seasons. It was great during the dedicated season in that I never saw another ML hunter for my first few years of hunting. Took my first, and numerous other deer with a firearm with a 50 csl Hawken I made from a kit using FFG/.490 patched balls. My first was a small 5 pt, but I'll remember the hunt vividly until they stick me in the ground. Capability to 125 yards was long range hunting. I still have that rifle and it still keeps it's shots in a fist sized group 100 yards. Since then I have accumulated and hunted with several long rifles, mostly Virginia style flintlocks in a varsity of calibers, my favorites.

 

[brittany man]

I have inlines but I still hunt with black powder, and cast bullets. Put a green mtn barrel on my TC renegade. 45 cal with a 1-18 twist. Shoot lyman whitworth bullets that I cast myself. Its deadly with 100 grns ff with a felt wad over the powder