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Surprise - surprise - surprise

Erik has done a YouTube short series taking a brand new barrel and shooting 150 or 200rds down it (I don't remember how much for sure) showing basically no velocity change.

He also talks about it during some of his interviews stating he doesn't believe in barrel speed up.
 
Beluebow said:
Your welcome to believe what you want....but I can assure you that isn't the norm.
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I never stated I don't think barrels break in or speed up. I think that every barrel is different.

Erik was brought up earlier so that's what I was discussing.

I've never shot enough of the same ammo down the same barrel to actually test the speed up theory. I don't think many people have done this themselves (Especially if you consider how different lot #'s of brass, bullets, powder, primers or loaded factory rounds. Plus temperature/humidity can change results) it is mostly just something everyone repeats without testing for themselves.

I'm not saying it isn't possible though. Barrels definitely do change around that 100-300 round count (depending on what you shoot and how hard you push it) looking through a borescope.
 
Yeah, that's what I like about Erik, he tests things for himself instead of just following the conventional wisdom.

Benny119 said:
I never stated I don't think barrels break in or speed up. I think that every barrel is different.
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I agree, all barrels are different, rifling, finish quality, etc. So it seems reasonable that what helps a low quality factory barrel may be a complete waste of time for a high end match grade barrel.
 
vavaroutsos said:
Yeah, that's what I like about Erik, he tests things for himself instead of just following the conventional wisdom.



I agree, all barrels are different, rifling, finish quality, etc. So it seems reasonable that what helps a low quality factory barrel may be a complete waste of time for a high end match grade barrel.
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This has been my contention for many years pertaining to the early Barnes X bullets "NOT" fouling my rifle barrel……I have a Match Grade Douglas Supreme barrel. Never had any fouling issues.

When friends and my wife had some fouling problems with the X bullets of the early '90's. …hand lapping the barrel helped a bunch! memtb
 
PBramble said:
And every time you pull the trigger that bullet and heat and pressure don't do anything? Am I supposed to believe that the same barrel that takes bullet swaged into the grooves with a controlled explosion and forced the length of the barrel under high velocity without lubrication is somehow less damaging to a barrel in general? I get that people are worried about their accuracy, but barrels are expendables. You put a new one on. There are guys that shoot way more than I do and at regional and national levels that use this method so I'd say they are on to something. I'm sure Frank will pop up soon to tell us that aluminum cleaning rods have ruined more barrels than shooting them out. And I'm just going to say that I'm shocked with your last statement. So a brush works great if you go with the bore, just not if you spin it faster?
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In case you haven't noticed, bullets and such rush down the barrel being twisted by the rifling that cuts grooves and imparts the spin to stabilize it on it journey to wherever it was pointed when the trigger was pressed. This is by design. Something spinning it's way down the barrel on the end of a cleaning rod running across the rifling is not a basic design feature and not really all that productive since the bristles on the brush will not get into the base of the rifling grooves, where most of the fouling lays because the bristles are climbing up and the falling back into the groove missing the nasty stuff altogether, while wearing away at the sharp edges of the rifling that grips the bullet on it's journey down the barrel. If you don't think that a bronze or stainless brush can erode the rifling because they are made of a softer material than the barrel, think about the Grand Canyon. Water, which is about as soft as it gets dug that trench into the hard rock that comprises the canyon wall.

As for your comment that you have seen people using a brush on a drill to clean their rifle bore, it is very possible that you have observed this. I have been shooting competitively since 1975 or thereabouts, in both NRA and Military high power rifle competition and never in all these years have observed anyone at a match cleaning their rifle using the drill method. I doubt that anyone that is using this method to clean their rifles is anywhere near being a top contender.

As for a rifle barrel being expendable. I guess if you have a lot of money that you just want to waste it changing barrels that might be true. New barrels and their installation is not a cheap proposition. I have only replaced a few over my many years of shooting and none of them were cheap. A quality barrel goes anywhere from $250 for a cheap one to over $750 for a custom made barrel, and that does not include installation. That is a lot of ammo that could be sent down the barrel instead of never being purchased because the money was spent on an expendable new barrel You do things your way, and I will do them mine, however you can rest assured that I will never teach any of my shooting students your method. Good Luck
 
Teri Anne said:
In case you haven't noticed, bullets and such rush down the barrel being twisted by the rifling that cuts grooves and imparts the spin to stabilize it on it journey to wherever it was pointed when the trigger was pressed. This is by design. Something spinning it's way down the barrel on the end of a cleaning rod running across the rifling is not a basic design feature and not really all that productive since the bristles on the brush will not get into the base of the rifling grooves, where most of the fouling lays because the bristles are climbing up and the falling back into the groove missing the nasty stuff altogether, while wearing away at the sharp edges of the rifling that grips the bullet on it's journey down the barrel. If you don't think that a bronze or stainless brush can erode the rifling because they are made of a softer material than the barrel, think about the Grand Canyon. Water, which is about as soft as it gets dug that trench into the hard rock that comprises the canyon wall.

As for your comment that you have seen people using a brush on a drill to clean their rifle bore, it is very possible that you have observed this. I have been shooting competitively since 1975 or thereabouts, in both NRA and Military high power rifle competition and never in all these years have observed anyone at a match cleaning their rifle using the drill method. I doubt that anyone that is using this method to clean their rifles is anywhere near being a top contender.

As for a rifle barrel being expendable. I guess if you have a lot of money that you just want to waste it changing barrels that might be true. New barrels and their installation is not a cheap proposition. I have only replaced a few over my many years of shooting and none of them were cheap. A quality barrel goes anywhere from $250 for a cheap one to over $750 for a custom made barrel, and that does not include installation. That is a lot of ammo that could be sent down the barrel instead of never being purchased because the money was spent on an expendable new barrel You do things your way, and I will do them mine, however you can rest assured that I will never teach any of my shooting students your method. Good Luck
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You've been competitive since 1975 and have never had to rebarrel? Wow, good cleaning regimen.

I'm just going to concede this discussion to you at this point. It's obvious you feel anyone can't have a different opinion than you and your way is the only and right way. As far as observing people using drills and brushes, I've showed you the video, so I don't get why you continue to deny it happens. But then again, even with video proof you've shown that yours is the only way.
 
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Teri Anne said:
If you don't think that a bronze or stainless brush can erode the rifling because they are made of a softer material than the barrel, think about the Grand Canyon. Water, which is about as soft as it gets dug that trench into the hard rock that comprises the canyon wall.
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I do not believe that water alone carved the Grand Canyon. Water carrying abrasive material is the culprit. Kinda like a water jet cutting through steel using sand.

I do however agree that spinning a brush down a barrel isn't the best way to clean a barrel.

I am never worried about a brass brush damaging my barrel. The carbon suspended in the cleaning agent that is attached to the brush can damage a barrel. I don't use more than 10 strokes with a brush before shaking off the brush and rinsing in alcohol. Rinse and repeat.
 
Weaver93 said:
I have a super strict cleaning regiment for all my rifles!

1) Buy all the latest and greatest cleaners and associated products
2) Have MTX rods and chamber guide with jags and brushes
3) Shoot all rifles until barrels look like a stovepipe
4) Invite OCD brother and family down for a weekend of food and shooting

Following these four steps a few times a year has kept all my rifles looking really good!
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Do you think your brother would consider an invite to a BBQ in Wyoming?
 
Ol' Red said:
Do you think your brother would consider an invite to a BBQ in Wyoming?
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Without doubt! Just don't ruin it for me. Be sure to spread rifles surreptitiously around the property with a few random cleaning products. Don't make it too obvious, you may scare him off. Baiting is a tricky proposition!
 
There is more variation in rifle cleaning products and procedures than just about anything I can think of. If I collected high end original rifles, I would be very cautious. Otherwise, the barrel is a consumable component and can be replaced. Obviously given the variety of ways people approach rifle cleaning or lack thereof, I doubt it matters as much as some people think.
 

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