Smokeless Muzzleloader

[Scott E Ames]

Starting load will depend on barrel, shank size, powder chamber and ignition system. All ignition systems are not equal even tho they make look the same.
With a 275-300 grain bullet I use IMR 4198 and H4198. 325-350 grain bullet I use H4895. 350-353 I use IMR7828 SSC.

My Barrel shank is 1.5 inches for the first 6 inches then gradual taper to .86 inches at the muzzle. I have H 4895 on hand but trying to find IMR 7828 SSC here in Oklahoma is like looking for Benchmark and Leprechauns.

 

[buckeye68]

My Barrel shank is 1.5 inches for the first 6 inches then gradual taper to .86 inches at the muzzle. I have H 4895 on hand but trying to find IMR 7828 SSC here in Oklahoma is like looking for Benchmark and Leprechauns.

How much does your gun weigh?
How long is your barrel?
What ignition system are you using?

 

[Scott E Ames]

I think this will answer all of your questions

Blueprinted 700 magnum action with bolt stop. The bolt face diameter is also magnum size with extraction plunger removed and welded
Bartlein premium hand lapped 45 cal barrel 26 inch length, tenon diameter 1.5" X 6" (no taper), then taper to 1" at 8", final taper to .93 " at muzzle
Trigger Tech diamond trigger
Macmillan stock
10 gill muzzle brake
Currently has an Arrowhead ignition system with magnum size modules
weight 13.5#

In the process of changing over to an HIS ignition system

 

[buckeye68]

I think this will answer all of your questions

Blueprinted 700 magnum action with bolt stop. The bolt face diameter is also magnum size with extraction plunger removed and welded
Bartlein premium hand lapped 45 cal barrel 26 inch length, tenon diameter 1.5" X 6" (no taper), then taper to 1" at 8", final taper to .93 " at muzzle
Trigger Tech diamond trigger
Macmillan stock
10 gill muzzle brake
Currently has an Arrowhead ignition system with magnum size modules
weight 13.5#

In the process of changing over to an HIS ignition system

Also what size powder chamber do you have?
Also can you double check the diameter of your barrel. With the size barrel you listed I would think the gun would weigh more than that.

 

[Scott E Ames]

No chamber, rifling all the way to breech plug threads.
Just went down and re-checked and 13.4# on my fishing weight scale. It is an ADL so there is no bottom metal but I don't know if that would make much difference.

 

[buckeye68]

No chamber, rifling all the way to breech plug threads.
Just went down and re-checked and 13.4# on my fishing weight scale. It is an ADL so there is no bottom metal but I don't know if that would make much difference.

Unfortunately with no powder chamber you are every limited on your powder selections. Slower powder is not an option. The higher the powder column in your barrel the more pressure you will build.
I personally would only be comfortable using IMR 4198 or H4895 in your setup.

 

[Ultimatepredator]

I totally agree with buckeye68 , without a powder chamber to help keep pressure lower,H4895 ,IMR 4895 and N530 are as slow as maybe one should go .. the HIS brass modules would work fine on higher pressure loads with a powder chamber but with out a chamber maybe the AB modules are a better choice.., they also act as a pressure relief valve if one were to over pressure a load…I speak from experience on that lol .. totally blackened a couple out doing ladder testing.My RC.45 does not have a chamber and shoot a good dose of H4895 and a 325 aeromax..my 26 lb .45 build on a Bat action and 1.350 straight barrel has a 90 grain powder chamber and shoots a very large dose of H4895 and 325aeromax at 3140's fps..both using HIS ignition and AB modules I also have a very heavy built .40 caliber has a 110 grain powder chamber but use DI ignition to help jump start obturation on a 350 aeromax with large doses of N560 in 3260's
I have 16 lbs of N530 I'm in process very soon to ladder test and start testing for next Kentucky challenge shoot..,
H4198 ,benchmark.H322, are super powder with 275,300 grain bullets but the 4895 SBC other ones listed above I feel will give better velocity,then the faster burning ..

 

[Scott E Ames]

Thanks to both you for sharing your knowledge. I will start on some light loads with the 300 grain Aero max that I have and my H4895. Does 75 grains sound like a good starting place or should I scale up or down with a setup like mine? Waiting on my HIS ignition before beginning.

 

[ENCORE]

Well, I don't know about that, but the senior partner Clare Ward would be able to answer all of your questions. Email him at: [email protected]
I would think he would be interested in these new SML's when he sees that are very capable out to 1k yards. I do not know of any rules against them at MTC. They do have several organizations that hold matches there, I do not know what the arrangements are, but if you contact him I am sure he will be happy to let you know what needs to happen.

Just to catch up.............

I've been in contact with Clare, who seems like a really great person. It appears that they are very willing to host a SML match at the MTC. There's a lot of work ahead but, I'm going to make an attempt to get a match going for 2023. I've put the word out on a couple sites and there is a lot of interest in a LONG RANGE match. I think there's 10 who have committed to attend (baring any other issues). If say 20 shooters would show, it would be outstanding! I hope it would also benefit the MTC too.

I know its not easy setting something like this up and that there will be some who will complain about the rules. Most SML shooters are bench shooters. Having to shoot prone will deter some but, that would be their loss. There are no NRA or NMLRA rules set for the use of smokeless muzzleloaders, yet. If it gets organized, I would suggest it will be very similar to current black powder rules, if not identical.
I know some guys have rifles that have very wide forearms and don't use a bipod. That issue could be totally eliminated by allowing a front rest. Not a full length rest. Front rest, bipod and rear bag only.

We'll see if I can work this out. No promises. I think they have my left lower lung reinflated now and I have a knee replacement on July 28th. I want to drive down on a weekend and hopefully talk to Clare and some others. I'll need help...........

 

[Dragoon300]

Just to catch up.............

I've been in contact with Clare, who seems like a really great person. It appears that they are very willing to host a SML match at the MTC. There's a lot of work ahead but, I'm going to make an attempt to get a match going for 2023. I've put the word out on a couple sites and there is a lot of interest in a LONG RANGE match. I think there's 10 who have committed to attend (baring any other issues). If say 20 shooters would show, it would be outstanding! I hope it would also benefit the MTC too.

I know its not easy setting something like this up and that there will be some who will complain about the rules. Most SML shooters are bench shooters. Having to shoot prone will deter some but, that would be their loss. There are no NRA or NMLRA rules set for the use of smokeless muzzleloaders, yet. If it gets organized, I would suggest it will be very similar to current black powder rules, if not identical.
I know some guys have rifles that have very wide forearms and don't use a bipod. That issue could be totally eliminated by allowing a front rest. Not a full length rest. Front rest, bipod and rear bag only.

We'll see if I can work this out. No promises. I think they have my left lower lung reinflated now and I have a knee replacement on July 28th. I want to drive down on a weekend and hopefully talk to Clare and some others. I'll need help...........

Let me know when you want meet with Clare, I may be able to go with you and help out, I know him very well, he is a great guy.

 

[cb186]

Thanks to both you for sharing your knowledge. I will start on some light loads with the 300 grain Aero max that I have and my H4895. Does 75 grains sound like a good starting place or should I scale up or down with a setup like mine? Waiting on my HIS ignition before beginning.

75gr is low. Might as well shoot 4195 at that pressure range. Guys are running up to 105gr of H4895 with 300-325gr bullets. I run 99gr of H4895 with 300gr Arrowhead xlds @3025.

 

[BLASERMAN]

I am having mine built using 4198 275 gr pitman
By Shultz Precision

 

[ENCORE]

Nice day, wife had things she wanted to do so.. I jumped in the Slingshot and road over to the MTC. They were just finishing up the end of day F-class relay. I was able talk to Rex some and what we do know now is, the SML shooters WOULD NOT shoot with the F-class shooters. F-class does not allow muzzle brakes and would not appreciate the SML brakes.
So pretty much the SML shooters would have to pay for the range day. We would also be manning the pits, so radios would be required.
Still plenty to find out.........

 

[sika64]

Anyone wanting a custom build with Mack Brothers action and McMillan stock at a much better price then the big names you can pm me and I'll get you the info.